JOSH SMITH to Clippers

[nickhx2]

i'd say dudley and a first is his best trade ever. it just happened to benefit the other side

[og15]

I guess in hindsight the team should have gone with Darrell Arthur

[Ranma]

Even before reviewing this thread, I remembered nickhx2's advocacy of Darrell Arthur over Josh Smith. I was never a Smith fan, but I was seduced by his talent and athleticism in preferring him over Arthur for the final roster spot at the league minimum. It was a low-risk, high-reward proposition with the higher payout possibility between the two options. In hindsight, Arthur clearly would have been the more beneficial choice, but at the time, it didn't offer as exciting a reward with our gamble.

I now find myself in the odd position of mostly defending Doc for his choice to sign and then subsequently trade Josh Smith. Offering a chance for Smith to redeem himself while playing for a contender seemed like a mutually beneficial situation for him to show others that he's capable of realizing his full potential in a more disciplined manner. If it didn't work out, no big loss, but the aforementioned upside in possibilities was too tantalizing to pass up.

In the end, Smith proved that he was comfortable with being who he has been. A player unwilling to conform to a team concept of disciplined sets. He prefers to freelance and operate from the perimeter without setting picks to free up teammates or make cuts to get himself open. He fancies himself as a playmaker and shooter while being quite inefficient at both in addition to wasting his physical and athletic gifts by not working for position in the post for rebounds and man defense. He has ball-handling and passing abilities as well as a penchant for blocks as a help defender, but again, he only employs those skills freelancing away from the basket.

What's surprising is his expectations of leadership as noted in the Woike article below. Seriously? He wanted a bigger voice in leadership of the team when we already have Chris Paul, Blake Griffin, and Paul Pierce. It shows how delusional and clueless this guy really is. He's coasted on his talent and physical abilities for so long and still doesn't see that he needs to put more effort into sublimating his impulses for the betterment of the team.

This is why Detroit was willing to pay him off not to play for them any longer and why the Pistons have been better off since. Likewise, the Clippers will be better off not having him in the locker room and roster. We can bemoan not giving Smith a chance at power forward but it's clear that he wasn't going to make it work, anyway. The dude won't incorporate feedback from the coaching staff and yells at them for daring to demand that he be a part of a system. Doc already gave him his chance to start the season even if it was at center at the expense of Cole Aldrich.

Justin Russo has been harping non-stop about how much he wasn't given an opportunity to be himself in order to contribute, but being himself is exactly the problem. He's now happy to be back in Houston because they're the only team that will allow him to get away with his undisciplined freelancing and even then the Rockets limit that to bench minutes. Yeah, Smith played a big role in Houston beating us in the postseason collapse, but it's not like he's become Robert Horry or something. It was a huge failure on the Clippers' part to put themselves in that position and lightning happened to strike Smith as the Clips allowed momentum to build up against them.

What I don't get is how Smith expected to serve a leadership role with the team. Did Doc blow some serious smoke up Smith during his sales pitch? Or did Smith hear what he wanted to hear? It's probably a case of both, but given Doc's track record of bringing in misfits like Antawn Jamison and Byron Mullens, Smith just further adds to Doc's reputation for front office incompetence as a snake oil salesman.

I'm not exactly sold on the possibility of Jeff Ayres, but even he should provide more benefit for the Clippers than what Smith has. Woike even noted that some players considered his removal to be addition by subtraction with the "less is more" quote. The bottom line is that Josh Smith is not a championship level player. Contrary to his words of wanting to contribute and win, his highest priority is personal glory without putting in the work to deserve it.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/DanWoikeSports/status/690836256645783552[/tweet]

Dan Woike, Orange County Register (1/22/16)

Behind the scenes, Smith’s attitude and desire to be heard as a leader didn’t fit into a locker room with an existing leadership hierarchy, leading some players to wonder if "less is more."

On the court, Smith’s shot selection and decision making didn’t mesh with Rivers’ vision for the second unit.
...

Smith, for his part, welcomed the trade, according to Houston television reporter Mark Berman.

In a series of tweets, Smith told Berman Houston "is a place I probably never should have left."

"I hope I bring leadership. (It’s) an opportunity to relieve some pressure off James (Harden) and Dwight (Howard) a little bit," Smith told Berman. "Just (to) be able to be that glue, that missing piece that they need in order for us to keep going forward."

Clippers End Josh Smith's Strained Stay with Trade to Rockets

[thanumba2clippersfan]

I'm fine with trading Smith away since he didn't work out. I just hope this doesn't come back to haunt us in that he doesn't go off on us again as a member of the Rockets.

[TucsonClip]

Justin Russo has been harping non-stop about how much he wasn't given an opportunity to be himself in order to contribute, but being himself is exactly the problem. He's now happy to be back in Houston because they're the only team that will allow him to get away with his undisciplined freelancing and even then the Rockets limit that to bench minutes. Yeah, Smith played a big role in Houston beating us in the postseason collapse, but it's not like he's become Robert Horry or something. It was a huge failure on the Clippers' part to put themselves in that position and lightning happened to strike Smith as the Clips allowed momentum to build up against them.

I've been trying to tell him that for weeks. 100% agree with your entire take, especially this.

[Ranma]

I've been trying to tell him that for weeks. 100% agree with your entire take, especially this.

I don't get how Russo is so ready to come to Josh Smith's defense while, at the same time, is quick to attack Jamal Crawford at any given moment. They both serve the same roles for the Rockets and Clippers, respectively. The difference is that Jamal is the much better offensive player and he'll at least try on defense and has made efforts to fit into the team's system. Smith wants to play the Jamal role in Houston despite not having the handles or shot to operate effectively from the perimeter. Of course, Smith is the better defender, but that's only if he happens to be in the area instead of meandering out into no man's land.

[Wammy Giveaway]

Justin Russo has been harping non-stop about how much he wasn't given an opportunity to be himself in order to contribute, but being himself is exactly the problem. He's now happy to be back in Houston because they're the only team that will allow him to get away with his undisciplined freelancing and even then the Rockets limit that to bench minutes. Yeah, Smith played a big role in Houston beating us in the postseason collapse, but it's not like he's become Robert Horry or something. It was a huge failure on the Clippers' part to put themselves in that position and lightning happened to strike Smith as the Clips allowed momentum to build up against them.

Picture this: while Doc demoralizes Smith during Clipper games, Smith secretly keeps tabs on their sessions and systems. The minute Doc traded Smith to the Rockets for nothing is going to be the day they regret signing him in the first place.

Now Smith has all the moves the Clippers use to share with the Rockets so that the next time they meet in the playoffs, they will have all their sets and counter or use them against the Clippers.

Doc Rivers just helped the enemy. Just like how Donald Sterling helped Dr. Jerry Buss buy the Lakers, and how the Clippers didn't take the Warriors seriously in the 2012-13 season, Doc Rivers helped make Houston stronger than ever.

Houston now possesses the ability to sweep the Clippers out of the playoffs.

[og15]

Hoopshype is doggy doo doo. Use basketballinsiders.

But Wow. I thought Josh was a lock to go back to Houston. This is an awesome signing, even if it is for the vet min. We don't even have to trade Jamal now. Or at least hold off until something better comes up closer to the trade deadline. He should be better with more guys around him on the 2nd unit.

There isn't enough minutes for everyone currently on the roster to be happy. Look at the roster and try to figure out the minutes, someone is going to be unhappy if no other moves are made

Well this was what I said earlier in the thread, there aren't enough minutes to make everyone happy, and my thought was that Jamal would be the one losing the minutes. Of course he hasn't and won't with Doc coaching, but the statement has been true the whole time that with all the players Doc got, there were not enough minutes. This was part of why Josh was made into a C in the first place.

[Jaykoolzboy]

should've trade Josh to EC, why helping your potential playoffs opponent is beyond me? Another solid performance for Josh Smith today

16pts
3 rebs
2 asts
2 steals
2 blocks

in 23 mins

last time I checked Griffin is still on the injury list.

[Ranma]

should've trade Josh to EC, why helping your potential playoffs opponent is beyond me? Another solid performance for Josh Smith today

16pts
3 rebs
2 asts
2 steals
2 blocks

in 23 mins

last time I checked Griffin is still on the injury list.

Hey, I was hoping to dump him to the Kings as part of a 3-team trade for Eric Gordon, but we can't assume there was someone else in the league willing to take him even at the minimum. Don't forget, he was sent away from Atlanta, then bought out by Detroit before being dumped by the Clips. All three of these teams are better off without J-Smoove. I suspect Smith's reputation around the league is not the best. Plus, Houston is probably the only team that will let him get away with this preference for freelancing from the perimeter.

He went 6-14 (42.8%) from the field, 2-6 (33.3%) from 3-point range, and 2-2 (100%) from the charity stripe, which is an optimistic view relative to his career averages of 45.4% FG, 28.5% 3PT, and 63.2% FT. On top of that, he still played the role of backup center for Houston.

He may be a bit rejuvenated now, but he'll come back down to the mean of his recent historical performances. He'll have the occasional game with big numbers, but I'm confident Jamal Crawford will have more of those than he will and Crawford isn't really helping the Clippers overall either.

The concern should be getting rid of inefficient non-contributors like Lance Stephenson, Austin Rivers, and Crawford for more team- and system-oriented support. If we're really concerned about Josh Smith and the Rockets beating us in the playoffs again, then we're no closer to making a legitimate run for the championship than last year's disappointing collapse.

[nickhx2]

well last year after going from detroit to houston he did pretty well, even if he was still taking bad shots. he was a very good contributor for them off the bench with defense/passing/activity, etc.

i don't see why going back now would be any different. even if he has more bad shooting nights than before, he'll still be able to make a difference for them just by being on the court. i couldn't care less if he scores less than crawford, because of all the other stuff he can help with.

[mttwlsn16]

Josh Smith shot 38% for us. He is shooting 28% for Houston so far.

[Forte IV]

Picture this: while Doc demoralizes Smith during Clipper games, Smith secretly keeps tabs on their sessions and systems. The minute Doc traded Smith to the Rockets for nothing is going to be the day they regret signing him in the first place.

Now Smith has all the moves the Clippers use to share with the Rockets so that the next time they meet in the playoffs, they will have all their sets and counter or use them against the Clippers.

Doc Rivers just helped the enemy. Just like how Donald Sterling helped Dr. Jerry Buss buy the Lakers, and how the Clippers didn't take the Warriors seriously in the 2012-13 season, Doc Rivers helped make Houston stronger than ever.

Houston now possesses the ability to sweep the Clippers out of the playoffs.

Oh wow I think you may be right.