New Coach

[Blkbrd671]

While it is only Week 4, i think most of us can agree that we don't like what we've seen out of our Lions.

Our offense is predictable, our defensive front 4 seem overrated and secondary is a absolute joke, ST continues to give up plays, we are a poor disciplined team and our coaches are making questionable decisions.

If we continue to play this way, squeek out a couple of wins but ultimately don't make the playoff's and have more discipline issues with our players, does the FO make a any coaching changes, particularily Head coach,DC,OC and they'd better on ST.

If so, who would you guys like to replace them with.

i think we keep schwartz and dump everyone else.



*Anyone else find it irritating that the commentators of the Lion's game seem to be doing a better job of coaching than Schwarts.

[TSE]

Schwartz can't be a good coach with Mayhew, at least as the structure of the team currently stands with not much of a strategy department or personnel, there's just no way, it's like building a puzzle with 20 percent of the pieces missing from the box, it's not worth all of the banging of the head against the wall.

So If Schwartz stays, we would have to remove the GM, import a better GM that can help Schwartz identify a team of coordinators that can work well with him, assuming they can identify all of the flaws and holes in Schwartz's current approach. That's a lot of assumptions and hopes and I think in reality is unlikely for our franchise to get all of those things right, which means in that case that Schwartz has to go if Mayhew is to stay. Then Mayhew has to hire a new Head Coach that can circumvent the coordinator problems that Mayhew is unable to identify and solve. In that scenario then we just have to hope for one good decision being made so I think our odds are better in hoping to take that route.

This came up in the hockey forum the other week and I cast my ballot for John Gruden as my favorite choice for a Head Coach. It would be a risky move for us though if we don't have a good plan for bringing him in, he's not a good fit for every type of team situation and he would need a lot of integral support infrastructure which we presently don't have.

[Sheeeeed]

I think at this point I want to give schwartz the benefit of the doubt and say its more of a coordinator problem.
If Norv Turner gets fired from the Chargers he could be an option as OC.

The thing with replacing Mayhew means likely Schwartz is gone too. New GMs typically like to bring in their own guys.

[TSE]

Well there's no doubt that we have serious coordinator problems, but the issue is that Schwartz doesn't see there to be problems. He has confidence and a high amount of respect for what LInehan and Gunther are doing. They are on the same page and those guys along with the ST coordinator apparently are doing things the way that he wants. If he did want to make a change, then he should have already arrived at that conclusion, therefore he's either unable to admit his mistakes in trusting these football men as quality football men, or he is being restricted by Mayhew from making those changes. Either way the HC and the GM are not effective in working together and making the team better considering the loads of glaring problems that aren't being addressed.

The owner of the team should ask his GM and coaching staff to refund the majority of the money he has paid them out of principle on the account that they didn't deliver a minimum satisfactory job performance. None of these guys can justify having the right to hold their job at this point. We need serious help.

[Blkbrd671]

i'm not going to pretend like i know much about football's workings. I just can't understand how commentators can point out obvious problems with the lions, and legitimately diagram how to fix it, and yet game after game, we get beat by the same problem.

Literally seems like commentators are doing a better job with our team. Additionally, how have we not fixed our tackling problem!?

[TSE]

Gunther's system puts our players at bad angles and exposes us to more potential sloppy tackling events. He doesn't teach them how to play the game, he programs them to be drones that are prone to making mistakes and missing opportunities. He's the Danny Crossman of DCs.

[Blkbrd671]

What's the purpose of that kind of defense? in other words whats the benefit of putting the players at those bad angles etc. how does he justifiy it

[TSE]

I believe he thinks they are the correct angles and that he is training them to do the right thing for optimal success. I just have a difference of opinion, plus I don't like our roster makeup if we were to use his scheme, but the HC and GM also agree with his opinion apparently. So the problem is now a tough conundrum to solve. Who's going to do what to fix it if this premise exists as true?

In other words for you modern day moviegoers, if the whole town is zombies after drinking from the well, is it hopeful to think one of those zombies will suddenly wake up and reverse things around? That doesn't typically happen and the unfolding story is typically a tale of how long does it take for you to die, if you don't inject the cure to the poison in time, or if you don't cut off the head of the zombie in charge. Which story will we see this season?

[Blkbrd671]

well if that is truly the problem, we will continue to digress and GM will have no other choice but to make a move, hopefully on both sides of the ball. We have way to much talent on this team to suck. We have the biggest and possibly best Receiver, and most physically gifted DT.

[TSE]

We had cash in the bank and we bought 53 sports cars that I hope we have a plan for this year, otherwise how will we get paid for the depreciation cost of that many units? We are in a seriously dangerous position and are teeter-tottering over a gorge of missed opportunity. Our team is acting like a kid that is going on America's Got Talent to do a death defying balancing act, yet he has never trained properly for that kind of stunt. Preparation is pretty important before you get into something like that. There isn't a pause or rewind button.

[Blkbrd671]

What i've noticed is that we should have addressed our secondary issues last year, instead of drafting another DT.

[Icness]

I think TSE got it right with this comment:

Well there's no doubt that we have serious coordinator problems, but the issue is that Schwartz doesn't see there to be problems. He has confidence and a high amount of respect for what LInehan and Gunther are doing.

Totally agree. I can see defending Linehan because the offense does put up points, but the game has clearly passed beyond where Gunther Cunningham can be effective. It was obvious last year. There are defenses with less talent that play much better. We get to see one of those this week in Minnesota. New England is another, their talent isn't as good as Detroit's but they're a better defense. Schwartz's loyalty to VandenBosch, who IMO is done, is not helping either and he can't see the problem there too.

I have a feeling that if the Lions fall to 1-6 (which I think they will) then Gunther will be fired as Schwartz scrambles to save his own butt. Unless he has another undisciplined fit I can't see Schwartz not coaching this team next year. But we can dream...

[TSE]

What i've noticed is that we should have addressed our secondary issues last year, instead of drafting another DT.

Every year's worth of choices has at least 5 years of ripple effect. We should have addressed all of our issues 5 years ago as well as continuously reassessed every year and worked hard to improve for present and the future. We have neglected doing things properly every single year now and we aren't building enough power and equity to be worth all of these struggles because we self inflict a compromise to all of our team assets by not managing everything efficiently and strategically.

[TSE]

I think TSE got it right with this comment:

Well there's no doubt that we have serious coordinator problems, but the issue is that Schwartz doesn't see there to be problems. He has confidence and a high amount of respect for what LInehan and Gunther are doing.

Totally agree. I can see defending Linehan because the offense does put up points, but the game has clearly passed beyond where Gunther Cunningham can be effective. It was obvious last year. There are defenses with less talent that play much better. We get to see one of those this week in Minnesota. New England is another, their talent isn't as good as Detroit's but they're a better defense. Schwartz's loyalty to VandenBosch, who IMO is done, is not helping either and he can't see the problem there too.

I have a feeling that if the Lions fall to 1-6 (which I think they will) then Gunther will be fired as Schwartz scrambles to save his own butt. Unless he has another undisciplined fit I can't see Schwartz not coaching this team next year. But we can dream...

That's interesting I was thinking the same thing wondering what it would take for a firing. And I'm not even convinced we would fire anybody even at 1-6 because I don't think there's anybody out there that we could bring in for a purposeful remainder of the season, at least I doubt they will find anybody they like on such short notice after spending so much time to like the current staff that they chose and stood by. They will still have excuse cards and justification for why they could do better next year. They will say well Best was on PUP as was Greenwood, and Delmas and Houston crippled us early when it mattered, so next year we will have all of them back plus NEW draft picks, and the process will repeat. We will still improve, but instead of improving "x" percent as a team, we will once again take a half sized step which isn't enough to risk a future knock down that will eventually happen. We just aren't building enough value quick enough to sustain over the long-term.

I'd listen to Linehan's argument defending his performance based on the points that are put up, but I also want an accounting of how many points the offense created, and what portion were special benefits of having CJ on the team in general that anybody would expect to receive. I'm only interested in the point production that stems from where he is adding value to the team. If he just tried to use the middle of the field more effectively, then that would help out a lot.

[Sheeeeed]

What i've noticed is that we should have addressed our secondary issues last year, instead of drafting another DT.

If you want a good Corner you either have to draft one in the first round, or sign one in Free Agency. They tried the latter last year with Johnathan Joseph. Sure they could of drafted Amukamara, but the Giants haven't exactly got any return from draft him either. The Lions need immediate help in the secondary, not projects.

If anything they should of tried to sign Brandon Carr instead of playing games with Avril.

[TSE]

I'd still like to know how their decision making logic determined that Jerome Murphy was a good claim despite not coming to that conclusion the first time he was cut. I just feel that item should be reconciled for the sake of it, plus the act of doing so could cause some creative thought into analyzing why they made previous choices they made. Any kind of critical thinking that our staff can go through to find ideas or inspiration for improvement would be a positive opportunity.

if it makes sense to rethink about our feelings regarding one player or one of our positional groups, maybe it also makes sense to reconsider the others? Or is CB the only mystery group they don't have all the answers for?

[TSE]

Here's an interview with Danny Crossman. He has all the right answers and attitude to potentially turn his game around. Sounds like he has figured out that there is something missing that is accounting for the players flunking, and with everything he says here about his commitment to figuring it out so that he can teach the players to be successful it sounds like he is 90% of the way there to improving. All he needs is the 10% logic that he was missing and overlooked when he began teaching his programs. If he analyzes all of his ST plays on the field and can connect with the right people to help him spot those things he is missing then that would be an AMAZING help. It was our poor ST play that enabled Renaud and Harvin to earn weekly player honors against us in the last 2 weeks.

http://www.detroitlions.com/news/lions- ... a19b7baeca

The only problem is that I'm convinced that the things he is missing and can't pick up on are not something that would occur to him or that he would spot on his own so he should look to team up with any partners/aids that can help, even though I think it's still the HC's responsibility to step in and simply tell him what to do differently, but apparently the HC doesn't have the solutions so he can't get the help he needs there. He already reviews the tape and he apparently always misses a ton of things that I find but he will never find them since he's looking from the wrong logical lens. But he promised in this article that he will figure it out and get it done and the onus is on him to make sure he finds those errors or finds somebody that can point them out to him and help him recalibrate our ST training programs.

Oh and Jerome Murphy is gone from the team now, so apparently we are set at CB, or we have our sights set on an even better upgrade? I still have lots of unanswered questions, but wondering what the heck is going on in the CB planning department is just mind-boggling. I wonder if during the bye week we will see the secondary coach or HC or GM to talk more on that? I'd love to see somebody stick their neck out and reverberate Crossman's comments about the CB department, cause that's a much more difficult mess to deal with than the ST issues which are relatively simple and can be dealt with immediately and not necessarily even needing any new personnel.

[Blkbrd671]

Andy Reid looks to be losing his job, while he's not doing well with the Eagles, he has a phenomenal record , do lions consider him if Lions don't make playoffs?

[TSE]

No please, he's not qualified for our team or any NFL team.

Here is a copy/paste of my Andy Reid piece I wrote just yesterday in the PIstons forum as an example to a point I was making there...

As another example, I just wrote a criticism against Andy Reid of the Philadelphia Eagles for his comment this week that Mike Vick is his guy, "today". That's BS, Andy Reid should either say I KNOW this is the guy that is the best choice or he's not. He instead wants to wait and see if he converts and wins and if he does, then he was the guy, but if he loses, then he wasn't the guy. That's ridiculous and asinine. If you can't tell me you know how to determine if you have the right guy then you are clearly not qualified to be in charge. A good coach would say I have my guy and I'm going to win and he will go out and in fact win and with that right guy. Either you are the real deal or you are not. Andy Reid is not the real deal just as Joe D is not the real deal. Ask me if I have the right guy, and my response is don't you worry if I have the right guy or what his name is, cause that is just a detail, and I'm going to win, one way or another, and I won't allow otherwise because I'm the right guy and I'm in charge and I know what the frak I'm doing and in a very short time you will conclusively see all you need to see. Don't worry about it and just be patient for two seconds and let me make it very clear for you. Winning wards off the critics and then I won't have to be asked again.

[FlipTSO]

well, I was on the new coach bandwagon after week 4. Then last week put that thought on hold. But now at 2-4 and all the inconsistencies this year, I think a new coach may be inevitable.

Cowher and Dungy are my top 2 choices.

If they can get a a better OC here, I'd be willing to give Schwartz one more year though. As the offense is clearly the main issue. And the defense, which is Schwartz' area has actually been really good.