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ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10)

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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#121 » by Schad » Fri Apr 28, 2017 2:45 am

So_Fresh wrote:how long before Gibby and this coaching staff is fired?


Why does it matter? This isn't the fault of the coaching staff.

In 2015, Brook Jacoby was the hitting coach for one of the best offenses of the post-war era. In 2016, he was the hitting coach for an average offense. This year, he's presiding over one of the worst offenses in baseball. His effect on any of those three seasons is, as with most hitting coaches, fairly marginal in the grand scheme. As will be the impact of whoever replaces him.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#122 » by So_Fresh » Fri Apr 28, 2017 3:15 am

Gotta put the blame on somebody Schad. Either it's the manager and his coaching staff, or the people running the show at the top.

The Blue Jays are going to lose a lot of viewers and fans with this kind of baseball. I'm one of them. I had plans to take my family to a bunch of games this summer. Losing isn't good. I don't care who it is and what the circumstances are.
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Re: RE: Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#123 » by RalphWiggum » Fri Apr 28, 2017 3:16 am

TOStateofMind wrote:Lol of course. Osuna hasn't looked right all season.

If Jesus gets the praise when he gets it done he should get the blame when he tanks. It's all decided by Jesus!
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Re: RE: Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#124 » by RalphWiggum » Fri Apr 28, 2017 3:17 am

JaysRule15 wrote:Did Osuna do zero conditioning work this offseason?

Jesus told him it was unnecessary.
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Re: RE: Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#125 » by Mak » Fri Apr 28, 2017 3:26 am

RalphWiggum wrote:
TOStateofMind wrote:Lol of course. Osuna hasn't looked right all season.

If Jesus gets the praise when he gets it done he should get the blame when he tanks. It's all decided by Jesus!


always been annoyed when players do their "thank Jesus" motion , in this case after a save but by hitters all the time after a hit. Such lack of self awareness and making next logical thought, why jesus is involved in deciding who wins MLB games? I get how when you make MLB your life views might change. If at 5 years old you pray to be a MLB player and then it happens, it makes it easier to think you were picked by Jesus to be something great.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#126 » by Schad » Fri Apr 28, 2017 3:35 am

So_Fresh wrote:Gotta put the blame on somebody Schad. Either it's the manager and his coaching staff, or the people running the show at the top.


Or, like, the inevitable consequence of the previous GM building an incredibly old team with no prospect depth to make a playoff run or two, which was painfully predictable.

The Blue Jays are going to lose a lot of viewers and fans with this kind of baseball. I'm one of them. I had plans to take my family to a bunch of games this summer. Losing isn't good. I don't care who it is and what the circumstances are.


Didn't you already give up on the season and say you weren't going to post anymore?
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#127 » by Steven1562 » Fri Apr 28, 2017 4:15 am

So_Fresh wrote:Gotta put the blame on somebody Schad. Either it's the manager and his coaching staff, or the people running the show at the top.

The Blue Jays are going to lose a lot of viewers and fans with this kind of baseball. I'm one of them. I had plans to take my family to a bunch of games this summer. Losing isn't good. I don't care who it is and what the circumstances are.


Firing the coaching staff isn't gonna do much. The Blue Jays are just old. Hiring a new manager and coaching staff isn't gonna make Jose hit like he used to. Why fire Shapiro he hasn't had a chance to create his own team yet? If the Jays go full rebuild and lose viewers so be it. It's better than trying to add more patch work on an old core hoping they can make one last run. I don't know what fans want? We made our bed with those trades Anthopoulos made now we have to lay in it.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#128 » by dagger » Fri Apr 28, 2017 4:29 am

Schad wrote:
So_Fresh wrote:how long before Gibby and this coaching staff is fired?


Why does it matter? This isn't the fault of the coaching staff.

In 2015, Brook Jacoby was the hitting coach for one of the best offenses of the post-war era. In 2016, he was the hitting coach for an average offense. This year, he's presiding over one of the worst offenses in baseball. His effect on any of those three seasons is, as with most hitting coaches, fairly marginal in the grand scheme. As will be the impact of whoever replaces him.


I agree. The talent just isn't good enough. An old, slow team, which removes some of the options a manager can have. Basically, Gibby is managing the pre-game lineup card, more than the in-game. And as we head into a rebuild or retooling - call it what you want - there is no point bringing in a new manager who is going to fail until there is a critical mass of quality young talent on hand.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#129 » by dagger » Fri Apr 28, 2017 4:34 am

So_Fresh wrote:Gotta put the blame on somebody Schad. Either it's the manager and his coaching staff, or the people running the show at the top.

The Blue Jays are going to lose a lot of viewers and fans with this kind of baseball. I'm one of them. I had plans to take my family to a bunch of games this summer. Losing isn't good. I don't care who it is and what the circumstances are.


I intend to go to some games once the roof is open, Donaldson is back, etc. It's still a great sport to watch. Maybe having sat through several miserable seasons of the Raptors, and watching terrible Leaf teams and all the other dross that has been tossed around the Toronto sports scene has made me appreciate the value of the spectacle, not just winning.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#130 » by dagger » Fri Apr 28, 2017 4:36 am

Schad wrote:Casey Lawrence may not be the saviour.


Oberholtzer and Bolsinger have been better of late for Buffalo. I think we saw Casey at the Bat for the last time today.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#131 » by JaysRule15 » Fri Apr 28, 2017 5:33 am

You know what, this may be actually be a blessing. If we're going to lose, I'd rather it be convincingly like this. This way, there will be no regrets or second-guessing if we decide to sell at the deadline. No one is going to say, "man, they should've waited till summer and this team would've made a run".

Also, no draft lottery in the MLB guys. Worst team gets the first pick. Now, I don't think this team is going to finish in last place unless there's a very drastic selloff soon. But a bottom five finish will get us a good pick plus a lot of slot money to play with. We have a very good scouting team led by Ben Cherington. Let's hope these guys can find us some gems in the draft and through trades.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#132 » by Schad » Fri Apr 28, 2017 6:44 am

JaysRule15 wrote:You know what, this may be actually be a blessing. If we're going to lose, I'd rather it be convincingly like this. This way, there will be no regrets or second-guessing if we decide to sell at the deadline. No one is going to say, "man, they should've waited till summer and this team would've made a run".

Also, no draft lottery in the MLB guys. Worst team gets the first pick. Now, I don't think this team is going to finish in last place unless there's a very drastic selloff soon. But a bottom five finish will get us a good pick plus a lot of slot money to play with. We have a very good scouting team led by Ben Cherington. Let's hope these guys can find us some gems in the draft and through trades.


Agreed. Also, the top ten picks in the draft cannot be forfeit for free agent compensation. We may not go out immediately and start throwing around money, but if teams are balking at surrendering a first rounder for a QO'd free agent and it's driving their price below market value, we can get them for a second.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#133 » by dagger » Fri Apr 28, 2017 5:58 pm

Schad wrote:
JaysRule15 wrote:You know what, this may be actually be a blessing. If we're going to lose, I'd rather it be convincingly like this. This way, there will be no regrets or second-guessing if we decide to sell at the deadline. No one is going to say, "man, they should've waited till summer and this team would've made a run".

Also, no draft lottery in the MLB guys. Worst team gets the first pick. Now, I don't think this team is going to finish in last place unless there's a very drastic selloff soon. But a bottom five finish will get us a good pick plus a lot of slot money to play with. We have a very good scouting team led by Ben Cherington. Let's hope these guys can find us some gems in the draft and through trades.


Agreed. Also, the top ten picks in the draft cannot be forfeit for free agent compensation. We may not go out immediately and start throwing around money, but if teams are balking at surrendering a first rounder for a QO'd free agent and it's driving their price below market value, we can get them for a second.


Also, Bowden wrote a column - I think last weekend - in which he said there is going to be an early market for trades this year, and teams that sell early may well do better, not worse, than deadline dealers. The theory being why not get four months out of a player instead of two and a half. He specifically referenced the Jays in this regard.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#134 » by LLJ » Fri Apr 28, 2017 6:38 pm

So_Fresh wrote:Gotta put the blame on somebody Schad. Either it's the manager and his coaching staff, or the people running the show at the top.

The Blue Jays are going to lose a lot of viewers and fans with this kind of baseball. I'm one of them. I had plans to take my family to a bunch of games this summer. Losing isn't good. I don't care who it is and what the circumstances are.


Many of us said the possibility of this team flaming out this year was 50/50. Guess we know which 50 now. :lol: :(

After the Price-Tulo trades, some posters here warned everyone to enjoy the next 2 years to the fullest because the ones following could get ugly. AA went *all in* with the knowledge that it was probably a 2 year shot only. I hope you at least enjoyed the previous 2 years.

Sorry about your upcoming summer plans though. There's always TFC.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#135 » by johanliebert » Fri Apr 28, 2017 6:40 pm

I guess great hitters always come around. Jose has looked good at the plate this week.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#136 » by BramptonYute » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:00 pm

Schad wrote:
JaysRule15 wrote:You know what, this may be actually be a blessing. If we're going to lose, I'd rather it be convincingly like this. This way, there will be no regrets or second-guessing if we decide to sell at the deadline. No one is going to say, "man, they should've waited till summer and this team would've made a run".

Also, no draft lottery in the MLB guys. Worst team gets the first pick. Now, I don't think this team is going to finish in last place unless there's a very drastic selloff soon. But a bottom five finish will get us a good pick plus a lot of slot money to play with. We have a very good scouting team led by Ben Cherington. Let's hope these guys can find us some gems in the draft and through trades.


Agreed. Also, the top ten picks in the draft cannot be forfeit for free agent compensation. We may not go out immediately and start throwing around money, but if teams are balking at surrendering a first rounder for a QO'd free agent and it's driving their price below market value, we can get them for a second.

didnt that whole thing change in the new cba?

I thought it was changed to teams just giving up a third round draft pick now.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#137 » by dagger » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:06 pm

Salty has been DFA'd. Not surprisingly.
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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#138 » by dagger » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:07 pm

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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#139 » by dagger » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:16 pm

Salty has been DFA'd. Not surprisingly.

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Re: ST6: Blue Jays (5-14) vs. Cardinals (9-10) 

Post#140 » by Skin Blues » Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:59 pm

Imagine being DFA'd so the team can call up a replacement with a .409 OPS in AAA. I suppose a 62% K-rate can make anything possible.

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