Albers in? who's out Norris?

[akakalakin]

http://www.bluebirdbanter.com/2015/5/1/ ... p-tomorrow

Is it Norris injured/tired arm maybe?

[Santoki]

Probably. Norris looks like he's going to need some time off. This was one of the many things that couldn't go wrong this year. Needed Norris to have a strong year. By month's end we're going to have a rotation with 2 of Estrada/Albers/Francis. We must have the worst rotation in the AL.

[Lateral Quicks]

Norris not performing like the blue-chip prospect he is, after losing Stroman, would be devastating. As in like < 10% chance of making the post-season devastating.

[Yosemite Dan]

This team wasn't making the playoffs with or without Stroman. The theory that Stroman would have been a Cy Young candidate (which he would have to have been to give this team a chance) is so misguided. As misguided as thinking all the rookies in the line up were gonna hit the majors without missing a beat.

Did people really have expectations that this team would have a decent chance in the playoffs? Sanchez and Norris are pitching as expected for rookies. Inconsistently. With that many young guys in the lineup, your're lucky to get 1 or 2 of them to really be productive and we have that with Travis and Osuna so far. The rest are performing as expected.

It would be nice if they could do a media blackout for the 6 weeks of spring training. It creates ridiculous expectations considering the hitters are going at half speed so any pitching performance is so overstated. Not just fans, the media was even worse.

[Lateral Quicks]

A decent chance in the playoffs? Probably not, as aside from Stroman they don't have the high-impact starters you want in a short series. A decent chance to make the playoffs? Absolutely. The best offense in baseball can take you a long way even with mediocre pitching.

And BTW, many "professional" analysts and statistics-oriented sites had/have them making the playoffs too, so yours is a pretty extreme opinion.

[rarefind]

But our pitching is worse than mediocre. The problem isn't just the rotation but our lack of real bullpen depth also. This is the worst shape our rotation has been in that I can remember in the last decade. I've completely forgot what it feels like to know that your ace is on the mound and you have a pretty good shot of a victory on that particular day. Mind you, I wouldn't say that any team in the AL East has a true ace with Tanaka hurt and likely to be on the DL again soon after his return. Really wish we were able to pick up Ryan Webb, that would've been a solid pickup.

[Michael Bradley]

With Stroman/Estrada in the rotation, Sanchez in the pen, and Norris/Castro in the minors? Absolutely this team had a shot at the playoffs.

With Stroman out for the year, Sanchez/Norris in the rotation, Estrada rarely pitching, and Castro in the pen? That's where things will have to break Toronto's way a lot more for them to have a shot.

Stroman's injury not only took him out of the rotation but put a lot of other pitchers in positions they should not have been in. A nightmare scenario.

[s e n s i]

Mind you, I wouldn't say that any team in the AL East has a true ace with Tanaka hurt and likely to be on the DL again soon after his return.

chris archer has settled into the ace role quite nicely for the rays so far (0.84 ERA, 2.43 xFIP, 10.3 K/9 in 32.1 IP), but yeah our rotation is definitely in shambles

[Lateral Quicks]

But our pitching is worse than mediocre. The problem isn't just the rotation but our lack of real bullpen depth also. This is the worst shape our rotation has been in that I can remember in the last decade. I've completely forgot what it feels like to know that your ace is on the mound and you have a pretty good shot of a victory on that particular day. Mind you, I wouldn't say that any team in the AL East has a true ace with Tanaka hurt and likely to be on the DL again soon after his return. Really wish we were able to pick up Ryan Webb, that would've been a solid pickup.

Yeah, I said our starting pitching was mediocre *with* Stroman. The hope was that it would be good if both Hutch and Norris performed, but that hasn't happened so far.

Without Stroman, it's downright bad. They're roughly a .500 team at best I expect unless Hutch and/or Norris pick it up and/or they get some much needed pitching help.

[satyr9]

I think this is the beginning of Sanchez's removal, not Norris'. Norris can get the quick hook last night 'cause we're about to have 4 starters for 10 days. After Saturday, Sanchez will go to the 'pen or, more likely, get 2 weeks to wipe the slate clean in BUF and then the 'pen.

IMO Norris sticks for the time being, although I could be wrong if there's more than just excuses to this dead arm business that until last night was supposedly over. He's been disappointing, but not disastrously so. If any of Hutch/Dickey/Buehrle has been even minorly above their curve rather than below it, we'd all probably be grumblingly accepting of what Norris has accomplished so far. It's only in light of there being no light that we're this harsh.

But Sanchez got to go. If he's goes 9, K's 15 with no bombs and no walks on Saturday, he probably sees a sixth start, but other than that he gone.

But if Norris goes down for Albers, then I'm totally wrong. I just think it'll be someone else, likely Hendriks who we seem to have completely given up on.

[Lateral Quicks]

Hendriks has been great. If he's sent down he'll almost certainly get claimed on waivers.

If Norris is hurt it will be Norris. If not, the logical guy to send down is Castro. If not him, Francis is the only other somewhat reasonable choice.

[rarefind]

From a pure sense perspective, it would make sense to just send Sanchez to the pen and replace him with Estrada. Fill Estrada's hole with Albers.

They could opt to send down a position player once Bautista is capable of playing the OF again especially with Valencia looking decent in the OF.

[BigLeagueChew]

Tough call on who to send down. It's probably not a good thing that we can't easily pick who is being sent down.

Norris has been lucky, highest xFip on the team but a low ERA. Sanchez has been slightly unlucky but can pitch in the bullpen I think. Perhaps burn an option on Castro, give Sanchez his spot and let Albers start for Sanchez. Of course they could just put Albers in the bullpen as well.

[satyr9]

Hendriks has been great. If he's sent down he'll almost certainly get claimed on waivers.

If Norris is hurt it will be Norris. If not, the logical guy to send down is Castro. If not him, Francis is the only other somewhat reasonable choice.

Yeah, but we stopped using him after the two bad outing in BAL, that's the only reason I picked him. I don't think Francis can go back yet, nor would I understand an Albers for Francis swap. Castro's probably the next guy, but I just don't think they're going to pull that trigger yet. Other options... theoretically we might send Estrada to BUF to make 2 starts on the 2nd and 7th to prep for taking Sanchez's spot too, or just decide why **** wait and send Sanchez now, start Albers the one-time. But there aren't a lot of options, which is why I get the Norris speculation, I'm just not sure they're going to remove Norris unless there's a real medical issue, because they already have to deal with Sanchez, who has been so so so much worse than Norris.

[Yosemite Dan]

A decent chance in the playoffs? Probably not, as aside from Stroman they don't have the high-impact starters you want in a short series. A decent chance to make the playoffs? Absolutely. The best offense in baseball can take you a long way even with mediocre pitching.

And BTW, many "professional" analysts and statistics-oriented sites had/have them making the playoffs too, so yours is a pretty extreme opinion.

I meant for the playoffs, damn auto correct. How can anyone legitimately say that this team can even finish over .500. Sure they have a great offense that is prone to streakyness. Even now they exhibit that, scoring 12 runs one game then 2 runs for the next 2games.

We don't have a top 3 pitcher on the staff, let alone a 1 or a 2. This staff is historically bad and pair that up with a sub par bullpen and there is no amount of offense that can save that.

Again if all these analysts predicted the Jays making the playoffs then what was it based on? Three of our starters have no track record of success with 2 being rookies. They must have been watching the same spring training games and not realizing these games are practice sessions and mean little in April.

[Lateral Quicks]

A decent chance in the playoffs? Probably not, as aside from Stroman they don't have the high-impact starters you want in a short series. A decent chance to make the playoffs? Absolutely. The best offense in baseball can take you a long way even with mediocre pitching.

And BTW, many "professional" analysts and statistics-oriented sites had/have them making the playoffs too, so yours is a pretty extreme opinion.

I meant for the playoffs, damn auto correct. How can anyone legitimately say that this team can even finish over .500. Sure they have a great offense that is prone to streakyness. Even now they exhibit that, scoring 12 runs one game then 2 runs for the next 2games.

We don't have a top 3 pitcher on the staff, let alone a 1 or a 2. This staff is historically bad and pair that up with a sub par bullpen and there is no amount of offense that can save that.

Again if all these analysts predicted the Jays making the playoffs then what was it based on? Three of our starters have no track record of success with 2 being rookies. They must have been watching the same spring training games and not realizing these games are practice sessions and mean little in April.

Well, remember that many of these same analysts named the Jays as favourites to win the World Series after the Miami trade off-season, and they ended up with a losing record. Baseball is unpredictable.

My hope at this point is that we can hover around the .500 mark until the trade deadline, and then add a sorely needed #1 or #2 for the stretch drive. Hopefully by then one or both of Hutch and Norris have settled down.

[dagger]

It's ironic how a lot of little things can add up to big headaches. or at least leave one wondering... For example...

If Kevin Pillar doesn't have a snit in a game last season when he got pulled for a PH, doesn't get sent to the minors for two months (which was ridiculous of Gibbons/AA), then maybe he begins to get comfortable at the plate last season, then maybe we don't need to do the Happ trade, don't have to put Sanchez in the rotation and keep him in the bullpen, etc etc.

[Santoki]

A decent chance in the playoffs? Probably not, as aside from Stroman they don't have the high-impact starters you want in a short series. A decent chance to make the playoffs? Absolutely. The best offense in baseball can take you a long way even with mediocre pitching.

And BTW, many "professional" analysts and statistics-oriented sites had/have them making the playoffs too, so yours is a pretty extreme opinion.

I meant for the playoffs, damn auto correct. How can anyone legitimately say that this team can even finish over .500. Sure they have a great offense that is prone to streakyness. Even now they exhibit that, scoring 12 runs one game then 2 runs for the next 2games.

We don't have a top 3 pitcher on the staff, let alone a 1 or a 2. This staff is historically bad and pair that up with a sub par bullpen and there is no amount of offense that can save that.

Again if all these analysts predicted the Jays making the playoffs then what was it based on? Three of our starters have no track record of success with 2 being rookies. They must have been watching the same spring training games and not realizing these games are practice sessions and mean little in April.

Well, remember that many of these same analysts named the Jays as favourites to win the World Series after the Miami trade off-season, and they ended up with a losing record. Baseball is unpredictable.

My hope at this point is that we can hover around the .500 mark until the trade deadline, and then add a sorely needed #1 or #2 for the stretch drive. Hopefully by then one or both of Hutch and Norris have settled down.

We definitely have no hope of adding anything resembling an ace at the deadline. Have people suddenly forgotten that we have no money? When we were actually in a playoff position last deadline we did nothing. Now in a make or break year for management they're suddenly going to get the okay to trade assets and increase payroll significantly to get a top pitcher? Ain't happening. This is the team we're stuck with.

[Randle McMurphy]

I assume they'll just be sending Francis down. They're like the same guy and he's pitched 2 days in a row.

[BigLeagueChew]

Daniel Norris sent to AAA, Albers up. Izturis transfered to 60 day DL.