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Invictus88 wrote:

joedumars1 wrote:Wiseman starting over duren

No. Duren out with back spasms.

Oh thanks, he was in the box score

Wiseman has been effective going quickly. In fact most of our offense has worked when we've gone early.

Cade pounding the ball vs. BOS halfcourt D is not where we want to be. Keep probing & moving the ball.

"The Celtics are having too much fun out there"

JD Davison either needs a haircut, or to audition for being a Muppet.

Cades not been shooting right since he popped up with the knee injury. Might as well shut him down at this point.

Our rosters a complete joke. That trade with Knicks looks bad now were playing a bunch of gleaguers. Not that BB and Burks were good but they were at least playable rotation players that could shoot.

Weaver should be fired at the end of the season. After all those years of tanking this is the worst we’ve ever been.

This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

Cowology wrote:This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

Agree on all points. And it’s been tough to watch the full rebuild but we’re close to see if it worked. Obviously this summer will be huge. What are we going to get w all that cap?

Cowology wrote:This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

As someone who has only seen the Pistons a few times this season, I'd say they have talent well above their record. Detroit has some young players with potential. It's just one of those situations where they're too inexperienced to win.

With a good draft pick thanks to that out-of-context bad record and some wise salary management, this is the type of situation that can lead to a turnaround.

i'll not pile onto the misery that is our season, but instead commend the celtics for how absolutely dominant they've been this regular season. their net rating of +12.0 is better than the 73-win warriors or any other team in the last 20 years (didn't want to go back forever). they've only lost 3 games by more than 10 points which is impressive because the average margin of victory this season is 12.5. they've won 17 games by 20 or more.

obviously the celtics have had questions about playoff success in the past but with the acquisitions of jrue and KP they look utterly dominant so far.

Once Buddy came in, I just turned it off.. There needs to be more movement without the ball. Quit making it so damn easy for the defense.

Thing is if Cade is injury prone we’re screwed. He might be? Also maybe he is just this crazy streaky, that would really suck. Ausar is the one I’m hoping gets a shot and it suxks cause it was hitting last few weeks. Let’s hope everything goes well with the blood
Clot

Cowology wrote:This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

It's the worst and while there are young players with seemingly some growth potential on the roster, there's no guarantee that they'll ever be more than perpetually bad.
There's zero development happening, I see little if any growth in any of these players outside of Cade upping his efficiency somewhat, so I see absolutely nothing in terms of development to think that this will get better anytime soon if ever. Sure, they'll likely be better than a 12-15 win team next season but they're so far from even being merely competitive that it's hard to envision this current group anywhere.

What I think they need to do is identify two guys from this core that they're building around and trade the other two while they still have any semblance of value and bring in more advanced players that fit. If Cade-Ivey-Thompson-Duren is a thing next season, this offseason is a failure. That core will NEVER win big in this league. I think they should build around Cade and Thompson and trade the low IQ duo elsewhere until they turn into Dennis Smith Jr. and Drummond and sewer their value.

Oh and if Monty is still coach next season, I might not even bother to watch.

Cowology wrote:This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

Get back to me on this particular point at the end of the offseason...

Cowology wrote:This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

Get back to me on this particular point at the end of the offseason...

NYPiston wrote:

Cowology wrote:This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

It's the worst and while there are young players with seemingly some growth potential on the roster, there's no guarantee that they'll ever be more than perpetually bad.
There's zero development happening, I see little if any growth in any of these players outside of Cade upping his efficiency somewhat, so I see absolutely nothing in terms of development to think that this will get better anytime soon if ever. Sure, they'll likely be better than a 12-15 win team next season but they're so far from even being merely competitive that it's hard to envision this current group anywhere.

What I think they need to do is identify two guys from this core that they're building around and trade the other two while they still have any semblance of value and bring in more advanced players that fit. If Cade-Ivey-Thompson-Duren is a thing next season, this offseason is a failure. That core will NEVER win big in this league. I think they should build around Cade and Thompson and trade the low IQ duo elsewhere until they turn into Dennis Smith Jr. and Drummond and sewer their value.

Oh and if Monty is still coach next season, I might not even bother to watch.

I basically agree. We should consolidate talent and packaging Ivey/Duren makes sense. But again, that's a path fwd. I'm not sitting here saying nothing needs to change, I'm just saying it's not hopeless. There are ways to right the ship.

At the end of the day we're all going to have our own thoughts on what that should look like, but I'm hopeful this can be salvaged.

Cade's health is the biggest thing that concerns me. I'm not a huge fan of the style of ball he plays, but he's good enough to make it work. If healthy.

He's going to get max for sure, and that could go toxic quickly if his history proves to be prophetic. Hopefully that is not the case.

A former boss used to tell me "Hope is not a plan", but it kinda feels like that's what we got. A lot hinges on Cade staying healthy.

After we cross that very basic threshold, then we can start talking about the supporting cast & fit. IF all our guys did develop, we wouldn't be able to keep them all anyway. So we gotta start making those tough decisions about who stays, and nobody (including Cade) should be off limits.

I'm still waiting on Monty. I know 99% of fans want his head, but development takes time. Very good chance he's trash, but maybe not. I'm willing to be a bit more patient on that one.

This off-season is going to be big for Weaver. It could go very very well, or very very poorly. We'll see. *shrug*

NYPiston wrote:

Cowology wrote:This IS the worst team I've seen in my lifetime.... however, it's not the most hopeless. I'll take record-breaking bad over perpetual mediocrity any day. I know this feels bad, but truly, there are paths forward here. We aren't locked into any terrible contracts, we have some decent building blocks and lots of flexibility moving forward (if we want it). The remainder of this season is clearly about development and may be unwatchable at times, but it's still reasonable to think we may have a bright future.

There's zero development happening, I see little if any growth in any of these players outside of Cade upping his efficiency somewhat, so I see absolutely nothing in terms of development to think that this will get better anytime soon if ever.

Oh and if Monty is still coach next season, I might not even bother to watch.

I guess we see different things. In terms of development, Wiseman has gotten MUCH better this year. Stewart seems to be better offensively and not terrified to shoot. Ivey has had some good games. Duren has a pretty good post game that has improved a lot over last year. And all these guys are still young. They are going to keep getting better. 25-30 are prime years for an NBA player. We are just not there yet. And as for Monty, I have to admit that some moves have been perplexing this year, but he was coach of the year, he did help Phoenix improve, and this year was a little nuts with the injuries to our vets and him just getting involved with the team for the first time. I'm certainly willing to give him another year.

I know I keep saying this, but add a couple of new solid starters, extend Fontecchio, get Grimes healthy, get Duren and Ivey to improve their D - we should be at least play-in material for next year.