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Suns/Blazers/Nuggets

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Post#1 Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:21 pm by N.O.R.E.

Suns Trade: Gortat, Dudley
Receive: Batum, Mozgov

The Suns get a young stud SF to build around while getting rid of the unhappy Gortat. Dudley shouldn't be kept around for the rebuild IMO, he needs to go to a rebuilding team. Mozgov is a decent stop gap centre and could actually be retained beyond this season.


Blazers Trade: Batum, $3 million
Receive: Gortat, W. Chandler

The Blazers get a huge upgrade at the C position while getting an adequate replacement for Batum at SF. The Blazers would have an enviable rotation up front and would maintain decent flexibility as this deal is salary neutral. Chandler hasn't played well, however has been a much better player in the past and merely needs to rediscover his form.


Nuggets Trade: W. Chandler, Mozgov
Receive: Dudley, $3 million, **TE options

**option of taking on Dudley with portion of Nene TE taking it down to $8.7 while creating a $9 million one in return for Chandler & Mozgov, or alternatively, dealing Mozgov for Dudley, while getting a TE the size of Chandler's contract and maintaining Nene's full $13 TE.

The Nuggets get a vet SF locked into a reasonable contract who would be a great fit on their team. The Nuggets would then use their TE's and remaining expendable assets to get a decent big to add to the frontcourt.
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Post#2 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:48 pm by DeBlazerRiddem

I'm torn. Good trade proposal, but I just don't know. I'll start off by sharing my bias: I'm a Batum fan and think Gortat is generally overrated.

On one hand, I don't think this trade means the Blazers are a serious playoff team this year, and we have a young guy who could improve with minutes at C but at SF.

On the other hand, Gortat is a proven NBA center and Chandler could be an average replacement.

If we feel Chandler can regain his form, Blazers would probably have to do this. Downgrading from an above average to an average SF is more than worth the gain of getting an NBA starter, especially at the center position. It would be a short-term gain though, Blazers would be selling out the prospect of having young players develop as well as using capspace in a big way to get better now and avoid the lottery.

So again, I am torn. Good for the short term, potentially bad for the long term. Having me torn on the trade means its a good one though. I don't think it helps the Blazers win a championship - about the only thing that will put them in that position is another big lottery score.


Also, Denver probably isn't excited about the trade. Financially it might make sense for them. I think they might try and entice Phoenix into a McGee/Gortat trade before letting Portland into the conversation.
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Post#3 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:00 pm by DusterBuster

I'd make this trade as a Blazer fan.

Chandler isn't even in the realm of Batum in terms of talent, but he'd be a serviceable replacement, at least for the rest of the season. Meanwhile, Gortat would be amazing as the Blazers C and they can move Hickson to the bench as a 6th man, which is his more natural spot on a roster imo.

As the OP said, this is a salary neutral deal for the Blazers. That's just icing on the cake. They have options to replace Batum either through FA or with their upcoming lottery pick. It's possible neither of those yields a player as good as Batum, but they'd have a easier time finding a replacement for him than they would finding a competent C via either of those avenues.
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Post#4 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:05 pm by Wasabi_Johnson

I'm impressed, can't see who might complain. Maybe a Nugget fan who overvalues Wilson and Timothy?
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Post#5 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:22 pm by Wizenheimer

like DeBlazer, I'm a little torn on this deal although I'm more negative then positive

for one thing, I've never been a fan of pairing Aldridge with Gortat. Gortat hangs as close to the basket as he can, and most of the time he takes up position on the left side of the floor. That's exactly where Aldridge operates and is most effective. I see a bad mesh there

continuing the bad fit with Aldridge thought, Aldridge was most effective when he was working with Marcus Camby while Camby was in the high post. Camby was a willing and able passer. Gortat only averages 1.2 assists and I have a real hard time seeing him be useful in the high post

one gauge I use to judge these deals is imagining the player on the current Blazer squad. So, I picture Gortat taking JJ Hickson's place on the roster, then imagine Chandler taking Batum's place, and I ask if portland would be a better team. In this case, I think the answer is no. The NBA has become really oriented to perimeter players. The twin towers stuff doesn't seem to work any more

the talent exchange is fair, but it just doesn't make the blazers a better team and actually costs Portland 3 million in cap-space next summer. I don't see any compelling reason for Portland to do this deal
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Post#6 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:28 pm by batsmasher

This is a great trade, can't see any problems for anyone. McGee can't be traded to Jan 15 and as much as Denver are regretting their deal, they probably aren't in a great hurry to trade him.
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Post#7 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:39 pm by N.O.R.E.

Well if Blazers fans are saying they're torn, I'll take it as a compliment. I knew there would need to be an at least adequate SF coming back and W. Chandler is one of the only one's expendable to his current team that can be a solid contributor.
Should've made this a KOTB entry goddammit.
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Post#8 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:39 pm by DusterBuster

batsmasher wrote:This is a great trade, can't see any problems for anyone. McGee can't be traded to Jan 15 and as much as Denver are regretting their deal, they probably aren't in a great hurry to trade him.


What?
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Post#9 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:45 pm by franktony

I like it as well
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Post#10 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:57 pm by DeBlazerRiddem

N.O.R.E. wrote:Well if Blazers fans are saying they're torn, I'll take it as a compliment. I knew there would need to be an at least adequate SF coming back and W. Chandler is one of the only one's expendable to his current team that can be a solid contributor.
Should've made this a KOTB entry goddammit.


Lol, I was gonna say "if this was a KOTB entry I would have voted yes" despite being torn.


DusterBuster wrote:
batsmasher wrote:This is a great trade, can't see any problems for anyone. McGee can't be traded to Jan 15 and as much as Denver are regretting their deal, they probably aren't in a great hurry to trade him.


What?


I am guessing he is referring to my comment about the Nuggets exploring a trade for Gortat and avoid facilitating him going to a division rival.

I also wonder if Denver could be cut out for simplicity's sake, but I don't know how important Mozgov is to PHX. And gosh, if Mozgov is the key here, you would think Denver would be looking for more.
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Post#11 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:58 pm by hcsilla

I like Batum and I wouldn't have been suprised if the Suns would have went after Batum last summer since he seemed an ideal, better 3P-shooter replacement of Grant Hill although Batum's defense may be overrated (BTW, Blazers-fans, is it?).

I just don't really see the point of involving Denver to this deal.

Send Dudley also to POR which is a plus for POR, IMO since Dudley's contract is better while he is healthier than Chandler. Would POR still do the deal if they would have to add Leonard to the deal while getting MEM's 1st rounder as well?

Gortat, Dudley, MEM's 2013 1st for Batum, Leonard
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Post#12 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:03 pm by DusterBuster

hcsilla wrote:I like Batum and I wouldn't have been suprised if the Suns would have went after Batum last summer since he seemed an ideal, better 3P-shooter replacement of Grant Hill although Batum's defense may be overrated (BTW, Blazers-fans, is it?).

I just don't really see the point of involving Denver to this deal.

Send Dudley also to POR which is a plus for POR, IMO since Dudley's contract is better while he is healthier than Chandler. Would POR still do the deal if they would have to add Leonard to the deal while getting MEM's 1st rounder as well?

Gortat, Dudley, MEM's 2013 1st for Batum, Leonard


You could be right that Denver is excessive in the deal.

That said, I don't like the revision with Portland including Leonard. Take the pick out from Phoenix's side as well. It would still need a little tweaking after those moves, but I think it's possible that there's a happy medium that could be found. The Blazers have a still-in-it's-original shrink-wrapped Joel Freeland.
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Post#13 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:11 pm by DeBlazerRiddem

hcsilla wrote:Batum's defense may be overrated (BTW, Blazers-fans, is it?).


Well he's not an all-world defender, but I do think he is a very good defensive player - good IQ and usually good effort. He is especially effective when he can use his length to his advantage, and he is less effective when he has to defend using strength. Often he ends up defending guards, so sometimes the opposing SF can take advantage of the switch and hurt his defensive statistics. Take an example from last night though, Tony Parker was down near the rim where he is just an absolute baller, he tried to fake Batum multiple times but still ended up getting his shot blocked and stolen by Batum.

Would POR still do the deal if they would have to add Leonard to the deal while getting MEM's 1st rounder as well?

Gortat, Dudley, MEM's 2013 1st for Batum, Leonard


I was torn on the first deal, pretty equal positives and negatives, but this would be too much IMO. Leonard is still very raw, but he's still an athletic center with good hands and great energy. Part of the allure of the original trade was letting Leonard develop under Gortat, since I think he could be similar in terms of defense, PnR skills and overall quality. To add a recent lottery pick and only get back a late first is probably gonna kill our interest.
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Post#14 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:16 pm by DeBlazerRiddem

DusterBuster wrote:The Blazers have a still-in-it's-original shrink-wrapped Joel Freeland.



I think Freeland could be a solid player someday, but I cannot imagine he provides any positive value in trades.
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Post#15 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:56 pm by Myth

I would definitely do that trade of the OP's for Portland.
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Post#16 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:50 am by WallabyPie

Not a big fan of Batum and his contract. He's not that much better than Dudley. Mozgov is worthless. Suns pass.
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Post#17 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:17 am by RoyalWun

Holy hell. Someone actually makes a trade that us PDX fans kinda like.

The only reason I would say no (right now) is because I haven't given up on Batum just yet and am actually liking what we have seen so far. It's still early and I know he's been troubled by minor injuries but he's really stepped his game up. But then if Wilson Chandler becomes anything like his Knick days I might forget everything I just typed.

With Gortat he's actually does give us two positives: 1) an actual NBA starting C 2) trade bait for next year if Meyers comes along.

If this was a KOTB entry I'd vote yes.
Portland:

D. Lillard | S. Blake
W. Matthews | W. Barton | C. McCollum | A. Crabbe
N. Batum | D. Wright | V. Claver
L. Aldridge | T. Robinson
R. Lopez | C. Kaman | J. Freeland | M. Leonard
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Post#18 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:10 am by deanwoof

Batum for Gortat and Chandler? I am down.
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Post#19 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:23 am by torotoe

Good trade. I don't see anyone saying no.
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Post#20 Re: Suns/Blazers/Nuggets
Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:32 am by Kerrsed

Suns would pass. I like Batum and all, but the Suns are going to need a C that can be a starter or one who has the potential to grow into a starting caliber C, and Mozgov is not that guy. He might be a good backup C, but he is no starter.

I look at it this way, If the Blazers go after Gortat, then they view him as their starting C. He has the talent. Have the Blazers give up Leonard to the Suns and they can take Mozgov to be Gortats backup. The Suns would be able to give Leonard all the minutes he can handle at C and actually develop him.
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