ImageImage

Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread

Moderators: MickeyDavis, paulpressey25

User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,044
And1: 6,733
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#281 » by ReasonablySober » Thu Mar 9, 2017 6:10 pm

M-C-G wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
M-C-G wrote:
It literally comes up all of the time in any conversation, facebook post, tweet, message board, etc. when people talk get into a discussion about Ted Thompson. I don't follow this football board all that closely, but I am shocked to see what you wrote given the interactions I have about Ted.


Huh. I haven't heard or read a thing since Moss.


As a Ted supporter, with some very anti Ted friends, I get into this discussion every single fantasy football season. FWIW, I am totally fine with people wanting Ted to sign some guys and start to go for it. My problem is that too many people fail to acknowledge how many of our guys that we are actually able to retain (this looked better when we resigned Cobb and Bulaga) and that continually playing big in FA (which has very mixed results) comes at an opportunity cost. It gets glossed over way too often and people pretend you are gong to be able to always have the best of both worlds.


What makes NE unique is that they never overpay anyone. There legitimately isn't an overpaid player on their roster. They pick up players with low value, make them valuable contributors, then trade or let them walk once they get expensive. I'm not in favor of TT going out and spending huge money. That almost never works in the NFL. It's finding the depressed assets via trade and FA that he needs to work on.
User avatar
M-C-G
RealGM
Posts: 11,850
And1: 3,349
Joined: Jan 13, 2013
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#282 » by M-C-G » Thu Mar 9, 2017 7:32 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
M-C-G wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
Huh. I haven't heard or read a thing since Moss.


As a Ted supporter, with some very anti Ted friends, I get into this discussion every single fantasy football season. FWIW, I am totally fine with people wanting Ted to sign some guys and start to go for it. My problem is that too many people fail to acknowledge how many of our guys that we are actually able to retain (this looked better when we resigned Cobb and Bulaga) and that continually playing big in FA (which has very mixed results) comes at an opportunity cost. It gets glossed over way too often and people pretend you are gong to be able to always have the best of both worlds.


What makes NE unique is that they never overpay anyone. There legitimately isn't an overpaid player on their roster. They pick up players with low value, make them valuable contributors, then trade or let them walk once they get expensive. I'm not in favor of TT going out and spending huge money. That almost never works in the NFL. It's finding the depressed assets via trade and FA that he needs to work on.


I agree, I think Bellichek is the gold standard of GMing. I can almost guarantee you that he would have turned Sitton and Lang into draft picks a year before their time was up with us. The other factor is they can take guys that have great talent but not realizing it, come in under their culture and actually harness their ability. I think we have that same capability but don't utilize it. It is basically the opposite of the previous twenty years of the Bucks organization.
Marc Lasry wrote:There's nothing worse than being mediocre, in business and in sports.


Marc Lasry wrote:By giving them a winning culture. I believe winning trumps all, and if not, we don't want that player
User avatar
M-C-G
RealGM
Posts: 11,850
And1: 3,349
Joined: Jan 13, 2013
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#283 » by M-C-G » Thu Mar 9, 2017 8:26 pm

I know that fanspeak can give you some crazy results depending on which prospect list they use to run the sim, but I did a 4 rounder, looking at Edge, Cb, Te, Ol and am pretty damn pleased with the results

1. Takkarist McKinley UCLA- edge
2. Fabian Moreau UCLA- cb
3. David Njoku Miami - te
4. Ethan Pocic LSU - c/og

I'd be damn thrilled with that. Add your Barwin and one of Verner/House/Prince and this team is ready to roll next season.
Marc Lasry wrote:There's nothing worse than being mediocre, in business and in sports.


Marc Lasry wrote:By giving them a winning culture. I believe winning trumps all, and if not, we don't want that player
User avatar
emunney
RealGM
Posts: 38,744
And1: 7,676
Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Location: Trusting in Thannies

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#284 » by emunney » Thu Mar 9, 2017 10:58 pm

Njoku at the end of the 3rd seems impossible, right?
Mega Giannis!
NY Daily News wrote:Eddy Curry claims he slept for only two hours Sunday night because he couldn't stop thinking about ghosts.
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,044
And1: 6,733
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#285 » by ReasonablySober » Thu Mar 9, 2017 11:01 pm

emunney wrote:Njoku at the end of the 3rd seems impossible, right?


I'd be surprised if he lasts to our first pick.
User avatar
Mags FTW
RealGM
Posts: 26,579
And1: 1,768
Joined: Feb 16, 2006
Location: Flickin' It

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#286 » by Mags FTW » Fri Mar 10, 2017 1:02 am

I'm surprised you guys exert the mental energy on a lot of this stuff. Every year there are Jaylon Smiths, Myles Jacks, Reggie Raglands, etc. that totally F up the draft scenarios.
UW Head Football Coach Gary Anderson wrote:I don't know that.
Profound23
General Manager
Posts: 9,777
And1: 640
Joined: Jun 29, 2005
   

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#287 » by Profound23 » Fri Mar 10, 2017 1:27 am

Mags FTW wrote:I'm surprised you guys exert the mental energy on a lot of this stuff. Every year there are Jaylon Smiths, Myles Jacks, Reggie Raglands, etc. that totally F up the draft scenarios.



That irritates me the most. I can easily see someone like Reuben Foster or OJ Howard fall to us and we pass on them for some project who was supposed to go a round later.
I just wanted you to know that, if you can hear me, if it got into your brain somehow....that I spread my butt cheeks as Mike Honcho
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,044
And1: 6,733
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#288 » by ReasonablySober » Fri Mar 10, 2017 2:44 am

Mags FTW wrote:I'm surprised you guys exert the mental energy on a lot of this stuff. Every year there are Jaylon Smiths, Myles Jacks, Reggie Raglands, etc. that totally F up the draft scenarios.


Injuries and off field stuff are usually the reasons. I haven't been keeping up on either front. Any red flags pop up with the top guys recently? I know Foster got booted from the combine and Ramczyk seems to be falling over injury issues.
User avatar
RiotPunch
RealGM
Posts: 10,974
And1: 895
Joined: Jul 05, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#289 » by RiotPunch » Fri Mar 10, 2017 3:44 am

emunney wrote:Njoku at the end of the 3rd seems impossible, right?

Yes.
Image
Don't Kidd yourselves.
User avatar
emunney
RealGM
Posts: 38,744
And1: 7,676
Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Location: Trusting in Thannies

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#290 » by emunney » Fri Mar 10, 2017 4:41 am

Mags FTW wrote:I'm surprised you guys exert the mental energy on a lot of this stuff. Every year there are Jaylon Smiths, Myles Jacks, Reggie Raglands, etc. that totally F up the draft scenarios.


Some of us don't need to conserve it.
Mega Giannis!
NY Daily News wrote:Eddy Curry claims he slept for only two hours Sunday night because he couldn't stop thinking about ghosts.
User avatar
jimmybones
Analyst
Posts: 3,298
And1: 375
Joined: May 29, 2009

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#291 » by jimmybones » Fri Mar 10, 2017 3:52 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
M-C-G wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
Huh. I haven't heard or read a thing since Moss.


As a Ted supporter, with some very anti Ted friends, I get into this discussion every single fantasy football season. FWIW, I am totally fine with people wanting Ted to sign some guys and start to go for it. My problem is that too many people fail to acknowledge how many of our guys that we are actually able to retain (this looked better when we resigned Cobb and Bulaga) and that continually playing big in FA (which has very mixed results) comes at an opportunity cost. It gets glossed over way too often and people pretend you are gong to be able to always have the best of both worlds.


What makes NE unique is that they never overpay anyone. There legitimately isn't an overpaid player on their roster. They pick up players with low value, make them valuable contributors, then trade or let them walk once they get expensive. I'm not in favor of TT going out and spending huge money. That almost never works in the NFL. It's finding the depressed assets via trade and FA that he needs to work on.


I was just talking about this with friends. I think what really makes them unique and makes me jealous is the variety of ways they will use to improve. What you described is one of them- they certainly will take fliers on talented players that other teams are afraid of for whatever reason and seem to get the most out of them. But, they will also spend big money in FA. They also always seem to have multiple draft picks- I have no data but it certainly feels like they trade down more than most. And then they use those extra picks for talented players like Martellus Bennett and Dwayne Allen. And that's trading for a TE while having one of the best TE. All of that is creative as hell and I wish we'd do more stuff like that,
User avatar
M-C-G
RealGM
Posts: 11,850
And1: 3,349
Joined: Jan 13, 2013
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#292 » by M-C-G » Fri Mar 10, 2017 4:12 pm

jimmybones wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
M-C-G wrote:
As a Ted supporter, with some very anti Ted friends, I get into this discussion every single fantasy football season. FWIW, I am totally fine with people wanting Ted to sign some guys and start to go for it. My problem is that too many people fail to acknowledge how many of our guys that we are actually able to retain (this looked better when we resigned Cobb and Bulaga) and that continually playing big in FA (which has very mixed results) comes at an opportunity cost. It gets glossed over way too often and people pretend you are gong to be able to always have the best of both worlds.


What makes NE unique is that they never overpay anyone. There legitimately isn't an overpaid player on their roster. They pick up players with low value, make them valuable contributors, then trade or let them walk once they get expensive. I'm not in favor of TT going out and spending huge money. That almost never works in the NFL. It's finding the depressed assets via trade and FA that he needs to work on.


I was just talking about this with friends. I think what really makes them unique and makes me jealous is the variety of ways they will use to improve. What you described is one of them- they certainly will take fliers on talented players that other teams are afraid of for whatever reason and seem to get the most out of them. But, they will also spend big money in FA. They also always seem to have multiple draft picks- I have no data but it certainly feels like they trade down more than most. And then they use those extra picks for talented players like Martellus Bennett and Dwayne Allen. And that's trading for a TE while having one of the best TE. All of that is creative as hell and I wish we'd do more stuff like that,


They actually trade a lot of "big name" players away before their contracts are up and tend to get really good value. Basically what we should have done with Sitton and Lang, maybe Cobb too (but that is hindsight). Bellicheck would have traded Eddie Lacy for a first to the Colts or Buccaneers then taken Blount off the scrap heap and get the same production. Bellicheck is the Hinkie of the NFL and he can get away with it because of the clout he has. But he has traded some really big name players, not many GMs would get away with that (and he seems to be able to buy big name players cheaply too)

Here are the trades they have done the last three offseasons

Code: Select all

ALL TIME DRAFT / TRADES: 2016
Select year to view Draft and Trades: 
 GO

2016 TRADES
DATE   NOTES
3/13   The Patriots acquired Arizona's 2016 second-round pick (61st overall) and G Jonathan Cooper in exchange for DE Chandler Jones.
3/17   The Patriots acquired Chicago's 2016 sixth-round draft pick (204th overall) and TE Martellus Bennett in exchange for the Patriots 2016 fourth-round draft pick (127th overall).
4/29   The Patriots acquired New Orleans' 2016 third-round pick (78th overall) and fourth-round pick (112th overall) in a draft day trade in exchange for the Patriots 2016 second-round pick (61st overall)
4/30   The Patriots acquired Miami's 2016 fifth-round pick (147th overall) in a 2016 draft day trade in exchange for two of the Patriots 2016 sixth-round picks (196th overall and 204th overall) and the Patriots 2016 seventh-round pick (250th overall).
4/30   The Patriots acquired Seattle's 2016 seventh-round pick (225th overall) and Seattle's 2017 fourth-round pick in a draft day trade in exchange for the Patriots 2016 fifth-round pick (147th overall) and the Patriots 2016 seventh-round pick (243rd overall).
8/25   The Patriots acquired LB Barkevious Mingo from Cleveland in exchange for an undisclosed future draft selection.
9/7   The Patriots acquired DB Eric Rowe from Philadelphia in exchange for a conditional draft selection.
10/26   The Patriots acquired LB Kyle Van Noy from Detroit. Trade terms were not disclosed.
10/31   The Patriots acquired a conditional draft pick from Cleveland in exchange for LB Jamie Collins.

2015 TRADES
DATE   NOTES
5/1   The Patriots acquired Cleveland's 2015 fourth round pick (11th overall), fifth round pick (147th overall) and sixth round pick (202nd overall) in a 2015 draft day trade in exchange for the Patriots 2015 third round pick (96th overall) and the Patriots seventh round pick (219th overall).
5/2   The Patriots acquired Green Bay's 2015 fifth round pick (166th overall) and seventh round pick (247th overall) in a 2015 draft day trade in exchange for the Patriots 2015 fifth round pick (147th overall).
8/11   The Patriots acquired G Ryan Groy in a trade with the Chicago Bears in exchange for 2015 sixth-round draft pick LB Matthew Wells.
8/18   The Patriots acquired TE Asante Cleveland from the San Francisco 49ers in exchange for OL Jordan Devey.
8/26   The Patriots acquired T Michael Williams from the Detroit Lions in exchange for an undisclosed draft pick.
9/1   The Patriots acquired WR Jalen Saunders from the New Orleans Saints in exchange for an undisclosed draft pick.
9/17   The Patriots acquired WR Keshawn Martin in a trade with the Houston Texans in exchange for an undisclosed draft pick.
9/29   The Patriots acquired LB Jonathan Bostic in a trade with the Chicago Bears in exchange for a sixth-round pick.
10/1   The Patriots acquired DL Aikem Hicks from New Orleans in exchange for TE Michael Hoomanawanui.

2014 TRADES
DATE   NOTES
5/9   The Patriots acquired Jacksonville's 2014 fourth round pick (105th overall) and sixth round pick (179th overall) during a 2014 draft day trade in exchange for the Patriots 2014 third-round pick (93rd overall).
8/13   The Patriots acquired DL Ben Bass from Dallas in exchange for DB Justin Green.
8/13   The Patriots acquired DL Jerel Worthy from the Green Bay Packers for a conditional draft choice.
8/26   The Patriots acquired TE Tim Wright from Tampa Bay and a 2015 fourth-round pick (101st overall) in exchange for G Logan Mankins.
8/31   The Patriots acquired a 2016 seventh-round draft choice from Houston in exchange for QB Ryan Mallett.
10/22   The Patriots acquired LB Akeem Ayers and a 2015 seventh-round draft pick (219th overall) from Tennessee in exchange for the Patriots' 2015 sixth-round draft pick (208th overall).
10/28   The Patriots acquired LB Jonathan Casillas and a 2015 sixth-round draft pick (178th overall) from Tampa Bay in exchange for the Patriots' 2015 fifth round draft pick (168th overall).

2013 TRADES
DATE   NOTES
4/25   The Patriots acquired Minnesota's 2013 secondround pick (52nd overall), third-round pick (83rd overall), fourth-round pick (102nd overall) and seventh-round pick (229th overall) during a draft day trade in exchange for the Patriots' 2013 firstround pick (29th overall).
4/27   The Patriots acquired RB LeGarrette Blount from Tampa Bay in a draft day trade with Tampa Bay in exchange for RB Jeff Demps and a 2013 seventhround pick (229th overall).
10/29   The Patriots acquired DT Isaac Sopoaga and a 2014 sixth-round from Philadelphia in exchange for a 2014 fifth-round pick (169th overall).
Marc Lasry wrote:There's nothing worse than being mediocre, in business and in sports.


Marc Lasry wrote:By giving them a winning culture. I believe winning trumps all, and if not, we don't want that player
Profound23
General Manager
Posts: 9,777
And1: 640
Joined: Jun 29, 2005
   

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#293 » by Profound23 » Fri Mar 10, 2017 11:43 pm

With the signing of Bennett, I would still love to draft OJ Howard. Would be a great two te set for now and we would have the tight end to take over once Bennett is done here.
I just wanted you to know that, if you can hear me, if it got into your brain somehow....that I spread my butt cheeks as Mike Honcho
User avatar
Gianstoppable
Rookie
Posts: 1,194
And1: 273
Joined: Jan 07, 2015
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#294 » by Gianstoppable » Sat Mar 11, 2017 3:55 pm

Any way we can land both Watt and Tim WIlliams?
Profound23
General Manager
Posts: 9,777
And1: 640
Joined: Jun 29, 2005
   

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#295 » by Profound23 » Sat Mar 11, 2017 4:01 pm

Gianstoppable wrote:Any way we can land both Watt and Tim WIlliams?


I think that is possible, Tim Williams has fallen a bit due to a bad combine. He looked lost when asked what to do and wasn't prepared for drills. I personally don't care about that, but word is it has scared some GMs away.

Even better would be to land Rueben Foster and Tim Williams.
I just wanted you to know that, if you can hear me, if it got into your brain somehow....that I spread my butt cheeks as Mike Honcho
User avatar
ReasonablySober
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 64,044
And1: 6,733
Joined: Dec 02, 2001
Location: Cheap dinner. Watch basketball. Bone down.
Contact:
       

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#296 » by ReasonablySober » Sat Mar 11, 2017 4:07 pm

Profound23 wrote:
Gianstoppable wrote:Any way we can land both Watt and Tim WIlliams?


I think that is possible, Tim Williams has fallen a bit due to a bad combine. He looked lost when asked what to do and wasn't prepared for drills. I personally don't care about that, but word is it has scared some GMs away.

Even better would be to land Rueben Foster and Tim Williams.


Foster would be an incredible get if he fell.
User avatar
Gianstoppable
Rookie
Posts: 1,194
And1: 273
Joined: Jan 07, 2015
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#297 » by Gianstoppable » Sat Mar 11, 2017 4:30 pm

If we can get Watt or TIm Williams to slide can we maybe do
Rd 1. Watt OLB
2. Williams (drug concerns apparently) DE/OLB
3. Chidobe Awuzie CB
4. Adam Shaheen TE
5. Roderick Johnson OT
5. Rasul Douglas CB,
6.Donnel Pumphrey RB
7. Darius English OLB

undrafted:
Ishmael Zamaora WR
Cameron Johnston P
Sojourn Shelton CB

I look forward to getting none of these right. lol
User avatar
Gianstoppable
Rookie
Posts: 1,194
And1: 273
Joined: Jan 07, 2015
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#298 » by Gianstoppable » Sat Mar 11, 2017 4:32 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
Profound23 wrote:
Gianstoppable wrote:Any way we can land both Watt and Tim WIlliams?


I think that is possible, Tim Williams has fallen a bit due to a bad combine. He looked lost when asked what to do and wasn't prepared for drills. I personally don't care about that, but word is it has scared some GMs away.

Even better would be to land Rueben Foster and Tim Williams.


Foster would be an incredible get if he fell.


Yeah I just dont see Foster falling that far from his surgery and the combine incident but I'd love him too.
User avatar
RiotPunch
RealGM
Posts: 10,974
And1: 895
Joined: Jul 05, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:
     

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#299 » by RiotPunch » Sat Mar 11, 2017 7:17 pm

Gianstoppable wrote:If we can get Watt or TIm Williams to slide can we maybe do
Rd 1. Watt OLB
2. Williams (drug concerns apparently) DE/OLB
3. Chidobe Awuzie CB
4. Adam Shaheen TE
5. Roderick Johnson OT
5. Rasul Douglas CB,
6.Donnel Pumphrey RB
7. Darius English OLB

undrafted:
Ishmael Zamaora WR
Cameron Johnston P
Sojourn Shelton CB

I look forward to getting none of these right. lol

I think Awuzie is long gone at that point. His stock keeps rising.
Image
Don't Kidd yourselves.
Profound23
General Manager
Posts: 9,777
And1: 640
Joined: Jun 29, 2005
   

Re: Packers 2017 NFL Draft Thread 

Post#300 » by Profound23 » Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:52 pm

Sounds like the top corner in this draft (Sidney Jones) tore his ACL during THE LAST DRILL of the day for Washington's pro day. He was supposed to go top ten.

I wonder if he falls to us, do we take a chance on him knowing he won't be ready this year but could eventually have gotten the best DB from the draft?
I just wanted you to know that, if you can hear me, if it got into your brain somehow....that I spread my butt cheeks as Mike Honcho

Return to Green Bay Packers