Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide

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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#61 » by MartinToVaught » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:14 pm

Turner4MVP wrote:
MartinToVaught wrote:Is there any proof at all that Hernandez was mentally ill, or is this just another example of sports fans making excuses for athletes that they'd never make for anyone else?

And even if he was mentally ill, it's no excuse for what he did. Playing the mental illness card to excuse violent criminals' actions only furthers the stigmas that neuro-atypical people have to live with in society.


You got me. I am making excuses for someone killing 4+ people because I watch football. I think it's pretty obvious Aarron Hernandez had mental health issues.

If it's so obvious, where's the proof? Why couldn't it simply be a character issue instead of a mental issue?
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#62 » by laika » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:15 pm

Turner4MVP wrote:We evolved from monkeys. We had to kill people to survive. And, you guys are surprised that our genetics might not lead to a utopia of everyone singing kumbaya while holding hands? There will always be genetic defects -- but, we can help those people if we show more compassion -- which will then in turn prevent tragedies from happening which kill innocent, good people. Showing compassion for people like Aaron Hernandez doesn't have to be altruistic.


What about compassion for his victims? Often justice and harsh punishments for violent crimes is the most compassionate strategy.

As for free will- No one can really say if humans actually have free will. However, our society will not function if you don't act as if people can make choices. The fact is that Hernandez had an extremely strong incentive to avoid a criminal lifestyle and he chose one anyways. Maybe he was just an extreme outlier that due to genetics/upbringing was inevitably going to be a criminal.
But Hernandez himself would probably just laugh at you if you tried to convince him to end his criminal activities before he got caught. And compassion can't possibly extend to letting him get away with murder.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#63 » by ALL HAIL » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:15 pm

MartinToVaught wrote:Is there any proof at all that Hernandez was mentally ill, or is this just another example of sports fans making excuses for athletes that they'd never make for anyone else?

And even if he was mentally ill, it's no excuse for what he did. Playing the mental illness card to excuse violent criminals' actions only furthers the stigmas that neuro-atypical people have to live with in society.

We're all "mentally ill" in som form or fashion.

If our "shadows" could tell the the world all of our secrets, I think I'd be proven right.
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Re: RE: Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#64 » by chrismikayla » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:16 pm

TurboTitan wrote:This is sad, he deserved to suffer a painful death

Hanging yourself is a bad way to go you don't just pass away peacefully.

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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#65 » by NBAFan93 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:17 pm

I didn't follow this case. Article says was acquitted of the two murders recently? Did he actually not do them, or was the acquittal related to a technicality of evidence or something like self defense? Article also said the attorney was going to work on getting the other case overturned? It makes it sound like there was a chance he could get out someday.

Also, this prison he's in has had 27 suicides since 2010? That sounds pretty high to me? Or is that typical for maximum security places where people serve life sentences?
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#66 » by MartinToVaught » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:20 pm

Turner4MVP wrote:http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/former-patriots-adviser-admits-team-knew-aaron-hernandez-had-issues/

According to a Wall Street Journal story from 2013, shortly before the 2010 draft, a scouting service prepared a psychological profile available to every team that described Hernandez as "living on the edge of acceptable behavior,"

There's a big difference between unacceptable behavior and mental illness. His behavior could have easily just been due to getting in with the wrong crowd and consistently making bad choices as a result.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#67 » by TurboTitan » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:21 pm

Aaron Hernandez’s former agent says there’s “no chance” the ex-Patriots tight end committed suicide
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#69 » by ALL HAIL » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:22 pm

People who can't find hope enough to stay alive remind me of this:

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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#70 » by The Moose » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:23 pm

bmurph128 wrote:
ALL HAIL wrote:
The Moose wrote:
And you wouldn't consider it selfish to ask someone to keep living when their own existence is crushingly painful, just for your sake?

You're assuming that suicidal people communicate their plans. My experience tells me that most times they don't.

But to continue in your analogy, if someone I loved communicated with me the fact that they're in pain and want it to end, yes, it would be selfish on my part, after trying to get them help, to deny them an opportunity to be free from their pain.

But, like I said, most people, through my experience, usually commit suicide quietly, without uttering a word to loved ones, which only makes it harder on those that love them because they are strapped with the guilt of "I should've done more."



That could be construed as selfish, but life isn't that simple. It's not "selfish if you do, selfish if I ask you not to" - there's a host of factors at play here.

On a human level, if someone came up to you and told you they were contemplating suicide, why would you advise them not to do it? Not for your benefit. Suicide is an extreme overreaction to how our thought processes work - have you ever been running late for something important?

Have a little after-action meeting with yourself afterward - it's interesting to delve into your own mind and see how it works. From a young age, we have extreme overreactions to what we perceive to be negative experiences: "I can't do that, my parents would KILL me"; "If I'm late for work, my boss will KILL me"; "If I don't make that sale, I'm DEAD".

Being late for something REALLY important is where it gets interesting - say, a big meeting at work - you speed like crazy to try to make it on time. Afterward if you analyze your thoughts, you realize that you essentially added risk to your well being for fear of something that, in relation to your life, is worthless. Another way to think about it is you're betting your life savings to win $100.

People that kill themselves take this kind of thought (that exists in all of us) to an extreme. I do agree that it's selfish, and I don't think asking someone to not kill themselves could ever be construed as selfish - because what you're trying to do is show them that their life is worth more than being late for work.

People serving a life sentence in prison is a little different - we weren't in his head so we don't know. He could have thought this a selfless act (daughter won't be ridiculed so much at school; tax payers; daughter having to visit prison to see him) - or he could have been thinking that it really sucked in prison and he didn't want to do it anymore. Either way, asking someone to stay alive is not selfish because people exaggerate their circumstances.


I'm not saying its selfish to ask though. It's understandable for you to hope someone you know wouldn't ever choose actions with such finality.
However, I think it is a little selfish to think that if the person doesn't listen to this advice or cannot understand it, they are purposefully spiting others, or only thinking about themselves.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#71 » by BadMofoPimp » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:27 pm

TurboTitan wrote:Aaron Hernandez’s former agent says there’s “no chance” the ex-Patriots tight end committed suicide


Has this "agent" ever been treated like a God while surrounded by yes men doing whatever the hell he wants then losing it all due to his inflated ego to spend the rest of his life in prison while about everyone in the world thinks the worst of you. Until that happens to a person, you can never predict how they will react.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#72 » by Scalabrine » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:31 pm

ALL HAIL wrote:
Scalabrine wrote:
ALL HAIL wrote:If people love you, it's selfish. Period.

Why hurt those who love you? Death and mourning is hard.


Well by that logic, killing people (thus doing life behind bars) is selfish too.

I am completely anti-jail, but going to jail, even forever, is not suicide.


I didn't say it was. I'm just pointing out that having your husband or father in jail for your entire life is still very hard. You could argue just as hard if not harder.
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Re: Aaron Hernandez Found Dead Apparent Suicide 

Post#73 » by FNQ » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:32 pm

In most cases I wouldn't be proud of my initial reaction to this news.

But there are cases of addition by subtraction, and I think humanity comes out on top after this news. RIP (again) to his many victims.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#74 » by ALL HAIL » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:36 pm

Scalabrine wrote:
ALL HAIL wrote:
Scalabrine wrote:
Well by that logic, killing people (thus doing life behind bars) is selfish too.

I am completely anti-jail, but going to jail, even forever, is not suicide.


I didn't say it was. I'm just pointing out that having your husband or father in jail for your entire life is still very hard. You could argue just as hard if not harder.

Ask anyone you know who lost someone in their "prime" years if they would choose never seeing them again but receiving a letter from the one they love a few times a year over them being dead, and the choice shouldn't surprise you.

That's all I'm saying.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#75 » by CoolBreeze2222 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:39 pm

You usually become who you surround yourself with. Dude should have been in the weight room, catching footballs, watching netflix, and taking vacations while counting his millions and shining all of his Super Bowl rings. Instead he CHOSE to hang with gangbangers, drug dealers, and loser criminals going nowhere. Look where that led him.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#76 » by geminiz » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:41 pm

now join Chuck Berry (convicted robbery, pedophile) on the list of wash-ups whose celebrity/media/sport friends suddenly miss and love so much on twitter.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#77 » by red_power » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:49 pm

Jesus all his life story, it was an ultimate choke
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#78 » by BlazersBroncos » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:50 pm

Looks like he took my 'Hang in There' card a bit too literal.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#79 » by EAS Law » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:51 pm

I read the ESPN article and felt pretty disgusted by how they tried to humanize this POS by focusing on him blowing for kisses and playing football.

This prick was famous because he could catch a football and was a large person. He also cold blooded murdered people for spilling drinks and "disrespecting" him.

Anyone that would even begin to reason that he's somehow a victim in all of this is an idiot. Don't pretend to be some transcendent being of enlightenment. There is no spiritual element or mystery to this. He was a prick that had everyone kiss his ass a majority of his pathetic life because he was real gud at da footballz--so he felt that he could do whatever he wanted.

Glad he's dead.
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Re: OT: Former Pat's Tight End Hernandez Commits Suicide 

Post#80 » by CountOnAlex » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:52 pm

ALL HAIL wrote:
CountOnAlex wrote:
ALL HAIL wrote:If people love you, it's selfish. Period.

Why hurt those who love you? Death and mourning is hard.


it's not that black and white man.

some would consider you being the selfish one because you don't want to go through the mourning process after a death. but do you really know and understand what is going on in this persons mind? they're obviously feeling some sort of way that is unexplainable to anyone. it's an ongoing battle inside of them and eventually they say enough is enough.

i worked a long time in a hospital around mental health patients. it's sad and hope one day we can solve all mental health illness quick.

I feel you man, but it is that simple if you actually care about those you love.

Any suicidal thought I may have ever had was quickly quelled at the thought of the pain it would cause my family.

I care for them too much to cause them unnecessary pain.

But people who commit suicide are too self absorbed to consider others.

Suicide, in mostly all cases, means you're weak and selfish. I'm sorry.


Not everyone is wired the same way. You may think one way but the next person in the same shoes has a different mindset.

The only thing we can do is try to get these people help rather than blame them for problems that might be out of their control.
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