Let's talk Mariners baseball

[reedmo13]

Hi guys! I'm new and a devout Mariners fan. Always have been and always will be. I would like to join your discussion forum and talk Mariners baseball with you. Please take it easy as I am a girl who just happens to love baseball. I'm looking forward to the upcoming season and our chance at the playoffs!! Gone are the days of Edgar Martinez, Jamie Moyer and my all time favorite Griffey, but with our dominating bullpen and defensive support, I think if we can bring some offense on board we have a great shot at post season play!!

[Neddy]

NICE! welcome although this isn't my forum.

[Neddy]

unfortunately, this place looks dead and it just might be you and i, reedmo13. but that's okay since it only takes two to have a discussion.

the Mariners posted the worst OPS last season as a team and surely you need bats to improve your team. the first option from all the rumors was that the mariners were looking into signing victor martinez but he is resigned with his current team. Hanley Ramirez was the second that was discussed, and as a dodger fan I WANT your team to sign Hanley. his defense has gotten way too bad that he no longer can play the SS in national league. being in AL, however, he can utilize his fantastic bat as a DH and an occasional SS and 3B to spell your regulars. problem is, Mariners are not the only AL club interested in Hanley. the Astros has been linked lately with some strong interest. there also are a few other dark horse AL teams with maybe deeper pocket.

another option that is still out there, is to eat some contract but deal for still currently functional and performing Matt Kemp and Carl Crawford trade with the dodgers. we want to go under the lux tax, and your team needs better outfielders who can actually hit, especially a power righty who can protect Cano. Kemp is that guy. after the all star, kemp was back to his MVP caliber player. Carl finished his season at .300 BA and still can play the LF as good as any. we have too many OFers as Puig is now the star and Van Slyke posted the best SLG% out of them all last season, and we need to make room for Joc Pederson in center. all we ask in return is cap relief, so a few mid level prospects is all i ask.

looking to hear from you of what you think of this proposal.

[reedmo13]

I do like the option of Kemp and Crawford. I'm not ready to give up on Ackley in left. He wasn't clutch through the entire season, but at the end he stepped up. He did well at the plate and defensively. He's much better in the outfield than previously at 2nd. I think we could use some help in center and right though like you said. Having bats to support Cano and even Seager would be the key to more wins. I need to do a little more research on who's being optioned. We have some financial wiggle room and we need to take advantage.

[Sweezo]

the Mariners posted the worst OPS last season as a team and surely you need bats to improve your team. the first option from all the rumors was that the mariners were looking into signing victor martinez but he is resigned with his current team. Hanley Ramirez was the second that was discussed, and as a dodger fan I WANT your team to sign Hanley. his defense has gotten way too bad that he no longer can play the SS in national league. being in AL, however, he can utilize his fantastic bat as a DH and an occasional SS and 3B to spell your regulars. problem is, Mariners are not the only AL club interested in Hanley. the Astros has been linked lately with some strong interest. there also are a few other dark horse AL teams with maybe deeper pocket.

Given the likely financial commitment needed to sign Hanley, I'm not completely sure what the M's would do with him either. Seager has 3B locked down, Miller/Taylor are promising young SS...how much does one pay for Hanley to mostly DH?

another option that is still out there, is to eat some contract but deal for still currently functional and performing Matt Kemp and Carl Crawford trade with the dodgers. we want to go under the lux tax, and your team needs better outfielders who can actually hit, especially a power righty who can protect Cano. Kemp is that guy. after the all star, kemp was back to his MVP caliber player. Carl finished his season at .300 BA and still can play the LF as good as any. we have too many OFers as Puig is now the star and Van Slyke posted the best SLG% out of them all last season, and we need to make room for Joc Pederson in center. all we ask in return is cap relief, so a few mid level prospects is all i ask.

looking to hear from you of what you think of this proposal.

I had some interest in Kemp last season and might be willing to take on his entire contract if I'm the M's...if it meant not having to give up a ton of talent?

I'm of the firm belief that the two most likely options for the M's on offense are Kemp and Cruz. I'm not thrilled about that as I really dislike Nelson Cruz, but it just seems like one or both of those things will happen.

[Sweezo]

unfortunately, this place looks dead and it just might be you and i, reedmo13. but that's okay since it only takes two to have a discussion.

It's really hard to maintain a brisk community on here and the Seahawks board ever since the Sonics left, unfortunately.

[Neddy]

I do like the option of Kemp and Crawford. I'm not ready to give up on Ackley in left. He wasn't clutch through the entire season, but at the end he stepped up. He did well at the plate and defensively. He's much better in the outfield than previously at 2nd. I think we could use some help in center and right though like you said. Having bats to support Cano and even Seager would be the key to more wins. I need to do a little more research on who's being optioned. We have some financial wiggle room and we need to take advantage.

then you must move Ackley to RF or CF as Crawford's arm does not permit him to play anything but the LF. does Ackley have enough arm to play the other two OF positions? and Kemp isn't a good defensive CF but thats where he prefers to play. he did make an all-star as a CF so you have some flexibility but his natural position is RF.

I don't believe Michael Saunders is coming back to the mariners. he is pretty POed at your GM. Austin Jackson to me is a 4th OF. but he does play slightly better CF than Kemp.

[Neddy]

unfortunately, this place looks dead and it just might be you and i, reedmo13. but that's okay since it only takes two to have a discussion.

It's really hard to maintain a brisk community on here and the Seahawks board ever since the Sonics left, unfortunately.

hey what do you know? this place aint dead after all.

I think you should not worry as ReedMo girl seem like a diehard and me as a transplanted Mariner territory baseball fanatic I will adopt the mariners as my AL favorite although I will always be a dodger fan.

we have three, now we can have real debates and discussion about mariner baseball. I am looking forward to it

[Sweezo]

then you must move Ackley to RF or CF as Crawford's arm does not permit him to play anything but the LF. does Ackley have enough arm to play the other two OF positions? and Kemp isn't a good defensive CF but thats where he prefers to play. he did make an all-star as a CF so you have some flexibility but his natural position is RF.

I don't believe Michael Saunders is coming back to the mariners. he is pretty POed at your GM. Austin Jackson to me is a 4th OF. but he does play slightly better CF than Kemp.

Ackley's defensive range and routes improved greatly over the course of the season last year, but his arm appears poor. He had one amazingly great throw from LF to 2B to nab a runner trying to get a double, but that was about it.

I wouldn't play Kemp in CF as he's simply not an option there at this point in his career even if he prefers that spot in the OF. His UZR numbers were both over (or under, rather) -30 when he played CF the last two seasons. His WAR was 1.8 last season because his defense almost completely negated any positive offensive performance last season. He's probable better off adjusting to a RF/DH rotation at this point in his career.

Jackson's a good bounce back candidate. He struggled in limited plate appearances with the M's last season, but has been a decent contributor for the past few seasons. He looked very good on defense and I'm confident in his ability to produce in '15.

[Neddy]

the Mariners posted the worst OPS last season as a team and surely you need bats to improve your team. the first option from all the rumors was that the mariners were looking into signing victor martinez but he is resigned with his current team. Hanley Ramirez was the second that was discussed, and as a dodger fan I WANT your team to sign Hanley. his defense has gotten way too bad that he no longer can play the SS in national league. being in AL, however, he can utilize his fantastic bat as a DH and an occasional SS and 3B to spell your regulars. problem is, Mariners are not the only AL club interested in Hanley. the Astros has been linked lately with some strong interest. there also are a few other dark horse AL teams with maybe deeper pocket.

Given the likely financial commitment needed to sign Hanley, I'm not completely sure what the M's would do with him either. Seager has 3B locked down, Miller/Taylor are promising young SS...how much does one pay for Hanley to mostly DH?

another option that is still out there, is to eat some contract but deal for still currently functional and performing Matt Kemp and Carl Crawford trade with the dodgers. we want to go under the lux tax, and your team needs better outfielders who can actually hit, especially a power righty who can protect Cano. Kemp is that guy. after the all star, kemp was back to his MVP caliber player. Carl finished his season at .300 BA and still can play the LF as good as any. we have too many OFers as Puig is now the star and Van Slyke posted the best SLG% out of them all last season, and we need to make room for Joc Pederson in center. all we ask in return is cap relief, so a few mid level prospects is all i ask.

looking to hear from you of what you think of this proposal.

I had some interest in Kemp last season and might be willing to take on his entire contract if I'm the M's...if it meant not having to give up a ton of talent?

I'm of the firm belief that the two most likely options for the M's on offense are Kemp and Cruz. I'm not thrilled about that as I really dislike Nelson Cruz, but it just seems like one or both of those things will happen.

only catch is tho, Andrew Friedman our new president of the baseball operation, is not looking to trade Kemp alone. I am sure he is willing to eat a half of craw ford's salary to make this package deal work and I think you should really consider. as much as Crawford has struggled with injuries in the past three seasons or so, he has made his comeback last season batting .300, with .340 OBP and .430 SLG. 770 may not be excellent for a guy making 21 million a year, but for 10? he is only starting to recover from his injuries. considering that and the fact that he is still showing signs of his speed (23 stolen bases) and getting a former perennial all star at a discounted price, i think its worth it for the bat starved mariners to pull the trigger.

what the dodgers get out of this trade is having a starting positions available for our top SLG and OPS guy Scott Van Slyke at LF, and bringing up our top prospect Joc Pederson at CF. it has little to do with Carl or Matt's performances but we still need to shed salary as our former idiot GM Ned Colletti had overspent and now we need to get under the lux tax.

I think this is a win win situation for both teams.

[Sweezo]

only catch is tho, Andrew Friedman our new president of the baseball operation, is not looking to trade Kemp alone. I am sure he is willing to eat a half of craw ford's salary to make this package deal work and I think you should really consider. as much as Crawford has struggled with injuries in the past three seasons or so, he has made his comeback last season batting .300, with .340 OBP and .430 SLG. 770 may not be excellent for a guy making 21 million a year, but for 10? he is only starting to recover from his injuries. considering that and the fact that he is still showing signs of his speed (23 stolen bases) and getting a former perennial all star at a discounted price, i think its worth it for the bat starved mariners to pull the trigger.

what the dodgers get out of this trade is having a starting positions available for our top SLG and OPS guy Scott Van Slyke at LF, and bringing up our top prospect Joc Pederson at CF. it has little to do with Carl or Matt's performances but we still need to shed salary as our former idiot GM Ned Colletti had overspent and now we need to get under the lux tax.

I think this is a win win situation for both teams.

Friedman's an awesome GM. I'm supremely jealous of the Dodgers for prying him away from the Rays.

I'm curious about what Friedman wants to do. He has plenty of experience putting a quality team on the field without paying a ton of money. Does he see Kemp as an asset or a possible hindrance? Would he rather have some more space on the payroll in order to find more pitching and fix the bullpen?

[Neddy]

only catch is tho, Andrew Friedman our new president of the baseball operation, is not looking to trade Kemp alone. I am sure he is willing to eat a half of craw ford's salary to make this package deal work and I think you should really consider. as much as Crawford has struggled with injuries in the past three seasons or so, he has made his comeback last season batting .300, with .340 OBP and .430 SLG. 770 may not be excellent for a guy making 21 million a year, but for 10? he is only starting to recover from his injuries. considering that and the fact that he is still showing signs of his speed (23 stolen bases) and getting a former perennial all star at a discounted price, i think its worth it for the bat starved mariners to pull the trigger.

what the dodgers get out of this trade is having a starting positions available for our top SLG and OPS guy Scott Van Slyke at LF, and bringing up our top prospect Joc Pederson at CF. it has little to do with Carl or Matt's performances but we still need to shed salary as our former idiot GM Ned Colletti had overspent and now we need to get under the lux tax.

I think this is a win win situation for both teams.

Friedman's an awesome GM. I'm supremely jealous of the Dodgers for prying him away from the Rays.

I'm curious about what Friedman wants to do. He has plenty of experience putting a quality team on the field without paying a ton of money. Does he see Kemp as an asset or a possible hindrance? Would he rather have some more space on the payroll in order to find more pitching and fix the bullpen?

YES.

we have enough batsmen. we are lacking severely in back of the rotation starters and especially the bullpen.

we have over the hill above 4.00 FIP Haren as our 4th and ? at 5th right now. our top 3 rocks but we are missing 2/5th of our rotation.

I believe we are eyeing on Scherzer if we can shed enough salary, but if not at least make a run at Kuroda or Kenda Maeda of hiroshima Carps. I would love to get back Charlie Furbush from Kemp/Crawford trade, personally.

[Neddy]

i have made a projection thread at my dodgers forum, you will see our outfield is very, very crowded with talented players. its not that Kemp and Crawford are particularly bad, but it is that we have equal or better options who are dirt cheap.

[Neddy]

BTW, what happened to ReedMo? I am missing you girl!!!! reply in your own thread!!!!!!

[reedmo13]

I was reading a little about the possible Upton deal and I'm not to thrilled with it. The way I understand it, to get him we would have to give up Walker. Now I wasn't thrilled with Walkwr's performance this past season, but after thinking about it I'm sure he's going to improve. If we don't give up Walker then who's left? Kuma??? There is no way I want to take him out of our rotation. I think we need to pass on the Upton deal. Then there's Nelson Cruz...although he would add to our offense which we obviously need, he's going to be 35 and he's had multiple leg injuries which would limit him to the DH position. If he plays in the outfield he will likely injure his leg yet again and be of no use to us. The DH position for him doesn't seem so bad, but his cost is so high. I would think we could use that money more productively. I'm trusting our front office to finally make some good decisions here for once. I won't hold my breath.

[Neddy]

I was reading a little about the possible Upton deal and I'm not to thrilled with it. The way I understand it, to get him we would have to give up Walker. Now I wasn't thrilled with Walkwr's performance this past season, but after thinking about it I'm sure he's going to improve. If we don't give up Walker then who's left? Kuma??? There is no way I want to take him out of our rotation. I think we need to pass on the Upton deal. Then there's Nelson Cruz...although he would add to our offense which we obviously need, he's going to be 35 and he's had multiple leg injuries which would limit him to the DH position. If he plays in the outfield he will likely injure his leg yet again and be of no use to us. The DH position for him doesn't seem so bad, but his cost is so high. I would think we could use that money more productively. I'm trusting our front office to finally make some good decisions here for once. I won't hold my breath.

hey, glad you are back!

yeah and i say no go on upton deal either. although he is a great talent at a relatively young age, he is a rental. trading quality pieces for a one year rental is what championship caliber teams who are a player or two from winning it all may do, but it is not the way to go for a young team trying to make it into the playoffs for the first time in, what, forever? even if the mariners are going to content for the WS in 2015, I still don't give up a team controlled young arm who is on all 30 teams radar as one of the top pitching prospects in the last two years or so for a one year rental. I would look for a longer contract and just young enough of a player who can play alongside of Cano and Felix for the duration of their contracts, as a pillar of your franchise for years to come, if the price must be Taijuan Walker.

No to Nelson Cruz. he is gonna bust if you give him a long term deal and he will test positive again and get banned if you give him a one year contract to test the free agency the next season. besides, he is a bandaid. you need a remedy. Hell if you are willing to pay a fortune for a DH there is always Hanley and he is younger too. just can't play a lick of defense but was the second best offensive SS last year.

lastly, trusting your front office isn't something i would count on. although it was a different GM, didn't you guys trade 24 year old Choo Shin Soo who broke out for the tribe then for the Reds for... Ben Broussard, a platoon DH? how about trading away then a stud of a lefty George Sherrill, an eventual superstar Adam Jones, the 2014 opening day starter Chris Tillman, and a couple more players for just one Erik Bedard who's fourth year option was declined by the M's? can you imagine if your team currently had Adam Jones who's been averaging 30 HRs for the last 4 seasons for the Os and an opening day starter who won the game 1 of the ALDS against the mighty Tigers to set the tone for the series? and to have given up on that much talent for 3 years of one Erik Bedard... god sometimes i think the mariners are the only team with the front office more awful than Ned Colletti the ex dodger GM, although Ned' problem was signing awful free agents at ridiculous prices, Andruw Jones, Jason Schmitt, Juan Pierre, Andre Ethier's extension, so on and os forth.

hopefully the mariners don't screw this up. your ownership should grab Paul Depodesta and give him another shot at GM job. even so briefly, the best GM the dodgers had until we got Friedman and Zaini. Paul is the one who foresaw Jason Werth's stardom and got him cheap. he was asked by Frank the Scumbag McCourt to clean the house of expensive contracts while dumping the steroid users as mitchell report was about to get blown out of proportion, and was the scapegoat when the media and the fans got angry with the team. Ned was simply a beneficiary of the team Paul had built for the perennial playoff runs.

[reedmo13]

I was reading a little about the possible Upton deal and I'm not to thrilled with it. The way I understand it, to get him we would have to give up Walker. Now I wasn't thrilled with Walkwr's performance this past season, but after thinking about it I'm sure he's going to improve. If we don't give up Walker then who's left? Kuma??? There is no way I want to take him out of our rotation. I think we need to pass on the Upton deal. Then there's Nelson Cruz...although he would add to our offense which we obviously need, he's going to be 35 and he's had multiple leg injuries which would limit him to the DH position. If he plays in the outfield he will likely injure his leg yet again and be of no use to us. The DH position for him doesn't seem so bad, but his cost is so high. I would think we could use that money more productively. I'm trusting our front office to finally make some good decisions here for once. I won't hold my breath.

hey, glad you are back!

yeah and i say no go on upton deal either. although he is a great talent at a relatively young age, he is a rental. trading quality pieces for a one year rental is what championship caliber teams who are a player or two from winning it all may do, but it is not the way to go for a young team trying to make it into the playoffs for the first time in, what, forever? even if the mariners are going to content for the WS in 2015, I still don't give up a team controlled young arm who is on all 30 teams radar as one of the top pitching prospects in the last two years or so for a one year rental. I would look for a longer contract and just young enough of a player who can play alongside of Cano and Felix for the duration of their contracts, as a pillar of your franchise for years to come, if the price must be Taijuan Walker.

No to Nelson Cruz. he is gonna bust if you give him a long term deal and he will test positive again and get banned if you give him a one year contract to test the free agency the next season. besides, he is a bandaid. you need a remedy. Hell if you are willing to pay a fortune for a DH there is always Hanley and he is younger too. just can't play a lick of defense but was the second best offensive SS last year.

lastly, trusting your front office isn't something i would count on. although it was a different GM, didn't you guys trade 24 year old Choo Shin Soo who broke out for the tribe then for the Reds for... Ben Broussard, a platoon DH? how about trading away then a stud of a lefty George Sherrill, an eventual superstar Adam Jones, the 2014 opening day starter Chris Tillman, and a couple more players for just one Erik Bedard who's fourth year option was declined by the M's? can you imagine if your team currently had Adam Jones who's been averaging 30 HRs for the last 4 seasons for the Os and an opening day starter who won the game 1 of the ALDS against the mighty Tigers to set the tone for the series? and to have given up on that much talent for 3 years of one Erik Bedard... god sometimes i think the mariners are the only team with the front office more awful than Ned Colletti the ex dodger GM, although Ned' problem was signing awful free agents at ridiculous prices, Andruw Jones, Jason Schmitt, Juan Pierre, Andre Ethier's extension, so on and os forth.

hopefully the mariners don't screw this up. your ownership should grab Paul Depodesta and give him another shot at GM job. even so briefly, the best GM the dodgers had until we got Friedman and Zaini. Paul is the one who foresaw Jason Werth's stardom and got him cheap. he was asked by Frank the Scumbag McCourt to clean the house of expensive contracts while dumping the steroid users as mitchell report was about to get blown out of proportion, and was the scapegoat when the media and the fans got angry with the team. Ned was simply a beneficiary of the team Paul had built for the perennial playoff runs.

I would love for us to kick Jack to the curb. Well, not only Jack, but pretty much all of our ownership. At this point pretty much anyone would be better. I would be willing to take over, but I'm pretty sure that's out of the question. We've made so many horrible trades in the past that the off season is always a stressful time. They don't know how to judge a players ability beyond HR, ERA and RBI. Now that we are willing to spend more money on quality players we should see improvement, but we always find a way to trade away great prospects or waste the money on someone who will be a "rental" as you put it. We need to find players to help build up the team we have. Not someone who will potentially help for one season and then they're gone. It would be nice to have some serious changes made in the front office. That alone could make a world of difference for this team. Getting people who can see past the basic stats.

[Neddy]

I would love for us to kick Jack to the curb. Well, not only Jack, but pretty much all of our ownership. At this point pretty much anyone would be better. I would be willing to take over, but I'm pretty sure that's out of the question. We've made so many horrible trades in the past that the off season is always a stressful time. They don't know how to judge a players ability beyond HR, ERA and RBI. Now that we are willing to spend more money on quality players we should see improvement, but we always find a way to trade away great prospects or waste the money on someone who will be a "rental" as you put it. We need to find players to help build up the team we have. Not someone who will potentially help for one season and then they're gone. It would be nice to have some serious changes made in the front office. That alone could make a world of difference for this team. Getting people who can see past the basic stats.

Jack? Im not following. the owner of the Mariners is the Nintendo of America, and the 85 year old owner Hiroshi Yamauchi just died on Thursday. I assume you are referring to your general manager Jack Zduriencik, whom I consider a bonehead, lol. but I believe he has no stake in the ownership of the mariners.

if I misunderstood your intention I apologize beforehand, as I am one of those who lack common sense and only can follow the grammatical structure of how a post was written and take it literally.

BTW funny you mention HR, ERA, and RBIs. there is only one stat among the three that is actually meaningful.
HR is a fielding independent stat and therefore a true barometer of a batsman's ability to hit with power. ERA and RBIs often lies(less with ERA and more with RBI btw), as ERA is correlated to the pitcher's team's defense and how they played at the particular starts of the such pitcher(unless we are talking about a high SO pitcher), and RBI is directly proportional to where the batsman is hitting in the lineup.
For example, take Juan Encarnacion. back in 2003, when the Marlins won the WS, he batted third for 10 games, cleanup 22 games, batting fifth 90 games, and batting no later than 6th, 33 games. in other words, he started 122 games in 2003 World Series Champion season batting in the heart of the order in 3-4-5. he gathered 94 RBI while hitting 19 HRs and total of 162 hits in 601 at bats that year. now take Juan Encarnacion in 2004 with the Dodgers. He batted 6th in the lineup while starting 62 games, and batted 7th in 64 games. at total at bat of 484 ABs he still hit 16 HRs, which translates to being the same guy as the year before power wise, and yet he only raked 62 RBIs.

as a life time dodger fan who transplanted to the great northwest 11 years ago, of course i wish for the mariners to trade for Kemp and hopefully Crawford with him. a part of me want to see Matt Kemp revitalize his old self and thrive, and meanwhile give the dodgers the salary relief we desperately need to build a better team. but also there is a part of me that wants to see a winner out of my current home team. Kemp and Zach Lee for Walker and Joey Gallo?
if you don't like it don't shoot me down but Kemp has shown when healthy, he is still an MVP caliber player in second half of the last season. being in AL you guys can preserve him at DH for a good 40 games a year and still use his bat. Lee is a former first rounder who got roughed up a bit in high elevation of Albuquerque but still projected to be a pretty decent starting pitcher and near major league ready. you have a young Kyle Seager who just won the gold glove at 3rd who is still under team's control so Joey Gallo is simply a trade bait. the dodgers can use a 3rd base prospect while gaining our 4th/5th starter in the rotation in Walker.

finally, I love you for acknowledging the significance of the advanced stats over traditional stats. you are awesome! don't ever stop posting around here, girl!

[Neddy]

oh me oh my.

now the Mariners are talking Iwakuma for Upton. smfh...

[Neddy]

what do you say if Iwakuma+Furbush was traded for Kemp+Baez? you get the strong right handed power hitter in corner OF and a young power bullpen arm to replace Furbush, while it seems the mariners are determined to trade Iwakuma this off season at all cost, which i don't really get but I would love to see him in dodger blue.

not trying to antagonize anyone but just simply making a suggestion.