PG Bulls Lose but Rose looked good.

[burlydee]

Doug McDermott is having a lot of trouble getting his shot off. Thats not good.

Do we have to run set plays for him to get him open or what do people think? Is it too soon to be doing that?

I don't think its too early to have some concern about Doug. I wasn't one of his biggest advocates from the get-go, but neither a hater, I have an entirely open mind about him, entirely ready to give him the starting job as soon as he shows more than Mike.

But so far, athletically he looks really slow and limited. As far as being a create your own shot skill player of the type we need, even in a small capacity. At least Mirotic has shown the tools to make plays on his own, even if his stats aren't great right now. You see the potential and capacity is there for it. With Doug, I don't see that yet, beyond catching and shooting open jumpers, and even having trouble getting space for those.

I've seen Doug struggle on the break to finish over defenders and struggle to get his shot off in 1v1.

Some people are assuming because he did other things in college he can/will do them in the NBA and its Thibs fault for not letting him. That's definitely the optimism side take right now.

He has a long way to go to even fill the type of role Kyle had for us right now.

Mostly we hear about how early it is and that's true, but you just watch him now and wonder if the athletic tools / ball-handling, are there to do more and its not really a matter of experience solving it.

I do think the optimist have bought into their own hype as it comes to Dougie. Having said that, I'm also believe that the Bulls aren't getting the ball to McDermott in a place where he can score. McDermott is a post up 3, like Adrian Dantley and Mark Aguiree way back in the day. He needs the ball on the post. In fact, the bulls should be posting up on like 90% of their non-Rose possessions. Gasol, Noah, Butler, McDermott - all these guys have a size advantage on the block against the guys who are usually guarding them. I'd like to see the Bulls incorporate less motion and running off screens and more just post up basketball. Throw it in the post, make the other team double and kick it out or take advantage of your size on the block. The bulls haven't been doing enough of this lately.

[Hangtime84]

Doug doesn't use enough fakes or hesitAtion moves around the basket

[RememberLu]

I've seen a few people criticize Thibs for not running more plays to get shooters open on the perimeter, I think a lot of the success of this season was premised on the idea that we have shooters now to hit 3's. If some guys aren't getting enough touches (Doug) in the offense or can't get open/get their shot off (Doug), then do you think it's worth it for Thibs to make a few adjustments and run more plays designed to get guys open looks?

I'm a little concerned that a lot of our 3pt production has thus far been from guys like Kirk and Rose, which I don't see as sustainable, or from a guy like Dunleavy that was already here last year anyway.

We need to get guys like Doug, Mirotic and even Snell to start hitting those 3's.

[Jvaughn]

"Love was a bit of an afterthought on offense last night, but he still rebounded like a monster, which they're going to need for him to compensate for their defense, which I expect to end up above average but not great." Like a monster?! Not in the game I watched...most were easy off of free throws or with nobody on him....just like he did in Minnesota! Chicago's going to drive him nuts because they stay home on his 3-pt shot and he's too slow to drive to the basket...and when/if he gets there he plays below the rim, which is tough against taller/ longer players.

I really don't know what you're talking about. Love did a great job keeping Noah off the offensive glass. He's a big reason why they had a big rebounding edge. There were a lot of times when you could see Noah was trying to get around Love for the tip in but he just did a great job holding position.

He said he rebounded like a monster. Meaning he did well on the glass.

[aaqubed]

"Love was a bit of an afterthought on offense last night, but he still rebounded like a monster, which they're going to need for him to compensate for their defense, which I expect to end up above average but not great." Like a monster?! Not in the game I watched...most were easy off of free throws or with nobody on him....just like he did in Minnesota! Chicago's going to drive him nuts because they stay home on his 3-pt shot and he's too slow to drive to the basket...and when/if he gets there he plays below the rim, which is tough against taller/ longer players.

I really don't know what you're talking about. Love did a great job keeping Noah off the offensive glass. He's a big reason why they had a big rebounding edge. There were a lot of times when you could see Noah was trying to get around Love for the tip in but he just did a great job holding position.

He said he rebounded like a monster. Meaning he did well on the glass.

That part was in quotes. He then said, (and I'm adding the quotes here) "Like a monster?! Not in the game I watched..." That's what I was responding to.

[Jvaughn]

I really don't know what you're talking about. Love did a great job keeping Noah off the offensive glass. He's a big reason why they had a big rebounding edge. There were a lot of times when you could see Noah was trying to get around Love for the tip in but he just did a great job holding position.

He said he rebounded like a monster. Meaning he did well on the glass.

That part was in quotes. He then said, (and I'm adding the quotes here) "Like a monster?! Not in the game I watched..." That's what I was responding to.

I see. That original paragraph was kind of confusing. Sounded like he was complimenting him at first.

[improper]

Waiters on Butler is a huge mismatch. I'm confident rolling with Butler against a 6'4 undersized SG on the block.

I'd temper my expectations there if I were you. Waiters may be a bit undersized, but he's very strong and, thus, very difficult to back down in post up situations.

It's not just the strength, it's also the height portion along with the fact that he has become pretty adept down there. Gets deep position, and forces the defense to rotate. I'm not suggesting we run our entire offense down there, just enough to keep the defense honest. There is no way we should allow Cleveland the ability to hide Kyrie on defense so he can go balls out on offense.

Height certainly plays a part in it, but I've seen numerous taller guys, including Joe Johnson, try to back down Waiters and fail at it. I'm not saying he's an elite defender. He's not. He is probably a little above average with the potential to be good. I am saying that he is very hard to back down because he is strong and has pretty good length.

[evilhoban]

He said he rebounded like a monster. Meaning he did well on the glass.

That part was in quotes. He then said, (and I'm adding the quotes here) "Like a monster?! Not in the game I watched..." That's what I was responding to.

I see. That original paragraph was kind of confusing. Sounded like he was complimenting him at first.

Trust me...after watching Kevin Love play in Minnesota (where I live) for the last few years, complimenting Love is not in my wheel house. I'm definitely a Kevin Love hater...and I have watched him a lot more than Cavs fans. I was against the Bulls dealing for him this summer...and I just have an issue with anybody watching that game and thinking that Love was a monster at anything besides looking like a lost little puppy dog and badly missing 3 point shots...and I fail to see how he did such a great job on Noah when Noah barely played.

[kyrv]

That part was in quotes. He then said, (and I'm adding the quotes here) "Like a monster?! Not in the game I watched..." That's what I was responding to.

I see. That original paragraph was kind of confusing. Sounded like he was complimenting him at first.

Trust me...after watching Kevin Love play in Minnesota (where I live) for the last few years, complimenting Love is not in my wheel house. I'm definitely a Kevin Love hater...and I have watched him a lot more than Cavs fans. I was against the Bulls dealing for him this summer...and I just have an issue with anybody watching that game and thinking that Love was a monster at anything besides looking like a lost little puppy dog and badly missing 3 point shots...and I fail to see how he did such a great job on Noah when Noah barely played.

Wow. Do tell. But I like what I'm seeing so far.

In our Love v Melo threads we had a lot of Love but nobody from his team that watched him all the time.

[RebuildaBulls]

I hope the Bulls sit the starters and give Snell, Doug and Nikola 40 minutes each next game. And play Bairstow and Moore for Godsakes!

[MrSparkle]

Once McDermott starts hitting his 3's at his potential, and the team gets used to his game, it'll be a different story. Folks did drink the summer league koolade, thinking he's "rich man's Korver" without ever seeing him in an NBA game...

But that's OK. I still think he has a high ceiling. He's been moving well, off the ball. He's been making some defensive errors, but we can all assume that Thibs is focusing 100% on McDermott's defense, and that's why we're seeing more bricks than we'd like to see. Once he eases into the role, he's gonna be torching it. I can't wait to see Mirotic, McD and Dunleavy in late-season form -- we're going to have GREAT SPACING.

I don't think we'll see McDermott creating any plays like Klay or Ray Allen (premier shooters/SGs), but I know he'll be more capable of taking a jumpshot off the dribble than any of other other guys (besides Rose and Mirotic).

[panthermark]

I don't think its too early to have some concern about Doug. I wasn't one of his biggest advocates from the get-go, but neither a hater, I have an entirely open mind about him, entirely ready to give him the starting job as soon as he shows more than Mike.

But so far, athletically he looks really slow and limited. As far as being a create your own shot skill player of the type we need, even in a small capacity. At least Mirotic has shown the tools to make plays on his own, even if his stats aren't great right now. You see the potential and capacity is there for it. With Doug, I don't see that yet, beyond catching and shooting open jumpers, and even having trouble getting space for those.

I've seen Doug struggle on the break to finish over defenders and struggle to get his shot off in 1v1.

Some people are assuming because he did other things in college he can/will do them in the NBA and its Thibs fault for not letting him. That's definitely the optimism side take right now.

He has a long way to go to even fill the type of role Kyle had for us right now.

Mostly we hear about how early it is and that's true, but you just watch him now and wonder if the athletic tools / ball-handling, are there to do more and its not really a matter of experience solving it.

I agree with that....but luckily I'm not too disappointed...mostly because I always said he was a rookie...and most rookies struggle. We are only a few games into the pre-season, so I'm sure he will get better. But I'm also sure there are a couple of posters out there who are probably disappointed that he isn't already dropping 15ppg, especially after summer league (for both him and Snell).

Let this (again) be a lesson. Summer League means nothing.

[blumeany]

I'm noticing a trend with teams defending the Bulls. They aggressively double the shooter. That's it. That's why a guy like McDermott is going to have trouble getting a shot off. Until the rest of the team can prove the can score with the ball, there's no reason to cover them. Gasol will rarely take an outside shot. Noah can't really shoot. Butler and Rose are erratic with their shots - not known to knock them down reliably. So, if there's a Snell, or Mirotic, or Dunleavy, or McDermott on the floor, the other team immediately sends two guys to them when they get the ball. Which usually leads to someone taking a forced shot with little time on the clock, or a turnover.

[chifan1798]

For anyone wanting to see the game again, they are replaying it at 10 CST on NBATV tonight

[MrSparkle]

I'm noticing a trend with teams defending the Bulls. They aggressively double the shooter. That's it. That's why a guy like McDermott is going to have trouble getting a shot off. Until the rest of the team can prove the can score with the ball, there's no reason to cover them. Gasol will rarely take an outside shot. Noah can't really shoot. Butler and Rose are erratic with their shots - not known to knock them down reliably. So, if there's a Snell, or Mirotic, or Dunleavy, or McDermott on the floor, the other team immediately sends two guys to them when they get the ball. Which usually leads to someone taking a forced shot with little time on the clock, or a turnover.

Good observation...

It's true ; Rose was getting SMOTHERED in the 2011 playoffs, it was hard to watch the 1-on-5 basketball. It wasn't Rose's fault, nobody else could hit a jumpshot to save their life (and Korver was seeing just as much attention).

It's no secret you need 5 offense weapons to win a title.