R.A Dickey: enough is enough

[Rapcity_11]

I'm confused...Are there a lot of cheap back-up catchers out there better than Thole?

[Skin Blues]

I'm confused...Are there a lot of cheap back-up catchers out there better than Thole?

Give it another month and Russell Martin will be our backup catcher.

[Sifu]

If Dickey can provide what he did last year, then he is okay value. The problem I think everyone has is that he was expected to provide way more value.

This is because the Jays haven't just paid 13 mill a year for him, they pay a roster spot, an elite pitching prospect that turned into a great pitcher, an elite catching prospect that turned into a good but off injured player and a very good minors prospect that could be a very good player.

That's the total cost when we all look at Dickey pitch and think he is crap. By those standards he is a piece of feces.

But those are sunk costs. If you just consider the incremental costs, he is being paid on par with his expected performance.

Just to add, hindsight is 20/20, but I recall many on this board hating the Dickey trade as a vast overpay, including myself. Sure there were some that liked the trade but it was terrible then and it only gets worse over time.

[The_Hater]

Dickey is indefensible at this point.
- results are atrocious, even for him
- not throwing many innings, which is supposed to be his biggest positive
- is 41, will he miraculously cover again later in the year?
- Thole - Thole - Thole!

After the debacle in the playoffs last year and all the games he single-handedly gave away in the first few months of the year, I was shocked he was brought back. If it was AA still in charge I would understand if pride was in play, but with a new front office I was optimistic they'd make the right call.

And yeah, you can buy all kinds of reclamation wild cards for $12M (see Floyd at $2M). I'd much, much rather bring 3-4 of those guys to spring training and let them fight it out for a spot (along with Hutch).

While much of what your wrote is true, the Jays would have lost one of the best pitchers in MLB the 2nd half of last season if they gave up on him.

His detractors want to claim that he stinks when things are going bad but that would force us to ignore the positives he brings and has delivered as recently as 7 months ago. At the end of the day, people just hate knuckleballers because they're frustrating.

[North_of_Border]

I'm confused...Are there a lot of cheap back-up catchers out there better than Thole?

No.
Because the problem is not that there are better backup catchers available. The difference isn't much, true.

Though the problem is that Thole is forced to start against the other teams top pitchers because Dickey just happens to be scheduled for that day..... Ideally, you would volunteerly only play your backup catcher against a weaker pitcher.

I know Martin is in a huge slump.... but that's no excuse

[Rapcity_11]

I'm confused...Are there a lot of cheap back-up catchers out there better than Thole?

No.
Because the problem is not that there are better backup catchers available. The difference isn't much, true.

Though the problem is that Thole is forced to start against the other teams top pitchers because Dickey just happens to be scheduled for that day..... Ideally, you would volunteerly only play your backup catcher against a weaker pitcher.

I know Martin is in a huge slump.... but that's no excuse

First of all, that's just a coincidence. With off days, teams rotations are almost always different than others.

Secondly, couldn't you just as easily argue that doing so maximizing your chances at winning the other 4 games?

[The_Hater]

I'm confused...Are there a lot of cheap back-up catchers out there better than Thole?

Marginally. But we were spoiled with having probably the best backup catcher in the league last season. JP Arencebia would be a lateral move and yet we used to start that bum.

[dballislife]

a few more bad starts, call up hutch and stick dickey in the pen...maybe theres a chance the knuckle ball can really throw off people in the bullpen

[xAIRNESSx]

Preach brother preach. Syndergaard man. In hind sight what the f*ck was AA thinking. Junk thrower in the AL East lol

In foresight, too.

Honestly.

I wasn't happy giving up D'Arnaud or Syndergaard one for one for Dickey, let alone giving them both up. Have no idea how AA pulled the trigger.

[KL78192020]

Dickey is great, he will pickup in late July, only 15 guaranteed losses because of him. Those loses will not be the difference between this team making the playoffs or not.

[Randle McMurphy]

a few more bad starts, call up hutch and stick dickey in the pen...maybe theres a chance the knuckle ball can really throw off people in the bullpen

Or just keep starting him and wait for him to turn it around like he's done every season he's been with the Jays instead of going with a guy who was awful last season.

[akakalakin]

The offensive numbers will be down this year, it is unreasonable to assume Dickey and Cecil will reproduce those numbers.

[The_Hater]

The offensive numbers will be down this year, it is unreasonable to assume Dickey and Cecil will reproduce those numbers.

What does the offense have to do with their pitching stats?

[akakalakin]

The offensive numbers will be down this year, it is unreasonable to assume Dickey and Cecil will reproduce those numbers.

What does the offense have to do with their pitching stats?

Assuming last year numbers. Just doesn't happen

[The_Hater]

The offensive numbers will be down this year, it is unreasonable to assume Dickey and Cecil will reproduce those numbers.

What does the offense have to do with their pitching stats?

Assuming last year numbers. Just doesn't happen

What does that even mean?

[North_of_Border]

Honestly.

I wasn't happy giving up D'Arnaud or Syndergaard one for one for Dickey, let alone giving them both up. Have no idea how AA pulled the trigger.

I remember the Mets GM saying a year later that He would have pulled the trigger on D'Arnaud alone... but the impatient Jays threw in Syndergaard after the Mets called their bluff.

Also by the way. Dickey has given up 90 HRs since 2013. The most in baseball.... ahead of stars like Dan Haren, Josh Danks, Jeremy Guthrie.

[The_Hater]

Honestly.

I wasn't happy giving up D'Arnaud or Syndergaard one for one for Dickey, let alone giving them both up. Have no idea how AA pulled the trigger.

I remember the Mets GM saying a year later that He would have pulled the trigger on D'Arnaud alone... but the impatient Jays threw in Syndergaard after the Mets called their bluff.
.

Do you have a link to this because I'm fairly confident the Mets GM would never throw another GM under the bus like that. It's generally bad practice if you want to deal with them again.

[Kurtz]

Honestly.

I wasn't happy giving up D'Arnaud or Syndergaard one for one for Dickey, let alone giving them both up. Have no idea how AA pulled the trigger.

I remember the Mets GM saying a year later that He would have pulled the trigger on D'Arnaud alone... but the impatient Jays threw in Syndergaard after the Mets called their bluff.
.

Do you have a link to this because I'm fairly confident the Mets GM would never throw another GM under the bus like that. It's generally bad practice if you want to deal with them again.

The link is hard to find, but the Mets GM did say that he would have done the trade for D'Arnaud alone.

This is not that article, but it paints the picture:
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/mets/arnaud-shot-met-opener-article-1.1242303
Here’s a snapshot of how high the Mets are on d’Arnaud: Alderson said that he tried to get two specific players from an unnamed team for Dickey, but the team balked. But when Alderson acquired d’Arnaud, the team called back and offered the same two players for d’Arnaud alone. Alderson said no, even though the Mets would’ve kept the other players acquired from Toronto.

Alderson was willing to deal Dickey for those 2 unknown prospects, but he valued D'Arnaud alone ABOVE those 2 prospects.

[ldnk]

4.31 ERA on the season and 3 earned runs in the month of May. April Dickey is done.

[s e n s i]

I'm confused...Are there a lot of cheap back-up catchers out there better than Thole?

Give it another month and Russell Martin will be our backup catcher.

haha deada**