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Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to LAC

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Post#1 Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to LAC
Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:42 am by Texas Chuck

Mystic disagrees with me about Dallas being a seller at the deadline. I concede that as of today the FO is more likely to buy than sell but I still personally think this team needs to be a seller rather than fighting to be a 8th seed.

Simple deal

Odom(cut immediately obv) and 2013 LAC 1st

for

Kaman


I dont want to hear a whole bunch of posts about how Dallas would never deal with Odom again. He is simply a salary slot and would never even come to town. I dont mind criticism of the deal but please please dont weigh the thread down with that.

LAC gives up one of the last picks in the 1st round next year to upgrade their bigs. He would slide right in as the primary backup big and his range allows him to play with either Blake or Jordan. LAC is obviously very familiar with Chris. A nice little upgrade for their PS push without crossing the tax line and with no longterm $$.

Dallas simply gets rid of a guy who isnt a great fit with Dirk for a small asset to go forward with.

edit: Dallas could give a 2013 2nd if LAC if the value isnt quite right.
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Post#2 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:49 am by bryanoid

Damnit.. no. The point of the game is to get Kaman and Reggie Evans together on the same team at the same time like destiny intended. With this trade they'd barely miss each other yet again
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Post#3 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:51 am by sonictecture

Just because Dallas would immediately waive Odom, doesn't mean that the Clippers would give additional value in the form of their first round pick in the deal.

Kaman simply doesn't have value right now.
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Post#4 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Wed Jan 23, 2013 12:15 am by HotrodBeaubois

sonictecture wrote:Just because Dallas would immediately waive Odom, doesn't mean that the Clippers would give additional value in the form of their first round pick in the deal.

Kaman simply doesn't have value right now.



And what kind of value does Odom have?
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Post#5 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:21 am by BossHoggin

Isn't this deal impossible?
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Post#6 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Wed Jan 23, 2013 7:27 am by shrink

This is exactly the type of deal I think we will see both sides looking at, as we get closer and closer to the trade deadline.

Simple and effective - good job Texas Chuck.
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Post#7 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Wed Jan 23, 2013 8:06 am by branny

BossHoggin wrote:Isn't this deal impossible?

No it's possible
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Post#8 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Wed Jan 23, 2013 8:48 am by mysticbb

Texas Chuck wrote:Mystic disagrees with me about Dallas being a seller at the deadline. I concede that as of today the FO is more likely to buy than sell but I still personally think this team needs to be a seller rather than fighting to be a 8th seed.


What you think is rather irrelevant, because in the end you are making proposals which are highly unlikely to be seen in reality.

But let us assume that Dallas becomes a seller, the proposed deal here is still not going to happen for various reasons:

1. The Clippers want Odom to play defense, rebound and make the right pass here and there from the PF position. They don't want him to be trigger-happy and take away shots from better options. He is doing that and so far this season the Clippers are +13.3 per 100 possessions with Odom on the court, the highest value of all Clippers' players. Odom is not complaining about his role or minutes, he is doing his job and the Clippers are happy with that. They don't want to get rid of him.

2. Chris Kaman is worse than Odom at everything the Clippers need. He is the worse rebounder, the worse defender, the worse passer while also taking shots at a high rate whenever he feels he is open.

3. The Mavericks are not paying $4+m for a late 1st rounder. Let alone that as a Dallas fan you should know that neither the FO nor the coach can handle those drafts and rookies very well. What is the point for Dallas?


While I agree that Kaman and Nowitzki aren't looking well together, especially when the lead guards are inable to throw effective entry passes. But if anything, the Mavericks would rather look to improve their team by using Kaman's expirings for a defensive center. Kaman+Do. Jones for Dalembert+Udrih seems like a good idea, the Bucks save $2.3m in salary, getting a post option they are looking for, bigger guard they could pair for a few minutes with either Ellis or Jennings, while giving up a player they don't use anymore and a point guard, who is needed more on the Mavericks. Given the contract situation of Udrih and Dalembert, the Mavericks future financial situation doesn't take a hit.
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Post#9 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:12 am by Texas Chuck

Mystic,

Appreciate your feedback. I wish you would visit T&T more often as I am often the lone Dallas voice. You obviously have strong opinions on Dallas and could really add something to the board.

I honestly dont believe the idea of Dallas selling off a veteran is nearly as far-fetched as you. You see this magical 9-3 run leading into the deadline that I just cant see this team being able to pull off. If thats the case we clearly arent selling and might even be a buyer, but if we go a more realistic .500 over the next dozen games then why wouldnt we try and get some assets in exchange for pieces who won't be a part of the team next year?

Note: proposed Kaman for Daly before and Milw fans balked--cant imagine they would like it if they had to downgrade from Udrih to DoJo as well. A straight swap obviously would seem to make sense for both sides as Milw could use an offensive big and Dallas could use Daly whom they arent playing at all.

And finally, thanks for the new sig--I need the reminder to be sure.
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Post#10 Re: Sorry Mystic Im still selling--Kaman to
Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:17 am by mysticbb

Texas Chuck wrote:You see this magical 9-3 run leading into the deadline that I just cant see this team being able to pull off.


The thing is it is not impossible. The Mavericks showed an improved playing level ever since Nowitzki entered the S5. That has less to do with Nowitzki being such a great player this season (he is really not good at all), but it seems as if that allows Carlisle to pick better matchups for the other players. Going by the schedule and that playing level, 8-3 until the deadline is the most likely outcome for the Mavericks, if they continue to play at that level. If that isn't the case and it was just a small stretch, the Mavericks will obviously have to change their approach for the season.

But even then, it is not impossible to overcome the difference to the playoff spots. Right now they are 3.5 games behind the Rockets. If the Mavericks believe, that the difference is more due to Nowitzki being not available at the beginning than due to flaws in the roster, they might even not be sellers, if that difference still exists at the deadline, let alone it it became smaller.

Texas Chuck wrote:Note: proposed Kaman for Daly before and Milw fans balked--cant imagine they would like it if they had to downgrade from Udrih to DoJo as well. A straight swap obviously would seem to make sense for both sides as Milw could use an offensive big and Dallas could use Daly whom they arent playing at all.


It is then again something, which might be not in agreement with what the Bucks FO want. The deal would save them a substantial amount of money, which would even drag them slightly below the cap. It also creates a 7.4 TPE (Dalembert alone is enough to take on both Mavericks' players), which might be useful in the future, especially if they are above the cap.
Additionally, Udrih is not working well together with either Ellis or Jennings. That limits his potential playing time. Do. Jones on the other hand is a bigger guard, who should be able to fit better with those two in terms of defensive assignment and offensive distribution.
Overall a team has to give up something in order to gain something else. If the Bucks are dead-set at keeping Udrih, even if that could net them an offensive post option, a big TPE and $2.4m in cash, while getting a younger and potentially better fit for the guard rotation, it might be a questionable POV. Is Dallas not paying enough? Would it help to send a bit cash? Is the Lakers' 2nd rounder something the Bucks would consider valuable? Now, Dallas has some options to increase the offer, I guess.
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