Offseason thread - Hunter Morris Traded to Pitt

[trwi7]

Pretty good summation of the Brewers.

Today's Dilbert sums up how the Brewer's front office works sometimes, especially the fourth and fifth panels.

[DanoMac]

Taking this idea from BF.net, but something I would think long and hard about would be trading Gomez. His values at an all time high, and could probably fetch a pretty nice return.

[Kerb Hohl]

Taking this idea from BF.net, but something I would think long and hard about would be trading Gomez. His values at an all time high, and could probably fetch a pretty nice return.

I would probably do this. Especially if considering a rebuild.

[humanrefutation]

I'd be disinclined to deal Gomez as he has two years left and is absurdly cheap.

[Kerb Hohl]

I'd be disinclined to deal Gomez as he has two years left and is absurdly cheap.

What good does that do if you don't think you are going to be competitive? That adds to his value in a trade.

I do think they can win with this core (moderately) but I wouldn't put much money on that. If they keep him, I'm fine with it.

However, I wouldn't mind selling at the highest possible point probably on a guy with decent power, poor plate discipline, and speed-based to get on base and in the field. That seems like a guy that won't be too valuable when he hits 31 or 32 years old. Of course, right before that iss when his contract ends, but I'd rather get a super haul for him.

[coolhandluke121]

My problem with trading Gomez or Lucroy is that their value is unlikely to go down next season, and the Brewers still have a legitimate opportunity to contend. I've always wanted to trade veterans when you have a chance to get value for them, but that's been because I sensed that they were about to decline and because their salaries were going way up. Not the case for either of those two superstars. There's just no urgency to trade them now.

If anything, I would trade guys like Davis or Scooter; they're under team control for ~5 years, but it's gonna be ~5 very lean years anyway so I place a premium on using them to make significant improvements (especially on defense) next year and take one last crack at it. What kind of future would we save them for anyway? This year's draft picks and the younger prospects are the next wave of possible core talent, not Scooter and Davis.

I saw on ESPN that MLBtraderumors is suggesting Laroche might be a trade target for the Brewers. I badly wanted to trade Hart and sign him in 2012, and was super-pissed when I saw how little Washington got him for. Imagine how much better the team would have been the last few years; he's exactly what they needed. He's older now, but I'd still love to see that mutual option happen and then trade for him. He perfectly fits the "one last chance" philosophy of next year's squad.

[humanrefutation]

I'd be disinclined to deal Gomez as he has two years left and is absurdly cheap.

What good does that do if you don't think you are going to be competitive? That adds to his value in a trade.

I do think they can win with this core (moderately) but I wouldn't put much money on that. If they keep him, I'm fine with it.

However, I wouldn't mind selling at the highest possible point probably on a guy with decent power, poor plate discipline, and speed-based to get on base and in the field. That seems like a guy that won't be too valuable when he hits 31 or 32 years old. Of course, right before that iss when his contract ends, but I'd rather get a super haul for him.

What makes you think the Brewers aren't going to be competitive? They just spent 5 months in first place in their division, and Attanasio has shown no willingness to rebuild thus far.

[jr lucosa]

If we were willing to do a complete rebuild I'd be open to trading Gomez if we got a great haul back, but unless all the vet starters are getting traded too and we try and move Braun etc, I'd just hold on to him.

[Kerb Hohl]

What makes you think the Brewers aren't going to be competitive? They just spent 5 months in first place in their division, and Attanasio has shown no willingness to rebuild thus far.

I'm torn on it and I definitely respect/agree with the opinion to just go for it again for another year, because the roster is constructed for it. I've been the one saying that we should go for it the past few years and hope that the minor league talent backfills. I thought we had a competitive roster a few times.

On one hand, this may be the last time before the Cubs really are a force and the Pirates can still improve.

Here are my reasons to rebuild right now:
1. Votto will be back.
2. The Pirates will likely be better.
3. The Cards are the Cards and won't lose Molina for half the season.
4. The Cubs will compete for a Wild Card/darkhorse for the division. They could be the favorite if they splurge on pitching.
5. We may never see 5 months from Scooter like that again (really just that insane month).
6. We may never see 5 months from LuCroy like that again.
7. We had minimal injuries.
8. Keeping Gallardo is "worth it" given that we can't replace his $13 million and it is "market value" but I am not confident he'll improve.
9. We have a decent array of bullpen arms but a manager that doesn't know when to utilize them in a game.
10. We had relatively good health last year save for Braun.
11. Aramis is also worth keeping probably, but he is getting old.
12. While I'd also put this on my "why we should go for it" list in that Braun could go back to being a superstar if healthy, there is also the downside that he won't be healthy all season.

Now, there are many reasons I'd also think about going for it. Namely that we have a lot of guys that have 1 year left that are reasonably valuable that aren't majorly worth trading/releasing now. Braun and Segura will probably be better.

I'm just thinking about getting out in front of this thing. Maybe trade Gomez to somebody for a massive haul of pitchers. Like one guy that can be an ace and another player or two that project to be good. He has 2 really cheap years left and is in his prime so we should be able to get a haul.

[coolhandluke121]

What makes you think the Brewers aren't going to be competitive? They just spent 5 months in first place in their division, and Attanasio has shown no willingness to rebuild thus far.

I'm torn on it and I definitely respect/agree with the opinion to just go for it again for another year, because the roster is constructed for it. I've been the one saying that we should go for it the past few years and hope that the minor league talent backfills. I thought we had a competitive roster a few times.

On one hand, this may be the last time before the Cubs really are a force and the Pirates can still improve.

Here are my reasons to rebuild right now:
1. Votto will be back.
2. The Pirates will likely be better.
3. The Cards are the Cards and won't lose Molina for half the season.
4. The Cubs will compete for a Wild Card/darkhorse for the division. They could be the favorite if they splurge on pitching.
5. We may never see 5 months from Scooter like that again (really just that insane month).
6. We may never see 5 months from LuCroy like that again.
7. We had minimal injuries.
8. Keeping Gallardo is "worth it" given that we can't replace his $13 million and it is "market value" but I am not confident he'll improve.
9. We have a decent array of bullpen arms but a manager that doesn't know when to utilize them in a game.
10. We had relatively good health last year save for Braun.
11. Aramis is also worth keeping probably, but he is getting old.
12. While I'd also put this on my "why we should go for it" list in that Braun could go back to being a superstar if healthy, there is also the downside that he won't be healthy all season.

Now, there are many reasons I'd also think about going for it. Namely that we have a lot of guys that have 1 year left that are reasonably valuable that aren't majorly worth trading/releasing now. Braun and Segura will probably be better.

I'm just thinking about getting out in front of this thing. Maybe trade Gomez to somebody for a massive haul of pitchers. Like one guy that can be an ace and another player or two that project to be good. He has 2 really cheap years left and is in his prime so we should be able to get a haul.

I've considered all those things, and I'm usually the one arguing those things more than anyone. But I just feel like there are very few guys they have should trade right now. I think Gomez and Lucroy have a ton of value, but most of the other guys in the last year of their contract as just going to fetch organizational depth. Since Lucroy and Gomez will probably hold their trade value, it doesn't have the usual urgency.

I don't think any of the Central rivals will be elite. Talent-wise, their fans could just as easily be talking about the Brewers as a team you better not underestimate. That's a wash to me.

Finally, don't dismiss the possibility of making upgrades to keep up with the projected improvement of our rivals. My idea of trading Davis, Scooter, or Nelson could be a boon to next year's chances. It would hurt the talent base for 5 years, but those 5 years are going to be terrible anyway. Those guys could turn into the equivalent of Jenkins, Vina, and Eldred; just decent guys wasting away on a crap team.

[Kerb Hohl]

Woah, Friedman to the Dodgers. Maybe we can finally revisit the Theo/Cubs thread as "Friedman with money." Good hire but I don't know what else he can do there other than crunch the numbers a little bit more on some of their signings/roster makeup.

[DanoMac]

I agree, Gomez and Lucroy are cheap and their value (if they stay healthy) probably wouldn't decline much.

Gomez has hot streaks. He'll have a month or two where he's on fire (beginning of season), and a month or two where's cold, swings at ****, and makes costly baserunning decisions.

His WAR has been great the past 2 years, but again, hot streaks. When the guy's hot, he's HOT. When he's cold, he's ice cold.

I'm not actively saying "let's go out and shop Gomez around", but if a team called and offered us a great pitching prospect and position player prospect, I'm thinking long and hard about it.

If you're going to capitalize on him via trade, you need to do it by the deadline of this upcoming season. After 2015, with 1 year left on his current deal, his value will go down due to the large contract he'll be commanding after 2016.

[DanoMac]

k the Brewers aren't going to be competitive? They just spent 5 months in first place in their division, and Attanasio has shown no willingness to rebuild thus far.

At the end of the day, you are what your record says you are. We're a .500 ball club. The staff pitched out of their minds the first couple months. The bullpen was best in the league up until the All-Star break. Everyone was hitting on all cylinders.

I don't want to call it a fluke, but all 3 departments were performing incredibly at once. We were bound to come back down to earth. Maybe not as quickly and drastically as we did, but still.

Trade Lohse. Trade A-Ram if he picks up his option. I'd also see what kind of return Gallardo could fetch. And agree with coolhandluke, see what the market is like for Scooter.

Not that I think this will happen, obviously, with RRR coming back. But that's what I'd like to see.

[PANDEMONEUM]

only 6 games back from getting the Wild Card spot
id like to sign a few guys to try and make a run next season

1. a 1B better than Overbay, that can also play some 3B, at least at Reynolds level and keep Reynolds
2. a SS/2B guy, at the level of Segura/Gennett, then we can rotate the 3
3. improve on the weakest part of the bullpen

if we can make those moves before the season starts, yes difficult,
but that really improves our team
we can see how the season progresses, and then make decisions before the trade deadline

davis, gomez, braun, parra
having Parra for a full season will help
braun injured less and improved #s will help

aramis, segura, scooter, reynolds, 1B/3B, SS/2B
should b able to find at least 1 player thats better than overbay, and that will help

*
i feel, that if we are going for a rebuild,
that Braun and our SPs should be moved (not Peralta)
and that we can get top prospects or at least, a bunch of hopefuls

[trwi7]

only 6 games back from getting the Wild Card spot

Only 9 games back of last place too. That has to be a consideration of where we are as a franchise.

[jr lucosa]

9-17 in the final month of the season, 31-48 in our last 79 games, 62-72 in our last 134. Getting so far out in front during that hot first month helped but we were a below average team for a majority of the season.

[blazza18]

I think they're going to throw all their eggs into the "Braun is now healthy basket" and look to push for a playoff berth again. At least for next season anyway.

If it were up to me, I'd look to trade Braun as soon as he showed any signs of him being the hitter he's suppose to be.

[DanoMac]

One thing that's bothered me (PANDEMONIUM kinda did it) is people lumping in Segura with Gennett, or wanting a platoon with Segura, or hell, some people even thinking Segura is done.

Call me crazy, but I still have a ton of hope for the kid and still think he has star potential. He had about as rough a year as anyone can have, and I definitely give him a break because of that. Defensively, he's a monster.

In the AFL 2 years ago he was raking. During the 2013 season he was raking. He'll come back around (maybe not the .310-.320 he was hitting) but I have faith he'll be a .280-.300 guy

[Siefer]

One thing that's bothered me (PANDEMONIUM kinda did it) is people lumping in Segura with Gennett, or wanting a platoon with Segura, or hell, some people even thinking Segura is done.

Call me crazy, but I still have a ton of hope for the kid and still think he has star potential. He had about as rough a year as anyone can have, and I definitely give him a break because of that. Defensively, he's a monster.

In the AFL 2 years ago he was raking. During the 2013 season he was raking. He'll come back around (maybe not the .310-.320 he was hitting) but I have faith he'll be a .280-.300 guy

I like Segura, but he's got huge flaws in his plate approach that are going to put a hard cap on his upside. Normally I'd say a BABIP of .275 is unlucky, but Segura just has no clue what to swing at, and it resulted in an incredible number of weak grounders to second and short. The only thing that kept that BABIP number from being even lower was his great speed.

Unless he dramatically improves his approach at the plate, he's going to max out as a .700 OPS guy. Now, a .700 OPS shortstop with elite defense is still a plus WAR player, but not close to a star.

[DanoMac]

One thing that's bothered me (PANDEMONIUM kinda did it) is people lumping in Segura with Gennett, or wanting a platoon with Segura, or hell, some people even thinking Segura is done.

Call me crazy, but I still have a ton of hope for the kid and still think he has star potential. He had about as rough a year as anyone can have, and I definitely give him a break because of that. Defensively, he's a monster.

In the AFL 2 years ago he was raking. During the 2013 season he was raking. He'll come back around (maybe not the .310-.320 he was hitting) but I have faith he'll be a .280-.300 guy

I like Segura, but he's got huge flaws in his plate approach that are going to put a hard cap on his upside. Normally I'd say a BABIP of .275 is unlucky, but Segura just has no clue what to swing at, and it resulted in an incredible number of weak grounders to second and short. The only thing that kept that BABIP number from being even lower was his great speed.

Unless he dramatically improves his approach at the plate, he's going to max out as a .700 OPS guy. Now, a .700 OPS shortstop with elite defense is still a plus WAR player, but not close to a star.

Am I being too optimistic thinking he could make a Gomez like jump? Obviously, not the power numbers. But the guy was a 3.2 WAR player at age 23, something Gomez didn't do until he was 27.