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Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup

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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#141 » by crkone » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:53 pm

WeekapaugGroove wrote:I would love to know why late in the year Randle was giving such a big cushion; on some of these plays he gave so much room he never stood a chance. It was mindboggling. Gunter took his share of beatings but at least he was getting up and challenging WR's. His problem is he's just not fast enough to run with the really elite guys. I think theres a place for Gunter in a CB rotation he just can't be your top guy. I have some hope for a Randle rebound. He had a ton of injuries this year and does have athleticism on and decent ball skills. I'm probably least optimistic about Rollins. I hope I'm wrong but I'm just not sure he has the feel to play CB at a high level. The Packers NEED a fast CB so so badly this offseason.


Every CB besides Hyde was dealing with some injury. Gunter couldn't jam like he did at the beginning of the season and Randall couldn't cut.

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Re: RE: Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#142 » by WeekapaugGroove » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:26 pm

crkone wrote:
WeekapaugGroove wrote:I would love to know why late in the year Randle was giving such a big cushion; on some of these plays he gave so much room he never stood a chance. It was mindboggling. Gunter took his share of beatings but at least he was getting up and challenging WR's. His problem is he's just not fast enough to run with the really elite guys. I think theres a place for Gunter in a CB rotation he just can't be your top guy. I have some hope for a Randle rebound. He had a ton of injuries this year and does have athleticism on and decent ball skills. I'm probably least optimistic about Rollins. I hope I'm wrong but I'm just not sure he has the feel to play CB at a high level. The Packers NEED a fast CB so so badly this offseason.


Every CB besides Hyde was dealing with some injury. Gunter couldn't jam like he did at the beginning of the season and Randall couldn't cut.

Yeah the injuries at cb were crippling.

After QB I think CB and T are the two positions you really need good injury luck. With how much nickel is played in the nfl thats 96 guys league wide who play a lot and there just arent that many good ones so as much as teams would love to have depth at cb its just not that realistic to have good players once you hit the 4 and 5th guys in that group. Tackle depth league wise might be even more scarce, theres a reason guys like marshall newhouse are still getting starts.

And those two positions are ones where if you're bad it can ruin you. Look at the vikings play at T pretty much ended their season.

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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#143 » by James1980 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:14 pm

I think I watched a different game than many of you. Yes, the defense was bad, but the offense didn't score any points in the first half. Mason missed an easy field goal, obviously the Rip fumble was huge, Rodgers Int, there were drops, Rodgers threw it into the ground a couple times, and was sacked by his big toe. Defense was more to blame, but the Offense had blame too, probably 60:40 Defense:Offense.

People talking about the 44 points given up, some of that was do to turnovers, onside kicks, and 3 and outs.

McCarthy does coach like he has a good defense which is weird. I would have taken the ball first instead of deferring and I also would have gone for it on 4th and 2 in the first half.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#144 » by LUKE23 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:00 pm

Randall isn't a #1 CB to me, he's a #2. Rollins is maybe a #3. We need to add a top flight corner this offseason, and another pass rusher in addition to bringing Perry back. Do that I will be relatively optimistic about next year's defense. But if Randall/Rollins/Gunther is our corner trio, I can't get behind that.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#145 » by Turk Nowitzki » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:06 pm

LUKE23 wrote:Randall isn't a #1 CB to me, he's a #2. Rollins is maybe a #3. We need to add a top flight corner this offseason, and another pass rusher in addition to bringing Perry back. Do that I will be relatively optimistic about next year's defense. But if Randall/Rollins/Gunther is our corner trio, I can't get behind that.

I think the expectation was for Randall/Rollins to play like the #2/#3 corners. The problem is that they often played like the #5/#6 corners. I expect them both to get their chances to rebound next year, but I agree with you, we desperately need help at that position.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#146 » by HurricaneKid » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:15 pm

If Gunter is lined up one on one against one of the best receivers in the league in the postseason next year I am just going to turn off the TV rather than have to watch the carnage unfold.

Thompson's inability to identify defensive talent is an ongoing problem. I thought it was evident in the Dallas game that we simply do not match up talent wise with the better teams in the league. We just have the trump card in Rogers. But putting this team around a generational talent has been overtly frustrating.

Still, you almost have to give the team a pass for getting this far with so many injuries. I just want Rogers to get another one and I don't know how he can with this team.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#147 » by M-C-G » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:21 pm

HurricaneKid wrote:
Thompson's inability to identify defensive talent is an ongoing problem.


Hard to say, obviously not many teams can lose their number 1 corner (Shields) and have enough talent to match a guy like Julio. Capers couldn't figure out how to make Hayward work, he leaves and he is one of the top CB in the league all of a sudden.

As for Randall, the dude is a physical talent but looks like he has never been coached. I mean, I know he has, but it looks like he is seeing everything for the first time, was just nowhere near ready to be starting this season.

I like the core of our secondary, but each was being asked to play a position or two above where they really belong and that is just going to kill you against a offense like Atlanta.

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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#148 » by ibanezjp » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:24 pm

James1980 wrote:I think I watched a different game than many of you. Yes, the defense was bad, but the offense didn't score any points in the first half. Mason missed an easy field goal, obviously the Rip fumble was huge, Rodgers Int, there were drops, Rodgers threw it into the ground a couple times, and was sacked by his big toe. Defense was more to blame, but the Offense had blame too, probably 60:40 Defense:Offense.

People talking about the 44 points given up, some of that was do to turnovers, onside kicks, and 3 and outs.

McCarthy does coach like he has a good defense which is weird. I would have taken the ball first instead of deferring and I also would have gone for it on 4th and 2 in the first half.


Now that you put it like that it really was pretty similar to that 2011 Giants game. Nothing went our way that game, we had uncharacteristic turnovers, and couldn't put up many points, and our known to be bad defense got predictably torched, all much like this game yesterday. I think that game was 37-20 off the top of my head. Pretty similar to 44-21.

I still think you can say Atlanta was clearly a better and more healthy team but I think you play that game 10 times and 7 out of 10 times it's the tight shootout we all predicted. That game just so quickly steamrolled out of control.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#149 » by jlyons043 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:27 pm

James1980 wrote:I think I watched a different game than many of you. Yes, the defense was bad, but the offense didn't score any points in the first half. Mason missed an easy field goal, obviously the Rip fumble was huge, Rodgers Int, there were drops, Rodgers threw it into the ground a couple times, and was sacked by his big toe. Defense was more to blame, but the Offense had blame too, probably 60:40 Defense:Offense.

People talking about the 44 points given up, some of that was do to turnovers, onside kicks, and 3 and outs.

McCarthy does coach like he has a good defense which is weird. I would have taken the ball first instead of deferring and I also would have gone for it on 4th and 2 in the first half.


60/40 blame to the D LOL! The defense sets a new worst ever in NFL postseason history by allowing Atlanta to convert 77% of the time on third-down, they only force 1 punt by Atlanta all game, they give 44+ for the 3rd time in the playoffs under Rodgers and yet they ONLY get 60% of the blame. :banghead:

The fact that we expect the offense to perform perfectly just shows badly built this team truly is
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#150 » by rilamann » Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:18 pm

The scariest thing about our defense being comically bad isn't that it is comically bad.

What's scary is when you take into account the investment over the past 5 years that has been made to prove the defense and that it's still comically bad.

Ted Thompson has to be one of the most overrated GMs in pro sports over the past 25 years.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review 

Post#151 » by El Duderino » Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:25 pm

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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#152 » by FAH1223 » Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:49 pm

ibanezjp wrote:I'm gonna try my best not to get mad this offseason hoping for some changes when they will most surely do nothing. My guess is they think Randall and Rollins will have a similar jump Adams made this year when he wasn't hampered by injuries all year. I have small hope this is the case because they like Davante we're pretty decent in their rookie years. Still just can't imagine Randall really covering anybody. I mean he looked worse than Terrell Buckley out there during this season. Like somebody mentioned last year it seems like Shields was the glue that held it together and allowed Rollins and Randall to play to their strengths much like how our WR core went to crap last year when Jordy went down.

Another point about the defense and injuries. Every year we don't reach the Super Bowl just underscores how much an opportunity we wasted in 2014. Other than the calf that was the healthiest Packers team since 2007 and they had at least an average defense which would've got it done this year. Even the 2015 defense (which was probably our best since 2010) would've kept us in that game yesterday.


Losing Shields was devastating. It can't be overstated enough.

We are going to have to get a CB this offseason. Maybe check the trade market. It's a dire situation.

Randall might even be better equipped to play a FS/CB hybrid role ala Woodson.

Cook, Perry, and Lang should be the priorities. I'd like Hyde back for depth. But we need speed in the secondary.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#153 » by El Duderino » Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:00 am

HurricaneKid wrote:If Gunter is lined up one on one against one of the best receivers in the league in the postseason next year I am just going to turn off the TV rather than have to watch the carnage unfold.

Thompson's inability to identify defensive talent is an ongoing problem. I thought it was evident in the Dallas game that we simply do not match up talent wise with the better teams in the league. We just have the trump card in Rogers. But putting this team around a generational talent has been overtly frustrating.

Still, you almost have to give the team a pass for getting this far with so many injuries. I just want Rogers to get another one and I don't know how he can with this team.


Yea

Ted has had a decade to find some quality ILB's and is yet to do so

Since the Super Bowl win bad to terrible defensive picks 1st through 4th round

Worthy 2nd
D. Jones 1st
McMillian 4th
Thorton 3rd
Bradford 4th
Randall 1st
Rollins 2nd

Rounds 5th-7th all picks

Manning
DJ Smith
Boyd
Palmer
Elmore
Guy
Barrington
Hyde
Goodson
Ringo

To many whiffs among the higher picks and while picks in rounds 5-7 are generally longshots, most teams do hit on them better than only Hyde being a contributor defensively out of five drafts.

Then there is the picks this year

Clark solid
Fackrell rarely played
Martinez was ok
Lowry incomplete

Including the draft this year, that's 6 drafts on defense and all there was to show for it yesterday in above average defensive players at their position were were

Dix/Burnett
Perry maybe
Daniels

And none of those four are elite at their position.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#154 » by jakecronus8 » Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:03 am

HurricaneKid wrote:If Gunter is lined up one on one against one of the best receivers in the league in the postseason next year I am just going to turn off the TV rather than have to watch the carnage unfold.

Thompson's inability to identify defensive talent is an ongoing problem. I thought it was evident in the Dallas game that we simply do not match up talent wise with the better teams in the league. We just have the trump card in Rogers. But putting this team around a generational talent has been overtly frustrating.

Still, you almost have to give the team a pass for getting this far with so many injuries. I just want Rogers to get another one and I don't know how he can with this team.


You realize Gunter started the year as the #4 corner, right?
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#155 » by jakecronus8 » Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:05 am

The cry baby representation of Packers nation is staggering in this thread. Wow.
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Re: RE: Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#156 » by RRyder823 » Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:10 am

jakecronus8 wrote:
HurricaneKid wrote:If Gunter is lined up one on one against one of the best receivers in the league in the postseason next year I am just going to turn off the TV rather than have to watch the carnage unfold.

Thompson's inability to identify defensive talent is an ongoing problem. I thought it was evident in the Dallas game that we simply do not match up talent wise with the better teams in the league. We just have the trump card in Rogers. But putting this team around a generational talent has been overtly frustrating.

Still, you almost have to give the team a pass for getting this far with so many injuries. I just want Rogers to get another one and I don't know how he can with this team.


You realize Gunter started the year as the #4 corner, right?

On another board I fequent there's a contingent that wants Gunter cut.

I respond with a similar sentiment of what do you expect from a #4 CB and it's met with blah blah blah we know know he can't cover #1's. Like you shouldn't allready know that from him being our #4 CB

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Re: RE: Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#157 » by jakecronus8 » Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:15 am

RRyder823 wrote:
jakecronus8 wrote:
HurricaneKid wrote:If Gunter is lined up one on one against one of the best receivers in the league in the postseason next year I am just going to turn off the TV rather than have to watch the carnage unfold.

Thompson's inability to identify defensive talent is an ongoing problem. I thought it was evident in the Dallas game that we simply do not match up talent wise with the better teams in the league. We just have the trump card in Rogers. But putting this team around a generational talent has been overtly frustrating.

Still, you almost have to give the team a pass for getting this far with so many injuries. I just want Rogers to get another one and I don't know how he can with this team.


You realize Gunter started the year as the #4 corner, right?

On another board I fequent there's a contingent that wants Gunter cut.

I respond with a similar sentiment of what do you expect from a #4 CB and it's met with blah blah blah we know know he can't cover #1's. Like you shouldn't allready know that from him being our #4 CB

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It's hilarious. A guy that is still green to the CB position is tasked with shadowing OBJ, Dez Bryant, and Julio Jones in consecutive playoff games and people are all, "OMGz!!!! Worst corner ever!!!! Cut this bum!!! Bring back da Tramon Wiliyumsz!!! Sign da Peanut Tillman!! He wants to be in da green and da gold!!!"

:nonono:
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#158 » by El Duderino » Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:24 am

jakecronus8 wrote:
HurricaneKid wrote:If Gunter is lined up one on one against one of the best receivers in the league in the postseason next year I am just going to turn off the TV rather than have to watch the carnage unfold.

Thompson's inability to identify defensive talent is an ongoing problem. I thought it was evident in the Dallas game that we simply do not match up talent wise with the better teams in the league. We just have the trump card in Rogers. But putting this team around a generational talent has been overtly frustrating.

Still, you almost have to give the team a pass for getting this far with so many injuries. I just want Rogers to get another one and I don't know how he can with this team.


You realize Gunter started the year as the #4 corner, right?


Yea and he became our number one corner because the 1st and 2nd round picks last year were awful, so Capers and the defensive staff felt Gunter was a better option than Randall and Rollins.

I don't blame Gunter at all. He is what he is, a 4th corner type thrust into a role which he isn't talented enough to handle. This type of stuff happens when the GM whiffs on high draft picks at a position.
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Re: RE: Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#159 » by wichmae » Tue Jan 24, 2017 1:04 am

jakecronus8 wrote:
RRyder823 wrote:
jakecronus8 wrote:
You realize Gunter started the year as the #4 corner, right?

On another board I fequent there's a contingent that wants Gunter cut.

I respond with a similar sentiment of what do you expect from a #4 CB and it's met with blah blah blah we know know he can't cover #1's. Like you shouldn't allready know that from him being our #4 CB

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It's hilarious. A guy that is still green to the CB position is tasked with shadowing OBJ, Dez Bryant, and Julio Jones in consecutive playoff games and people are all, "OMGz!!!! Worst corner ever!!!! Cut this bum!!! Bring back da Tramon Wiliyumsz!!! Sign da Peanut Tillman!! He wants to be in da green and da gold!!!"

:nonono:

IN hindsight they absolutely should have tried the veteran route over the elevation of Herb Waters or Josh Hawkins. Even Brice and Evans really had no business being on the field. The issue I think many (as well as I) have is that there isnt even an attempt or thought to try and bring in a veteran player when injuries happen. Gunter is what he is and isnt a awful player but in no way should he have been put into that situation.

ETA: exactly what Dude said above.
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Re: Falcons Post Game/Season Review/2017-18 Leadup 

Post#160 » by wichmae » Tue Jan 24, 2017 1:11 am

We have some big FA decisions coming up and have some big decisions to make on Shields, and Clay. Perry is a FA, Tretter, Lang, Lacy, Hyde, and Cook. Looking at the upcoming FA list ideally we should be looking at going after Bouye or Gilmore. Theres also some intriguing ILB guys too. Have to absolutely fix this defense. Its a mess.

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