Rosenthal: Jays, Mets trade may be expanding beyond Dickey

Garrett · Post #1 » by **Garrett** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 12:59 am

Jim Duquette of MLB.com hears that the Blue Jays are one of the "serious suitors" for R.A. Dickey.
Duquette says that the Jays would send J.P. Arencibia and "others" to the Mets in the deal. Arencibia would make sense given that the Mets need catching help, but they would surely seek a better player as the headliner of a deal if they decide to trade Dickey. The Red Sox are also interested in the knuckleballer, and the Royals have been mentioned as a possible suitor.

Raptor_Guy · Post #2 » by **Raptor_Guy** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:00 am

Soo we're not getting Dickey then. :wink:

BigLeagueChew · Post #3 » by **BigLeagueChew** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:06 am

Arencibia has to go the other way, getting him to catch a knuckleball and framing it let alone a fastball

tiger7 · Post #4 » by **tiger7** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:08 am

In a closed dome wouldn't a knuckle ball end up being fairly flat without the wind?

FrankGrimes · Post #5 » by **FrankGrimes** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:12 am

tiger7 wrote:In a closed dome wouldn't a knuckle ball end up being fairly flat without the wind?

Nope. Knuckle balls aren't dependant on the wind. As long as there is air between the ball and the catcher's mitt, you got an unpredictable flight path.

Ado05 · Post #6 » by **Ado05** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:15 am

TBH, I dont think AA would be on Dickey. Especially if we have to give up a "difference maker"

Aimless Outlook · Post #7 » by **Aimless Outlook** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:17 am

How many games are actually played with the roof closed?

I suppose you could look over Tim Wakefield and Tom Candiotti's stats in the dome. I'm guessing they would have quite a few starts in there.

Raptor_Guy · Post #8 » by **Raptor_Guy** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:21 am

Like I said in the other thread, I don't think AA would give up a significant amount for a 1 year rental.

s e n s i · Post #9 » by **s e n s i** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:23 am

tiger7 wrote:In a closed dome wouldn't a knuckle ball end up being fairly flat without the wind?

a closed dome is actually a knuckleballer's paradise iirc. something about the pockets of air and it's predictable circulation within a climate controlled facility make it easier for a knuckler to identify his release point and get the ball over the plate.

BigLeagueChew · Post #10 » by **BigLeagueChew** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:26 am

tiger7 wrote:In a closed dome wouldn't a knuckle ball end up being fairly flat without the wind?

It depends, Dickey throws his knuckler faster than any other MLB pitcher but too much wind can usually make a good knuckleball uncontrollable. So theres less chance of wind being a factor if you throw harder.

Wakefield had a tough time in Dome stadiums compared to Grass whereas Candiotti was better in Dome settings, as far as career splits go.

The thing about Dickey is, he hasn't been a particularly great pitcher until the last couple seasons and he's already 38. Also worth mentioning his career splits are worse in domes than grass but at the same time, he hasn't pitched much in a dome setting being in the national league. So either he figured something out the last 3 years or not pitching in domes in the national league helped him out quite a bit.

I'll pass on him unless somehow we send Arencibia+ the other way.

tiger7 · Post #11 » by **tiger7** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:26 am

Aimless Outlook wrote:How many games are actually played with the roof closed?

I suppose you could look over Tim Wakefield and Tom Candiotti's stats in the dome. I'm guessing they would have quite a few starts in there.

Quite a few at least early on in the season. They tend to get lazy with opening the roof for the first few months.

evilRyu · Post #12 » by **evilRyu** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:28 am

Raptor_Guy wrote:Soo we're not getting Dickey then.

pretty much my thoughts as well

evilRyu · Post #13 » by **evilRyu** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:29 am

Probably a package of JPA, one of Gose/Rasmus, Happ would be the starting point.. from there, it'll be prospects

Ado05 · Post #14 » by **Ado05** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:31 am

evilRyu wrote:Probably a package of JPA, one of Gose/Rasmus, Happ would be the starting point.. from there, it'll be prospects

Way to much, imo.

Randle McMurphy · Post #15 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:43 am

evilRyu wrote:Probably a package of JPA, one of Gose/Rasmus, Happ would be the starting point.. from there, it'll be prospects

I think you've mistaken Dickey for a pitcher that has more than one year left on his deal. The Jays won't be giving up that much to get him, nor would it be worth it. Which isn't to say I wouldn't be interested in him, though.

Michael Bradley · Post #16 » by **Michael Bradley** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 1:44 am

As mentioned, if it is rumored, then you can throw it out the window. AA works very quietly.

With that said, I don't think Dickey would be out of line for the Jays if their window is the next three years. He seems like someone that can be signed to a reasonable short-term extension (due to age and unpredictably) and if he pitches as well as he did from 2010-11 (much less 2012) then he can be a huge asset. But given his age and the unpredictability of knuckleball pitchers in general, he comes with some risk.

zong · Post #17 » by **zong** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 2:02 am

Michael Bradley wrote:As mentioned, if it is rumored, then you can throw it out the window. AA works very quietly.

Pretty much sums up the situation.

That being said, it'd be very entertaining to have him pitch here nonetheless.

Randle McMurphy · Post #18 » by **Randle McMurphy** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 2:15 am

I won't just write a rumour off simply because it is out there. This could very easily be coming from the Mets side of the negotiations to try to up the price with other teams (you know, assuming there were any negotiations in the first place).

TR50 · Post #19 » by **TR50** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 2:28 am

I know AA is a ninja, but I agree with Randle. Sometimes where there is smoke, there is fire. I believe the Rasmus deal wasn't totally out of left field.

Michael Bradley · Post #20 » by **Michael Bradley** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 3:39 am

I am half-kidding when I say 'if it rumored then disregard it', but there is a lot of truth to that statement when it comes to AA. Nothing he ever does leaks beforehand. We generally know the players he has interest in (for example, Rasmus and Kelly Johnson), but you normally don't see anything he does rumored prior to it happening. Halladay is an exception and that's only because it was a holdover from the Ricciardi regime.

Now that Dickey has been linked to the Jays, I'm almost expecting to wake up to news of AA trading the entire farm for Felix Hernandez. Everything AA does surprises me.