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What Exactly Is The Issue?

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Re: Reason for Slide - Kobe Misses his Mentor 

Post#201 » by EArl » Tue Jan 8, 2013 7:27 am

I agree with Deep. The only mentor Kobe has had are his father, Phil Jackson and possibly Jerry West.
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Re: Reason for Slide - Kobe Misses his Mentor 

Post#202 » by LA_Sports » Tue Jan 8, 2013 8:21 am

eablinksum wrote:I agree with Deep. The only mentor Kobe has had are his father, Phil Jackson and possibly Jerry West.

Yeah I agree... Kobe seems to respond best to older guys that have been to the top of the mountain many times. He seems to listen and respect the past greats of the game the most.
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Re: Kobe failing as a leader and destroying Lakers confidenc 

Post#203 » by bballfanatic81 » Tue Jan 8, 2013 9:55 am

Aki wrote:hungry vets the lakers are not.

except nash, he's awfully hungry


i hope for nash's sake the lakers move him after the all star break, once it becomes clear rebuilding is their best bet moving forward..
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#204 » by bballfanatic81 » Tue Jan 8, 2013 10:01 am

Michael Lucky wrote:This blaming Jim because he didn't hire Phil needs to stop. Phil cannot cure old age, he cannot cure old feet, and he sure cannot cure a bad back.

Sure we can trade Pau for a younger player and trust me it won't be an all star talent since Pau's value is about as bad as it will ever get, but in the end we'll still be old on the perimeter, and there's simply not much the lakers can do about it over the next couple of years.


the team is still awfully similar to the team that was swept by dallas a few years ago. phil knew it wouldn't work, so he jumped ship. the lakers would be best served to unload everyone for draft picks, including kobe. blasphemous and unthinkable to most here i would assume, but strategically the best option moving forward. i wouldn't build around dwight either, as nobody is sure how his back will hold up...
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#205 » by SaveTheHens » Tue Jan 8, 2013 2:25 pm

The issue is Kobe. Honestly when Dwight came to LA Kobe should of given him the team if he really wanted the best chance at a championship.

Kobe's shot over twice as many shots as Dwight. Even Artest has a few more attempts than Dwight. I don't get it. This guy's the best C in the league and the Lakers are treating him as if he's Chris Bosh behind two other stars. Kobe needs to get over his own pride, and start getting Howard involved as early in the game as possible.

Only after Dwight get's going should Kobe start looking for his own offence, or on nights when Dwight's in foul trouble. Any other time Kobe's gunning for 40 is a lame attempt at bumping up his scoring numbers. This kind of behaviour by Kobe will only lead to Dwight leaving in a year, and no 6th championship for Kobe.

Time to focus in and exert some self-control. Kobe should be averaging 8 assists a game instead of 30 points.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#206 » by Kilroy » Tue Jan 8, 2013 2:33 pm

SaveTheHens wrote:The issue is Kobe. Honestly when Dwight came to LA Kobe should of given him the team if he really wanted the best chance at a championship.

Kobe's shot over twice as many shots as Dwight. Even Artest has a few more attempts than Dwight. I don't get it. This guy's the best C in the league and the Lakers are treating him as if he's Chris Bosh behind two other stars. Kobe needs to get over his own pride, and start getting Howard involved as early in the game as possible.

Only after Dwight get's going should Kobe start looking for his own offence, or on nights when Dwight's in foul trouble. Any other time Kobe's gunning for 40 is a lame attempt at bumping up his scoring numbers. This kind of behaviour by Kobe will only lead to Dwight leaving in a year, and no 6th championship for Kobe.

Time to focus in and exert some self-control. Kobe should be averaging 8 assists a game instead of 30 points.


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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#207 » by leeprettyp » Tue Jan 8, 2013 3:07 pm

Kilroy wrote:
SaveTheHens wrote:The issue is Kobe. Honestly when Dwight came to LA Kobe should of given him the team if he really wanted the best chance at a championship.

Kobe's shot over twice as many shots as Dwight. Even Artest has a few more attempts than Dwight. I don't get it. This guy's the best C in the league and the Lakers are treating him as if he's Chris Bosh behind two other stars. Kobe needs to get over his own pride, and start getting Howard involved as early in the game as possible.

Only after Dwight get's going should Kobe start looking for his own offence, or on nights when Dwight's in foul trouble. Any other time Kobe's gunning for 40 is a lame attempt at bumping up his scoring numbers. This kind of behaviour by Kobe will only lead to Dwight leaving in a year, and no 6th championship for Kobe.

Time to focus in and exert some self-control. Kobe should be averaging 8 assists a game instead of 30 points.


You haven't watched a single Laker game this season. Not one.



I want the 2 mins of my life back that i used reading that wrong explaination of whats wrong with the team.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#208 » by madmaxmedia » Tue Jan 8, 2013 5:26 pm

That post was BS, but...I think Kobe's high shot totals are symptomatic of an overall problem. In any given game, Kobe is having to carry the team for it to have a chance to win. If they were at least slightly over .500 with Kobe's great season that would be one thing. It can also be said the main problems are on defense, but I think the Lakers thought they were giving up some defensive ability for great offense with this roster. Instead, it's totally reliant on Kobe.

In the short term, this is achieving its purpose (winning the game) almost half the time. In the long run, it won't achieve the long term purpose (winning a title.) If it was going to come down to this, the Lakers could have just traded all the big names for a bunch of blue-collar defenders and rebounders around Kobe, like the Sixers did with Iverson at one point. We'd be getting the same offensive production from the non-Kobe players, but with much better defensive capability.

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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#209 » by madmaxmedia » Tue Jan 8, 2013 5:36 pm

richboy wrote:Think your making it too complicated. The Lakers can't defend anybody off the dribble. They have a coach that defense is an afterthought. SVG was a great defensive mind in Orlando. Even though they weren't great on the perimeter defensively they had guys like Pietrus, Richardson, Lee, Qrich, Barnes, etc over the years to provide some resistance. Add in they slowed the game down so they weren't getting killed in fast break points.

The Lakers perimeter defense is horrible. Kobe is just a bad defender now. PGs just got to a spot and shoot over Nash. Artest isn't slowing down elite scorers anymore. The guys that come off the bench are maybe even worse on defense. The Lakers should be playing a slow it down go inside to the bigs and keep teams out of transition type of offense. What they do on offense hurts what they are doing on defense because they lack the athletes to play such a fast game.


I agree with everything you say, I guess I was just expecting that Dwight would have gone a long way towards counteracting these deficiencies. But it's not like he can play 1 on 5 either.

Normally with a guy like Dwight in the middle the perimeter guys funnel drivers into the paint, and the center can handle it if he has some help from the wings. The Lakers need to slow the game down, but they are not good even in the half court. The perimeter defense is horrible, even the interior defense is routinely giving up easy baskets. Bad perimeter defense leads to this, but even then there are too many breakdowns- that's why I started thinking about Dwight.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#210 » by LA_Sports » Tue Jan 8, 2013 5:50 pm

Until there is a fundamental change and a true refocussing on defense, starting with, but not limited to the backcourt things will be the same. Just imagine if the Lakers could just old their opponents to under 100 points a night. They would be winning games hand over fist. They have lost so many close games, that if there was determination on defense by the whole team every play those loses would be easy wins.

After this happens then the Lakers might be able to starting thinking of some offensive tweaks with the players or system.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#211 » by madmaxmedia » Tue Jan 8, 2013 6:37 pm

Is it just a matter of re-focusing, or does the roster just not work?

They had a defensive coach last year and the start of this year, where they were off to a 1-12 start.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#212 » by semi-sentient » Tue Jan 8, 2013 7:22 pm

Yeah, focusing isn't the issue.

Gasol can't defend the 4 at all, and IMO neither Artest or Kobe are adequate defenders at the 3. Those are two positions where we need a bit more speed without sacrificing a ton offensively. Metta is a bit quicker and a lot stronger than Gasol so it makes sense to move him there. Hill wouldn't be a bad option either, but I think that might hurt our spacing too much after giving it more thought.

What to do with the 3 spot? The only one on the team capable of defending that position adequately is Ebanks, but he's in the doghouse for whatever reason.

That partially helps our half-court defense. I say partially because until these guys start communicating effectively we're going to have issues regardless.

Our transition defense is the easiest thing to fix. Guys need to run back after a shot goes up instead of worrying about offensive rebounds. This is what the Celtics do, and it's what we need to do since we don't have much foot speed. The other part of that is obviously limiting turnovers which will come in time.
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Re: Kobe failing as a leader and destroying Lakers confidenc 

Post#213 » by GeneralNash » Tue Jan 8, 2013 7:28 pm

bballfanatic81 wrote:
Aki wrote:hungry vets the lakers are not.

except nash, he's awfully hungry


i hope for nash's sake the lakers move him after the all star break, once it becomes clear rebuilding is their best bet moving forward..


Rebuilding lol. Get outta here.

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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#214 » by Slava » Tue Jan 8, 2013 7:44 pm

I actually wouldn't mind giving Earl Clark a decent run with the starters. Him or Metta can swtich between defending the 3 and 4 based on quickness, strength and height of the match up. Clark is pretty decent from the mid range and athletic, he played well when I saw him against Houston.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#215 » by Ballah » Tue Jan 8, 2013 7:57 pm

Seems clear that issue is horrible defense. Howard is obviously not what he was, he made Orlando into a top defensive team with zero defensive options besides him.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#216 » by tenten » Tue Jan 8, 2013 9:58 pm

madmaxmedia wrote:Is it just a matter of re-focusing, or does the roster just not work?

They had a defensive coach last year and the start of this year, where they were off to a 1-12 start.


they were fine last year. if MB didn't try to run the Princeton offense, we won't have 1-12 start and he won't get fired.

I think the best "system" for this team is just run free flow half court offense and MB's defense schemes if he has any. This was effective when Bernie was coaching.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#217 » by 0HeadAche0 » Tue Jan 8, 2013 10:05 pm

The lakers cannot put multiple stops together and thats what hinders them. They can't close out games because the teams will score more often than not.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#218 » by LA_Sports » Tue Jan 8, 2013 10:13 pm

I understand what you guys are saying, but if this team is truly defensively broken then the only option is to make wholesale changes. However what are the realistic chances of that happening this far into the season. Especially with the way our players up for trades (Pau, Jamison, Duhon, Ebanks) having been preforming so far this year.
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Re: What Exactly Is The Issue? 

Post#219 » by tenten » Tue Jan 8, 2013 10:20 pm

0HeadAche0 wrote:The lakers cannot put multiple stops together and thats what hinders them. They can't close out games because the teams will score more often than not.


well, if they stop turning the ball over and giving up fast break and inside layups, they won't be down double digits in the 4th and need multiple stops. You have two 7 footers and a bunch of old legs, slow the game down, reduce the number of possessions.
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Re: Kobe failing as a leader and destroying Lakers confidenc 

Post#220 » by LAKESHOW » Wed Jan 9, 2013 4:07 am

THERE is some truth to the statement
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