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ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over

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ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#1 » by pantalones » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:49 pm

Coincidentally enough, right below the Jays article is a write up about Eric Thames.

http://www.espn.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/78871/real-or-not-blue-jays-are-finished-nobody-hotter-than-eric-thames
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#2 » by North_of_Border » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:33 pm

The Season is Over.

I think at this point the Jays should start to test the trade market on their player value. Jays are an old team past their prime. A short rebuild would be the best thing to do now.

I mean the Jays are dangerously close to become the old Phillies from a few years ago. Only difference is that the Jays washed up veterans are not all locked up long term. The worst thing they can do at this point is extend these guys. They should be traded to the highest bidder.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#3 » by The_Hater » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:02 pm

North_of_Border wrote:The Season is Over.

I think at this point the Jays should start to test the trade market on their player value. Jays are an old team past their prime. A short rebuild would be the best thing to do now.

I mean the Jays are dangerously close to become the old Phillies from a few years ago. Only difference is that the Jays washed up veterans are not all locked up long term. The worst thing they can do at this point is extend these guys. They should be traded to the highest bidder.


Nobody is going to trade for a bunch of slumping, overpaid vets in April, you have to let them regain some value to even test the market. Even then you're looking at players like Martin and JB where you're going to have to eat a lot of salary.

Not necessarily you but I do find it funny that people were upset when the Jays weren't pushing in all their chips into the middle on Price and Edwin to bring them back but now they're looking st all the aging vets with huge contracts still here and want to dump them asap. Thankfully we've got much smarter people than Anthopoulos in charge of things now. AA created a very small window for success in back in 2015.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#4 » by pantalones » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:39 pm

The_Hater wrote:
North_of_Border wrote:The Season is Over.

I think at this point the Jays should start to test the trade market on their player value. Jays are an old team past their prime. A short rebuild would be the best thing to do now.

I mean the Jays are dangerously close to become the old Phillies from a few years ago. Only difference is that the Jays washed up veterans are not all locked up long term. The worst thing they can do at this point is extend these guys. They should be traded to the highest bidder.


Nobody is going to trade for a bunch of slumping, overpaid vets in April, you have to let them regain some value to even test the market. Even then you're looking at players like Martin and JB where you're going to have to eat a lot of salary.

Not necessarily you but I do find it funny that people were upset when the Jays weren't pushing in all their chips into the middle on Price and Edwin to bring them back but now they're looking st all the aging vets with huge contracts still here and want to dump them asap. Thankfully we've got much smarter people than Anthopoulos in charge of things now. AA created a very small window for success in back in 2015.


I agree with you, but I mean, didn't it kinda work? They made it to the ALCS 2 years in a row. They're just paying the price for it now.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#5 » by The_Hater » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:48 pm

pantalones wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
North_of_Border wrote:The Season is Over.

I think at this point the Jays should start to test the trade market on their player value. Jays are an old team past their prime. A short rebuild would be the best thing to do now.

I mean the Jays are dangerously close to become the old Phillies from a few years ago. Only difference is that the Jays washed up veterans are not all locked up long term. The worst thing they can do at this point is extend these guys. They should be traded to the highest bidder.


Nobody is going to trade for a bunch of slumping, overpaid vets in April, you have to let them regain some value to even test the market. Even then you're looking at players like Martin and JB where you're going to have to eat a lot of salary.

Not necessarily you but I do find it funny that people were upset when the Jays weren't pushing in all their chips into the middle on Price and Edwin to bring them back but now they're looking st all the aging vets with huge contracts still here and want to dump them asap. Thankfully we've got much smarter people than Anthopoulos in charge of things now. AA created a very small window for success in back in 2015.


I agree with you, but I mean, didn't it kinda work? They made it to the ALCS 2 years in a row. They're just paying the price for it now.


I was never against the direction he took. It had been a long time since the Jays were exciting. I'm also happy with who we have runnin gthe show now.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#6 » by -MetA4- » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:49 pm

The_Hater wrote:Nobody is going to trade for a bunch of slumping, overpaid vets in April, you have to let them regain some value to even test the market. Even then you're looking at players like Martin and JB where you're going to have to eat a lot of salary.


Most of our tradeable assets are pitchers and Donaldson/Pillar. I don't think that anyone believes Martin to be very movable regardless of what he really does; he'd have to go on an absolute tear to really become a trade option, and even then we'd likely have to eat salary.

The good thing is that our actual trade options (Estrada, Liriano, Pillar) are all looking good even with the **** record. We just need Donaldson and Happ to come back as well.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#7 » by vaff87 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:51 pm

-MetA4- wrote:
The_Hater wrote:Nobody is going to trade for a bunch of slumping, overpaid vets in April, you have to let them regain some value to even test the market. Even then you're looking at players like Martin and JB where you're going to have to eat a lot of salary.


Most of our tradeable assets are pitchers and Donaldson/Pillar. I don't think that anyone believes Martin to be very movable regardless of what he really does; he'd have to go on an absolute tear to really become a trade option, and even then we'd likely have to eat salary.

The good thing is that our actual trade options (Estrada, Liriano, Pillar) are all looking good even with the **** record. We just need Donaldson and Happ to come back as well.


What about Morales? I would think his contract would make him pretty tradable, but I don't know.

Also, what about Osuna? I'm guessing they would consider trading him. He's probably pretty valuable, and bad teams don't need good closers. :lol:
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#8 » by The_Hater » Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:59 pm

The problem with Morales is he's a DH and the general consensus was the Jays paid him too much, too long. He would have to tear the cover off the ball to be a sought after commodity.

They likely keep the young guys with controllable years like Osuna, Sanchez, Stro and Travis.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#9 » by BramptonYute » Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:10 pm

Estrada, Happ and Liriano hopefully do well and return some solid prospects

JD nets you a nice haul for sure

Pillar gets you something nice too.

Everyone else is pretty trash and overpaid.

Still, those 5 guys could put the farm system at the top of the MLB
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#10 » by Schad » Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:48 pm

We're still a minimum of two months from major moves. Now the cheering shifts from wins and losses to hoping for good performances from our pitching staff, and hoping Troy Tulowitzki gets hot and someone loses their faculties.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#11 » by North_of_Border » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:35 pm

I think you can deal Tulo, Martin and Jose if they slightly get hot and become fools gold. Jays would have to eat a lot of salary but think of it this way. Would you rather pay them 100% to stink it up for a long time or pay maybe 30% of their salaries and let someone else deal with them.

I think you eat salary and deal em.... no?

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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#12 » by Schad » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:05 am

Depending on the player, slightly hot isn't likely to get it done. If Jose goes on an early-summer tear, sure...you can probably move him for something, though not a big something. You eat a couple mil remaining on his pro-rated deal, get back someone's 8th-best prospect, that sort of thing. Martin's nigh on impossible to move, even eating salary...he's two years deep into what increasingly looks like a terminal decline, and no one is likely to bite on a month or two of solid hitting.

Part of the issue with Tulo is that there aren't that many teams likely to be in contention that are in dire need a shortstop or third baseman (I'd imagine that would be a more logical transition for him than 2B), and he no longer hits well enough to be a good 1B/DH option as he ages off the position.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#13 » by Lateral Quicks » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:48 am

I think Tulo and Martin are very movable. Both remain above average defenders at premium positions, and they still bring a decent amount offensively (as of last year, anyway). You probably won't get much for them, but I don't see why a straight salary dump wouldn't be feasible for each one.

I doubt we move Osuna unless the haul it phenomenal. He's still super young with plenty of control left. He'll still be a key component of the team by the time the Jays have hopefully rebuilt for another run.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#14 » by johanliebert » Sat Apr 22, 2017 6:03 am

Just 140 more games to go guys,
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#15 » by Natural11 » Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:08 pm

vaff87 wrote:Also, what about Osuna? I'm guessing they would consider trading him. He's probably pretty valuable, and bad teams don't need good closers. :lol:


What's the point in trading a very good 21 year old for prospect(s)? He is a prospect, and a cheap one. Lol

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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#16 » by Strav » Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:58 pm

there is a reason why the deadline happens when it does :-?
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#17 » by vaff87 » Sat Apr 22, 2017 5:15 pm

Natural11 wrote:
vaff87 wrote:Also, what about Osuna? I'm guessing they would consider trading him. He's probably pretty valuable, and bad teams don't need good closers. :lol:


What's the point in trading a very good 21 year old for prospect(s)? He is a prospect, and a cheap one. Lol

If this ship sinks, the old guys need to go.


Because bad teams don't need elite closers, and he would bring in a ton in a trade. I like him, but he would bring more value in a trade.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#18 » by Skin Blues » Sat Apr 22, 2017 5:33 pm

Natural11 wrote:
vaff87 wrote:Also, what about Osuna? I'm guessing they would consider trading him. He's probably pretty valuable, and bad teams don't need good closers. :lol:


What's the point in trading a very good 21 year old for prospect(s)? He is a prospect, and a cheap one. Lol

If this ship sinks, the old guys need to go.

Osuna stops being cheap next year when he hits arbitration. Papelbon got $6.25M in almost the exact same situation. That was 9 years earlier and there's been crazy inflation since then. Osuna hasn't been a mere prospect since 2014; 2015 onward he has been a legitimate full-time closer. I don't want us to pack it in yet, but if/when we do, he'll be one of the first guys gone. We might pick one of these young guys to build around, but it better not be a relief pitcher.
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Re: RE: Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#19 » by North_of_Border » Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:15 pm

If ams when the Blue Jays are fully rebuilding. They Trade their veteran starters. Open up spors in the rotation. Then wouldn't it make sense to convert the only 21 year old Osuna into a starter?

The ship has not sailed yet.
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Re: ESPN article on the Jays, proclaiming season is already over 

Post#20 » by Mak » Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:37 pm

I don't know about Osuna long term. His fastball is so flat and his location is not so great. I would trade him no problem.

When is it officially over? will it be over if we are 8 and 26 in another 17 games? Too bad teams cant trade draft picks, though I guess prospects are more valuable anyways.

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