ImageImage

Series Thread: Cubs @ Brewers

Moderators: MickeyDavis, paulpressey25

User avatar
trwi7
RealGM
Posts: 97,384
And1: 10,897
Joined: Jul 12, 2006
Location: Aussie bias
         

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#181 » by trwi7 » Thu Apr 6, 2017 9:21 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
trwi7 wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:It's hilarious to me that anyone would have a problem signing a guy like Thames or Feliz.


What purpose do either serve? Thames to maybe win us a couple extra games this year? He's going to be in his mid-30s with a year left on his contract by the time we're looking to compete again.

Feliz, same thing. Decent reliever. Only have him for one year which kills his trade value. So what's the point?

It seems that either Mark is telling Stearns to sign some of these veteran guys so the team doesn't lose 100 games, which isn't good or Stearns is doing this himself and not really into rebuilding which also isn't good.


If they're good enough to affect draft positioning, which you seem to believe, they obviously have value in trade.

You're not making any sense.


What value in trade? Jesus Christ. Nobody is paying a ton for 20 innings of Feliz. Nobody is giving up a ton for a 31 year old 1B/LF who spent years in the KBO when they had an opportunity to just offer a few million more than us to sign him outright.
stellation wrote:"What's the difference between Gery Woelful and this glass of mineral water? The mineral water actually has a source."
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,805
And1: 7,166
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#182 » by ReasonablySober » Thu Apr 6, 2017 9:31 pm

A ton? Probably not. But there's a gulf in between no trade value and a ton.
User avatar
trwi7
RealGM
Posts: 97,384
And1: 10,897
Joined: Jul 12, 2006
Location: Aussie bias
         

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#183 » by trwi7 » Thu Apr 6, 2017 9:36 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:A ton? Probably not. But there's a gulf in between no trade value and a ton.


And that's my whole god damn point. Yes, we could get like a 150-200 prospect in the majors for either if they play well. So at that point, wouldn't you rather have the extra losses, the higher draft pick and the higher bonus pool?
stellation wrote:"What's the difference between Gery Woelful and this glass of mineral water? The mineral water actually has a source."
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,805
And1: 7,166
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#184 » by ReasonablySober » Thu Apr 6, 2017 9:43 pm

trwi7 wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:A ton? Probably not. But there's a gulf in between no trade value and a ton.


And that's my whole god damn point. Yes, we could get like a 150-200 prospect in the majors for either if they play well. So at that point, wouldn't you rather have the extra losses, the higher draft pick and the higher bonus pool?


No. Given how well Stearns has done in acquiring talent via trade, I'd like to have as many tradeable assets as possible. Broxton,
Villarreal, Davies, etc. weren't top 100 prospects.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
User avatar
trwi7
RealGM
Posts: 97,384
And1: 10,897
Joined: Jul 12, 2006
Location: Aussie bias
         

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#185 » by trwi7 » Thu Apr 6, 2017 9:49 pm

Okay, so you'd rather have a better record and worse prospects. Got it.
stellation wrote:"What's the difference between Gery Woelful and this glass of mineral water? The mineral water actually has a source."
User avatar
wichmae
RealGM
Posts: 15,039
And1: 635
Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Location: Milwaukee

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#186 » by wichmae » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:12 pm

Jungmann to AA to make room for Nick Franklin
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,805
And1: 7,166
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#187 » by ReasonablySober » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:15 pm

trwi7 wrote:Okay, so you'd rather have a better record and worse prospects. Got it.


:lol:

If this was the NBA I'd be 100% in favor of tanking. But it's not. Last year the player many people believed to be the best overall prospect went #12. The guy we got at #46 might be better than the guy we got at #5, who also happens to be the guy ESPN's draft expert considered the best overall prospect.

What you're saying really has little to do with guys like Feliz or Thames. You're actually saying you want guys like Villar, Escobar, Perez, Shaw, Broxton, Santana, Davies, Wily, and Guerra to suck. All to move up a few slots.
User avatar
wichmae
RealGM
Posts: 15,039
And1: 635
Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Location: Milwaukee

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#188 » by wichmae » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:42 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
trwi7 wrote:Okay, so you'd rather have a better record and worse prospects. Got it.


:lol:

If this was the NBA I'd be 100% in favor of tanking. But it's not. Last year the player many people believed to be the best overall prospect went #12. The guy we got at #46 might be better than the guy we got at #5, who also happens to be the guy ESPN's draft expert considered the best overall prospect.

What you're saying really has little to do with guys like Feliz or Thames. You're actually saying you want guys like Villar, Escobar, Perez, Shaw, Broxton, Santana, Davies, Wily, and Guerra to suck. All to move up a few slots.

Well the initial post was in reply to a Kirk HR and he did reference those two players specifically.
User avatar
Iheartfootball
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,467
And1: 360
Joined: May 09, 2014
Location: Yay area
       

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#189 » by Iheartfootball » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:42 pm

Prickle wrote:
Iheartfootball wrote:
mlloyd10 wrote:
I don't ... Uecker is Uecker....one of the best things about the Brewers is Uecker


I completely agree. But he's not above criticism.


At this point, Uecker most definitely IS above criticism. Yeah, maybe he's not as sharp as he once was, but who is? Almost all of the criticism I've heard regarding him has seemed to come from younger fans, who are accustomed to every game being televised, and up-to-the-minute stats, replays, and commentary in the palm of their hand. I'm not saying this is you, btw, just an observation I've made. Most younger fans have no idea what it used to be like listening to radio games before the internet age. We live in a fast-paced world now, but baseball is, and always will be, a slow-paced game that leaves plenty of room for storytelling and improvisation from a radio broadcaster - the things that Uecker excels at. He's a living legend who be greatly missed when he's gone.


Agreed. I'm all about Uecker's telling stories and making up bits and I wouldn't want anyone else calling games. That's his bread and butter; but calling the action, I don't know. His HR calls that don't hit the warning track (did it again today) are annoying (but sort of funny at this point). Also, while the bits and stories are great they sometimes come at the expense of what is going on and where the inning is at.

Love Uecker, he's not perfect and no one is. He's still funny as hell though.
Oh man. Milwaukee. Damn.

Take dead aim on the rich boys. Get them in the crosshairs. And take them down.
User avatar
wichmae
RealGM
Posts: 15,039
And1: 635
Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Location: Milwaukee

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#190 » by wichmae » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:43 pm

Youre also omitting the pool aspect of this. We over slot for Zack Clark, Payton Henry, McClanahan, and Francisco Thomas. Because we were top 5 we had the pool money to acquire those players in the draft and sign them. Last years draft was also very weak in total. Had a couple safe guys at the top and a slew of lotto ticket types. The difference between picking 5 versus 12 is pretty massive. Last years totals $11,136,264(5). $7,947,500(12). I would gladly take our haul versus the class the Red Sox got.
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,805
And1: 7,166
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#191 » by ReasonablySober » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:52 pm

wichmae wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
trwi7 wrote:Okay, so you'd rather have a better record and worse prospects. Got it.


:lol:

If this was the NBA I'd be 100% in favor of tanking. But it's not. Last year the player many people believed to be the best overall prospect went #12. The guy we got at #46 might be better than the guy we got at #5, who also happens to be the guy ESPN's draft expert considered the best overall prospect.

What you're saying really has little to do with guys like Feliz or Thames. You're actually saying you want guys like Villar, Escobar, Perez, Shaw, Broxton, Santana, Davies, Wily, and Guerra to suck. All to move up a few slots.

Well the initial post was in reply to a Kirk HR and he did reference those two players specifically.


He's been a replacement level player his entire career. He's exactly the kind of player he should like if tanking is want he wants.
User avatar
El Duderino
RealGM
Posts: 19,425
And1: 926
Joined: May 30, 2005
Location: Working on pad level

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#192 » by El Duderino » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:53 pm

trwi7 wrote:
El Duderino wrote:
He wants the team to suck, no point in trying to change his mind.

I want the mostly young players to do well and if that means not landing a top 5 pick, so be it. On the flip side, if the team does end up being really bad and we do get a top 5 pick, so be it.


I'd like us to actually fully commit to rebuilding.


Well, Stearns just isn't trying to put teams together with hopes of losing 100 games as you want. It is what it is on how he views this rebuild and i see nothing to believe that will change.

So you can hope guys like Thames and Shaw strikeout every time they step to the plate so the team loses as many games as possible. I'm not going to, especially with Shaw and overall i have confidence in Stearns that he's going to lead the Brewers into a stretch of consistent success, it's only a matter of when that starts. That matters to me more than nitpicking every decision he makes which i may not be a big fan of.
User avatar
wichmae
RealGM
Posts: 15,039
And1: 635
Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Location: Milwaukee

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#193 » by wichmae » Thu Apr 6, 2017 11:09 pm

The SHaw deal I can understand both sides of the coin. We did get Dubon and Pennington but taking Shaw could have gotten another prospect. Now I have no idea if that was possible or not so its really difficult to debate. SHaw himself if he keeps hitting caould generate trade interest down the line so I get it with him. I also get it with any OF currently on the roster as to generate value to flip since our strongest assets are the OF prospects. However. It is imperative to keep draft eligible players, draft slotting, and the international market at the forefront this season. None of those aforementioned players will garner any player at the level or upside of a top pick or top bonus pool.

eta: there absolutely have been some questionable decisions made this last offseason.
User avatar
El Duderino
RealGM
Posts: 19,425
And1: 926
Joined: May 30, 2005
Location: Working on pad level

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#194 » by El Duderino » Thu Apr 6, 2017 11:18 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
trwi7 wrote:Okay, so you'd rather have a better record and worse prospects. Got it.


:lol:

If this was the NBA I'd be 100% in favor of tanking. But it's not. Last year the player many people believed to be the best overall prospect went #12. The guy we got at #46 might be better than the guy we got at #5, who also happens to be the guy ESPN's draft expert considered the best overall prospect.

What you're saying really has little to do with guys like Feliz or Thames. You're actually saying you want guys like Villar, Escobar, Perez, Shaw, Broxton, Santana, Davies, Wily, and Guerra to suck. All to move up a few slots.


Yea, that's what will impact mostly where the Brewers record ends up being. How the controllable guys in their 20's produce, far more than a few guys in their 30's. Of those guys in their 30's, Braun is the only one who can be highly productive.

Plus, looking at this pitching staff, barring both Peralta and Nelson having a dramatically better season this year, i can't see this staff holding up over a long 162 game season. So i see that leading to lots of losses, even if the guys on offense produce better this year, which i expect to happen.
User avatar
Gianstoppable
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,359
And1: 319
Joined: Jan 07, 2015
     

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#195 » by Gianstoppable » Fri Apr 7, 2017 12:13 am

trwi7 wrote:Okay, so tell me what players we have, that would be available if they play well that will have the amazing trade value you seem to think they'll have.


Villar would have some really good value if we wanted to trade him if he had anot her great 1st half. That's about it
User avatar
Gianstoppable
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,359
And1: 319
Joined: Jan 07, 2015
     

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#196 » by Gianstoppable » Fri Apr 7, 2017 12:14 am

Glad it's only taken 4 games for half of you to think this team is doomed somehow. Relax. Jeez
User avatar
Gianstoppable
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,359
And1: 319
Joined: Jan 07, 2015
     

Re: Series Thread: Rockies @ Brewers 

Post#197 » by Gianstoppable » Fri Apr 7, 2017 12:17 am

trwi7 wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
trwi7 wrote:
What purpose do either serve? Thames to maybe win us a couple extra games this year? He's going to be in his mid-30s with a year left on his contract by the time we're looking to compete again.

Feliz, same thing. Decent reliever. Only have him for one year which kills his trade value. So what's the point?

It seems that either Mark is telling Stearns to sign some of these veteran guys so the team doesn't lose 100 games, which isn't good or Stearns is doing this himself and not really into rebuilding which also isn't good.


If they're good enough to affect draft positioning, which you seem to believe, they obviously have value in trade.

You're not making any sense.


What value in trade? Jesus Christ. Nobody is paying a ton for 20 innings of Feliz. Nobody is giving up a ton for a 31 year old 1B/LF who spent years in the KBO when they had an opportunity to just offer a few million more than us to sign him outright.


You need to get laid, quit freaking out about small deals like Feliz and Thames. It barely cost us anything and believe it or not we could actually get a decent prospect out of it. The sky isn't always falling you know right?
Outlander
Sophomore
Posts: 218
And1: 35
Joined: Feb 14, 2014

Re: Series Thread: Cubs @ Brewers 

Post#198 » by Outlander » Fri Apr 7, 2017 7:40 pm

I don't think there is a lot of room to complain if you really want this team to lose. I mean they have the lowest payroll in the majors and not exactly mortgaging the future with a bunch of long term veteran contracts. They have to have a 25 man roster and have to play a 1B and 3b and there is nobody else on the 40 man who can really do that so I don't see the big deal. I guess they could have went with Villar again at 3B and kept Scooter at 2b but I don't really think that makes them much worse. Carter vs. Thames isn't going to move the needle much. Trading Guerra before the season would have netted prospects and in theory made them worse so maybe an argument there. Feliz, whatever they need somebody to close and will trade him too just like the other ones if he has any success. Don't know why anybody who wants losses would care about Kirk N playing, I would think you would want more of those disposable, flawed types of players until a prospect is ready. Most predict the Brewers will be bad, many say bottom 5 so if it is losses you are looking for I think you will be happy with their record once the season ends.
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,805
And1: 7,166
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Series Thread: Cubs @ Brewers 

Post#199 » by ReasonablySober » Fri Apr 7, 2017 9:28 pm

Read on Twitter

Return to Milwaukee Brewers