RealGM

MNRunLeft wrote:

GhostX wrote:Rather have Noah and Deng for Howard than KLove

Since when is Chicago offering that?

If Chicago was willing to give that up for Dwight seems like Orland would have taken that deal in the first place. Don't see any reason Dwight's value has increased since last year, not under contract and multiple teams he could simply walk to in the offseason as a FA.

3 picks + salary cap relief + Vucevic + Harkless is a much much better package for a rebuilding team.

I could see the argument for Chicago doing that, and for LAL accepting even if Orlando wouldn't.

HartfordWhalers wrote:
3 picks + salary cap relief + Vucevic + Harkless is a much much better package for a rebuilding team.

I could see the argument for Chicago doing that, and for LAL accepting even if Orlando wouldn't.

If you land Noah and Deng does Orlando even need to do a complete rebuild though? Worst case they part that deal out just like they did Bynum and get as good or better return in the process.

Plus Hennigan still has Afflalo as a nice trade chip that can probly net a top 10 pick from a bordeline fringe playoff team

MNRunLeft wrote:

HartfordWhalers wrote:
3 picks + salary cap relief + Vucevic + Harkless is a much much better package for a rebuilding team.

I could see the argument for Chicago doing that, and for LAL accepting even if Orlando wouldn't.

If you land Noah and Deng does Orlando even need to do a complete rebuild though? Worst case they part that deal out just like they did Bynum and get as good or better return in the process.

To me, a Noah Deng Jameer big 3 is pretty much a worst case sceanrio for a team. And I like 2 of them. Buts its a 5th seed and no more at all. Why not go for a 10th seed and get tons of lottery tickets to stardom?

LAL in: Love, Cunningham, Beasley, own '13 1st, NJ '15 1st
LAL out: Howard, Peace, Ebanks

They get their pick back, which would probably be in the top 10 since Love would be out, and they would be losing their 2 best defensive players. Beasley is filler & his 3rd year on his contract is non-guaranteed so they don't screw up their plans for 2014.

NJ in: Howard, Dudley, Peace, O’Neal
NJ out: Lopez, Wallace, Brooks, Stackhouse, '15 1st

They get Howard + a decent C backup, + more depth at the 2 & 3.

MIN in: Wallace, Gortat, Ebanks, '13 PHX 2nd
MIN out: Love, Cunningham, Stiemsma

If the Wolves want to keep Pek beyond this season, Gortat makes more sense than Lopez because his D is good enough for Pek to play alongside him for stretches when they're not facing athletic roaming PFs. Wallace would start at SF & allow Kirilenko to play the 4, his more natural position at this point (an added bonus is Williams can play alongside either Wallace & Kirilenko due to their ability to guard both F positions). The Wolves would be stacked in the frontcourt.

PHX in: Lopez, Brooks, Stiemsma, Stackhouse
PHX out: Gortat, Dudley, O’Neal, Beasley,'13 LAL 1st, '13 2nd

They get a young C they can build around.

Absolutely horrible for minn the deal above

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

DLeagueAllStars wrote:Absolutely horrible for minn the deal above

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

Sorry, I don't see Love as a top 10 talent when healthy. If his defense was just average & not subpar I'd feel differently. Wallace is still solid, & put a pass first PG like Rubio next to Gortat and he'll put up the #s you saw last year.

busybluth22 wrote:LAL in: Love, Cunningham, Beasley, own '13 1st, NJ '15 1st
LAL out: Howard, Peace, Ebanks

They get their pick back, which would probably be in the top 10 since Love would be out, and they would be losing their 2 best defensive players. Beasley is filler & his 3rd year on his contract is non-guaranteed so they don't screw up their plans for 2014.

NJ in: Howard, Dudley, Peace, O’Neal
NJ out: Lopez, Wallace, Brooks, Stackhouse, '15 1st

They get Howard + a decent C backup, + more depth at the 2 & 3.

MIN in: Wallace, Gortat, Ebanks, '13 PHX 2nd
MIN out: Love, Cunningham, Stiemsma

If the Wolves want to keep Pek beyond this season, Gortat makes more sense than Lopez because his D is good enough for Pek to play alongside him for stretches when they're not facing athletic roaming PFs. Wallace would start at SF & allow Kirilenko to play the 4, his more natural position at this point (an added bonus is Williams can play alongside either Wallace & Kirilenko due to their ability to guard both F positions). The Wolves would be stacked in the frontcourt.

PHX in: Lopez, Brooks, Stiemsma, Stackhouse
PHX out: Gortat, Dudley, O’Neal, Beasley,'13 LAL 1st, '13 2nd

They get a young C they can build around.

Yeah bad value for MIN

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ag9mobf

Brooklyn Out: Lopez, Brooks, Blatche, 1st round pick
Brooklyn In: Resigned Dwight

They get their guy but give up considerable assets to do it which they will if they get a resigned Dwight.

Lakers Out: Dwight
Lakers In: Kevin Love, Brandon Roy
Lakers get Love for Dwight and take on Roy's contract, they do it if they think Dwight will leave.

Minnesota Out: Love, Pekovic, Roy
Minnesota In: Lopez, Anderson, Brooks, 1st round pick

Lopez is nice but wouldn't fit next to Pek so they trade Pek for Anderson. Brooks is a nice young wing player that can start/ back up Shved. It hinges on how badly the Love situation is and how much they think Pek is going to get on the open market. Given how good he is he might get a 12-14 mil per year offer and Anderson is a similar quality player on a great contract. If they were to trade Love and Pek I think it's good value.

New Orleans Out: Anderson
New Orleans In: Pekovic, Blatche

Anderson is one of their best players but unfortunately plays the same position as Davis. Moving him and being able to get a Center the quality of Pek to put next to Davis would be their motivations to do it. If they are willing to pay him in the offseason it makes sense to do this as that is a scary front court going forward.

Laker fans, are you having fun yet?

I just wanted to make sure everyone realized that a Dwight deal is about his indecisiveness and Bird rights.

First, Dwight's history of indecisiveness means that no team can be confident he's going to re-sign with them next year, so his trade value now is only going to be a percentage based on that expectation. LAL, BRK, ATL, DAL all seem like possible destinations, and I personally wouldn't give any of them over 50% chance of signing him. I would say that usually, a healthy, signed, Dwight Howard is so much better than any other center that he'd be #3 in the NBA in trade value - but with his health and this uncertainty, he's not going to bring back half of that value.

So who would make a trade now? Teams like ATL or DAL won't give up anything of real value in trade to get him now, because they have cap space and can make a max deal offer later, with no risk that Howard wakes up one morning this summer and signs a deal with another team.

Conversely, you can understand why LAL traded for him, and BRK would give up assets to sign him now. They don't have cap space, and new CBA rules prevents players on a sign-and-trade to go to teams over the lux. If they want their percentage chance of keeping Dwight, he needs to be on their roster before the trade deadline.

As for MIN, I think it's very unlikely that they trade Kevin Love. While the injured Love is not helping the team "win-now," they've been so crippled with injuries that even with Love they would be struggling to make the play-offs.

More importantly, it's very hard for non-destination teams like MIN to attract superstars in free agency, and MIN is very aware that high picks don't always become superstars. As the NBA changes and a few key destinations get two or even three superstars on one team, superstars become rarer for the rest of the NBA, and even more important for success. MIN can't afford to give up on one unless they are clearly getting a deal they can't refuse. After years of watching Brook Lopez, I don't believe he'll ever made the leap to superstardom.

MIN's best approach is to try to change Love's attitude about the team. They will start by not extending David Kahn this summer. Next, they should point out that Love and Rubio can be a superstar combination - and Rubio could be that even rarer superstar that wants to make the other guy look even better. Moreover, rounding out the team with Kirilenko, Shved and Pekovic make for a great starting line-up, and one that can get better - especially as Adelman gets more time in MIN. The key for Love is making the play-offs, and that team should have made it this year.

Unfortunately for the wolves, missing the play-offs this year makes Love a gamble. Right now, Kevin Love doesn't have a lot of leverage to pick a destination, because if a team traded for him, they'd have three shots at using Love in the play-offs. In fact, there isn't even a big drop in his trade value before next year's trade deadline, because for win-now teams, two swings at a ring is a very valuable thing. The danger for MIN now is that since they will miss the play-offs this year, they won't know by next year's deadline if going to the play-offs changes Love's attitude. Their worst case scenario is holding onto him past the deadline, and Love saying in the summer of 2014 that he will play his final season in MIN, and then he will only go to one team in 2015 - crushing his trade value.

However, even though it would be a gamble, it's a gamble the Wolves would be forced to take. Love has always been a risk since he was drafted, and he's pushed himself to improve past the ceiling that even the biggest homer could have had for him. He is irreplacable for the Wolves, and so I would be very surprised to see him get traded.

JLei wrote:http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ag9mobf

Brooklyn Out: Lopez, Brooks, Blatche, 1st round pick
Brooklyn In: Resigned Dwight

They get their guy but give up considerable assets to do it which they will if they get a resigned Dwight.

Lakers Out: Dwight
Lakers In: Kevin Love, Brandon Roy
Lakers get Love for Dwight and take on Roy's contract, they do it if they think Dwight will leave.

Minnesota Out: Love, Pekovic, Roy
Minnesota In: Lopez, Anderson, Brooks, 1st round pick

Lopez is nice but wouldn't fit next to Pek so they trade Pek for Anderson. Brooks is a nice young wing player that can start/ back up Shved. It hinges on how badly the Love situation is and how much they think Pek is going to get on the open market. Given how good he is he might get a 12-14 mil per year offer and Anderson is a similar quality player on a great contract. If they were to trade Love and Pek I think it's good value.

New Orleans Out: Anderson
New Orleans In: Pekovic, Blatche

Anderson is one of their best players but unfortunately plays the same position as Davis. Moving him and being able to get a Center the quality of Pek to put next to Davis would be their motivations to do it. If they are willing to pay him in the offseason it makes sense to do this as that is a scary front court going forward.

These trades are getting worse.

Minnesota won't trade Love and Pek for Lopez and Anderson. This is such poor value.

busybluth22 wrote:

DLeagueAllStars wrote:Absolutely horrible for minn the deal above

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

Sorry, I don't see Love as a top 10 talent when healthy. If his defense was just average & not subpar I'd feel differently. Wallace is still solid, & put a pass first PG like Rubio next to Gortat and he'll put up the #s you saw last year.

Love is a better defender than you think (not great, not good, but he's average after his slim down last year) and he is certainly Top 10 talent when healthy.

Wallace isn't that good and he's duplicated by AK who's playing better and not on a 4-year deal.

Bad value for the Wolves.

I agree with shrink's logic. This season is a wash, so no reason to send out Love now. If he makes it clear that he is still unhappy next year after Rubio gets back to full health and the Wolves make a playoff push, his value will not be any lower and you can make a trade then. Still fun for LAL fans to contemplate adding the ultimate stretch 4 to a lineup with Nash, KB24 and Gasol.

HartfordWhalers wrote:

MNRunLeft wrote:

HartfordWhalers wrote:
3 picks + salary cap relief + Vucevic + Harkless is a much much better package for a rebuilding team.

I could see the argument for Chicago doing that, and for LAL accepting even if Orlando wouldn't.

If you land Noah and Deng does Orlando even need to do a complete rebuild though? Worst case they part that deal out just like they did Bynum and get as good or better return in the process.

To me, a Noah Deng Jameer big 3 is pretty much a worst case scenario for a team. And I like 2 of them. Buts its a 5th seed and no more at all. Why not go for a 10th seed and get tons of lottery tickets to stardom?

Let's not candy coat it... Noah/Deng/Jameer without Thibs coaching, without Boozer's scoring, with no Taj as a backup and all the other meh role players like Nate and Hinrich that Thibs somehow makes look great is at best a 7 seed and more like a 9th to 10th seed.

Current Orlando is coached well and has some good role players themselves but are sure to fall back to earth even further by season's end and be around 4th worst record overall.

The 10th seed is an atrocious place to be, even worse then bottoming out or the 5th seed in the playoffs, or the 7th or 8th.

But that isn't even the point, was just saying 5 seed is such a wild leap of faith and 10th is a bad place to be.

If Orlando was going to take a package like that they should have grabbed Lopez/Brooks/Hump/3 1sts this summer, which was the obvious best offer out there, even more so if they turned it into a 3 or 4 team deal to bring back less win now stuff and more high value assets.