Trade Thread 2.0

Bulls03 · Post #101 » by **Bulls03** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 8:27 am

Can't lie that KCP for Niko rumor sounds really good right now. I will say I would only do it if we could package Grant or someone for Casspi though in a 3 team trade. KCP is averaging 15 PPG and shooting 39% on 3s with 5 attempts per game and can bring some defense. That would give us a 2nd unit of:

MCW
KCP
Doug
Casspi
Portis/Felicio

Hopefully we would stagger Taj and Lopez to have them play most of the minutes at center though.

realEAST · Post #102 » by **realEAST** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 12:03 pm

Just a question with trade season approaching mercilessly - how do you see and rate Bulls players: who are untouchables, who can be moved and what is their worth.

I'd say beyond Jimmy (and Wade) everybody is available, and to lesser extent Lopez and Gibson (parts of a bigger deal) although nobody has any really high trade value - either young and not proven, unimpressive or expiring.

We can bank mostly on young guys potential alobg with our pick, but I think we have at least pair them up (plus the pick) to have a shot at any real return.

Personally, I'd like to go after PG upgrade (Collison later in season maybe, or Exum if available) and backup big (Whitey, Mejiri, or ambitiously, WCS or even Okafor.)

As for Noel, dont think he is good target unless we can move Lopez for value. WCS is ideal here because he has a 2 yrs more on rookie deal.

kodo · Post #103 » by **kodo** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 5:41 pm

realEAST wrote:Just a question with trade season approaching mercilessly - how do you see and rate Bulls players: who are untouchables, who can be moved and what is their worth.

Jimmy - untouchable
Wade - politically untouchable, too much of a leader. Would destroy our rep to trade him when he came here specifically to be with family and his hometown. Would set our FA rep back to the dark ages when we broke up the MJ Bulls

Taj - only tradeable for a star. He's finally started and been outstanding, and he establishes the kind of culture we need. And we need vets, the kids are falling apart when real pressure gets applied to them. Also close with Jimmy I believe. Butler said when Wade talks were on, one of the few Bulls he consulted with whether this could work was Taj. Also worked out together in LA.

Everyone else is an asset we should leverage. Doug is probably someone I'd rather keep than not just because we so desperately need reliable 3P shooting and quality play from the bench, Doug provides both.

jc23 · Post #104 » by **jc23** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 6:26 pm

which one of these tank teams are good trade partners to improve our big man issue?

Bulls03 · Post #105 » by **Bulls03** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 6:32 pm

jc23 wrote:which one of these tank teams are good trade partners to improve our big man issue?

The Sixers if they're willing to move Noel or okafor. Niko would be involved and then we can try and come up with a trade for Casspi to replace Niko.

BullsInBuffalo · Post #106 » by **BullsInBuffalo** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 6:58 pm

Mirotic and portis for Noel and filler.

Who says no?

Post #107 » by **Payt10** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 7:05 pm

BullsInBuffalo wrote:Mirotic and portis for Noel and filler.

Who says no?

Philly. They want to get rid of Noel to free themselves of a logjam at PF/C. Adding two more PF's doesn't make a whole lot of sense for them.

I would do a Mirotic for Noel swap if they were interested, but they already have a better version of Mirotic in Illyasova.

YettiBull · Post #108 » by **YettiBull** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 7:07 pm

I doubt we get anyone from the Clippers. The best bet IMO is to work a package for DeMarcus.

Post #109 » by **Payt10** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 7:17 pm

Maybe we can convince Brooklyn to trade RHJ for Grant or Portis/Felicio?

I'm still on the trade for WCS bandwagon, too. He's the perfect buy low candidate that would be worth taking a chance on.

Mech Engineer · Post #110 » by **Mech Engineer** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 8:44 pm

Interesting quote from Zach Lowe

Wings don't come cheap; the Bucks surrendered a former Rookie of the Year to snag Tony freaking Snell

Think of this when you are ready to dump Jimmy for some draft pick(s).

Post #111 » by **GimmeDat** » Thu Dec 1, 2016 11:26 pm

Mech Engineer wrote:Interesting quote from Zach Lowe

Wings don't come cheap; the Bucks surrendered a former Rookie of the Year to snag Tony freaking Snell

Think of this when you are ready to dump Jimmy for some draft pick(s).

I think that quote's a bit disingenuous - at the time of the trade everyone knew MCW's value was nuked relative to the end of his rookie year. It was a trash for trash trade and everyone knew it.

Mech Engineer · Post #112 » by **Mech Engineer** » Fri Dec 2, 2016 11:56 pm

GimmeDat wrote:
Mech Engineer wrote:Interesting quote from Zach Lowe

Wings don't come cheap; the Bucks surrendered a former Rookie of the Year to snag Tony freaking Snell

Think of this when you are ready to dump Jimmy for some draft pick(s).

I think that quote's a bit disingenuous - at the time of the trade everyone knew MCW's value was nuked relative to the end of his rookie year. It was a trash for trash trade and everyone knew it.

The point is a rookie of the year and a lottery pick will have a lot of residual value compared to a bust from day 1/late pick which was Snell. MCW was a relative bust compared to a good pick but he had done some real things in the league unlike Snell. That has value.

Think of this way... if MCW was a Snell type wing, his value would be much higher with a similar achievement record.

MC3 · Post #113 » by **MC3** » Sat Dec 3, 2016 12:05 am

For MCW I am pretty sure he can be somebody in this league. Snell not so much.

Post #114 » by **GimmeDat** » Sat Dec 3, 2016 12:13 am

Mech Engineer wrote:
GimmeDat wrote:
Mech Engineer wrote:Interesting quote from Zach Lowe

Think of this when you are ready to dump Jimmy for some draft pick(s).

I think that quote's a bit disingenuous - at the time of the trade everyone knew MCW's value was nuked relative to the end of his rookie year. It was a trash for trash trade and everyone knew it.

The point is a rookie of the year and a lottery pick will have a lot of residual value compared to a bust from day 1/late pick which was Snell. MCW was a relative bust compared to a good pick but he had done some real things in the league unlike Snell. That has value.

Think of this way... if MCW was a Snell type wing, his value would be much higher with a similar achievement record.

I don't think his past achievements have any bearing on his current value, no matter his position, though. There was no residual value, especially considering he's already 25. The reputation of MCW at the time of the trade was a hollow stat stuffer with a hollow ROY award due to role/minutes, who isn't actually a player that contributes to winning basketball all that much.

The Philly trade of MCW held residual value - they got the LA pick out of it at the peak of MCW's value (what a steal that was by Hinkie), but by the point of our trade with the Bucks, I think the story-line to come out of that trade isn't so much to do with 'wow, look at the premium of Snell's position/skill-set' but rather 'wow, look how far MCW's value has plummeted that they're willing to trade him for Tony Snell'.

Leslie Forman · Post #115 » by **Leslie Forman** » Sat Dec 3, 2016 7:03 pm

Mech Engineer wrote:MCW was a relative bust compared to a good pick but he had done some real things in the league

Like what?

In terms of usefulness as an actual NBA player on the floor, you could easily argue that Snell in his second season was a better player than MCW ever has been. He was actually a reasonably useful bench player. MCW has basically been a flat out terribad player, starting or off the bench, his entire career.

Post #116 » by **GimmeDat** » Sat Dec 3, 2016 10:48 pm

Niko+Grant for Payne?

OKC need shooting and have a really weak PF rotation, and Grant would take over the backup PG duties and reunite with Jerami in their 2nd unit.

Niko for WCS+Casspi?

Maybe we'd end up having to add a pick or something, but this would overhaul our big rotation.

Bulls03 · Post #117 » by **Bulls03** » Sun Dec 4, 2016 1:06 am

GimmeDat wrote:Niko+Grant for Payne?

OKC need shooting and have a really weak PF rotation, and Grant would take over the backup PG duties and reunite with Jerami in their 2nd unit.

Niko for WCS+Casspi?

Maybe we'd end up having to add a pick or something, but this would overhaul our big rotation.

Cameron Payne? Heck no. But apparently the Kings wanted to trade Gay for him before his injury so I would do a 3 team and send Payne to the Kings and Gay to us.

The 2nd trade is really tempting.

Post #118 » by **GimmeDat** » Sun Dec 4, 2016 2:42 am

Asked for Niko offers on the trade board, it does seem like a tough market for him but this is a trade that might be worth thinking about -

Mirotic/Valentine for Noel/Holmes/Thompson.

Obviously, you'd have to be willing to pay for Noel, but with that assumed, I think it might be one of the more value-upside deals available. Holmes is really good as well. I'd probably say swap Thompson for an SG, though (Stauskas/Luwawu/Korkmaz).

Leslie Forman · Post #119 » by **Leslie Forman** » Sun Dec 4, 2016 3:47 am

With Saric on the team now and Simmons coming back soon I don't see any reason why Philly would ever want Mirotic. It makes absolutely no sense for them.

Something like Casspi straight up makes sense for both teams IMO.

Bulls03 · Post #120 » by **Bulls03** » Sun Dec 4, 2016 3:55 am

GimmeDat wrote:Asked for Niko offers on the trade board, it does seem like a tough market for him but this is a trade that might be worth thinking about -

Mirotic/Valentine for Noel/Holmes/Thompson.

Obviously, you'd have to be willing to pay for Noel, but with that assumed, I think it might be one of the more value-upside deals available. Holmes is really good as well. I'd probably say swap Thompson for an SG, though (Stauskas/Luwawu/Korkmaz).

I would do this in a heartbeat and not even think twice about it.