Minny Rebuild

[pipfan]

Assumptions-
Minny thinks/knows Love will leave in 2015-decide to move him now
OKC does not win the title

1-Love and KMart to Suns for GGreen, Len, Goodwin, Suns pick, Wiz pick, Indy pick, Minny gets their pick back and the Lakers 2015 pick

2-Pek and Barea for Perkins, Lamb, PJIII

Suns go for it. They resign Bledsoe and become a contender
Dragic/Bledsoe
Bledsoe/KMart
Tucker/Morris
Love/Frye/Morris
Plumlee/Frye

That is a fun team

OKC gets a HUGE upgrade up front, at little cost. If they don't win it this year, they have to think about losing KD
Westbrook/Jackson/Barea
Thabo/Westbrook
KD/Thabo/Vet min
Ibaka/Collison
Pek/Collison

That team could win 70, if healthy. Pek would kill down low with so much attention away from him

Minny starts totally over, building around Rubio. Then, the have Shabazz and Deing. These trades add Lamb, Len, Goodwin, Green and PJIII. They try to move Brewer and Chase. Here are their picks

#13, #14, #18, #26-they pick at least 2 stash euros (Saric makes sense)
They get their pick back and the Lakers pick-which should be a mid to late lottery pick next year.

They have almost unlimited cap space moving, and a bunch of young talent. I know, it is easier to keep Love and pray for a Blazers-type jump-but if that doesn't happen? What is plan B if Love walks?

[kingstyyyle]

That's a lot to give up for what could be a year rental of Love. I think the Suns realize Love is a long shot and try to use the first round picks and maybe one of the prospects mentioned to move up in the draft.

[bondom34]

PHX wouldn't touch that, and I'm not a Suns fan.

The OKC trade doesn't work in trade machine.

[jayjaysee]

PHX wouldn't touch that, and I'm not a Suns fan.

The OKC trade doesn't work in trade machine.

I assume he wanted OKC to go into the tax by using the Martin TPE on Barea...




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[jayjaysee]

I don't understand why everyone is saying this is too much for Love.

The Green/Martin swap isn't a major loss if it is a loss.

Then it's this years picks - Phx 14, Washington 18, and Indy late.. That's not really a great deal of value

Then minn pick which is very well protected until it becomes a second.. Not much there if Minn is rebuilding

Len, Goodwin and the LAL picks are all very big question mark assets as well. Len has looked like a number 5 pick the same way Bennett has looked like a number 1. Goodwin is nice but prospects like that can be bought for 3 million on draft night. And LAL should tank and try to get in the bottom 5 next year to make some sort of long term base.. But they won't, most likely that pick falls in the 12-14 range, and really Kobe could have one year left of carrying rejects to the playoffs..

I don't see why Minn would rebuild by acquiring nearly a full roster of probable nonimpact players. That seems completely wasteful. A bunch of picks that you hope can one day become starters..

Turning Love into the best pick possible (usually G.Wallace+Joel+5th+18th+LAC first) would be a much better way to kick the rebuild, especially since Minn has Bazz, Dieng, and Rubio already which represent a decent youth movement.

Pek+18th+41st for 9th would seem a good follow up deal if Minn was interested in ripping it down and Cleveland interested in keeping it going. Maybe add Toronto in and have Minn pay Fields+Hayes next season so Toronto sends 20th to Cleveland and minn keeps 18th.

5th, 9th, 13th, 18th would be a lot better long term in my opinion. Dieng, Randle, McDermott, Shabazz, Rubio with Ennis and Hood..



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[slicedbread2]

This one will be a tough one. The question is this: Will Timberwolves fans be able to sustain another rebuild? That one has to be answered which would be a tough choice.

If Love decides that I'm not staying in Minnesota anymore, you have to ask him where he wants to go. There will be a lot of players, but if he states that I'm only going to New York, Los Angeles or Chicago, the Bulls would be the best option. I can't see a bubble team like Phoenix swooping in since I doubt Love would sign an extension there unless the Suns can be a consistent contender which they have the possibility of being plus giving up that Lakers pick which could be something good and a whole lot of their team for a rental of Love could backfire badly, but it'd be an interesting proposition although the Suns need to get some defense on that team. For a trade to Chicago, I'd go for a deal like this in the off-season to be arranged at the draft:

Chicago:K-Lo+K-Mart+Brewer+Turiaf
Minnesota: Carlos Boozer, expirings, Nikola Mirotic, 2014 #16, 2014 #19. SAC #1, Chicago second rounder 2014, Portland second rounders in 2015 and 2016.

Chicago adds a star at the 4 in Love who combined with Noah would form a fearsome duo at the front court combined with Rose being able to be more of a distributor, this would be an annoying front court to deal with. Kevin Martin can be instant offense who's flaws on defense can be covered by Thibodeau's defensive system. Brewer is the ideal cheap energy guy who's tight with Noah and will mesh in instantly. Turiaf is the ideal backup centre who can give Joakim Noah rest on the bench when necessary.

For Minnesota, I'm not big on the deal, but if Love makes an ultimatum saying I ain't signing an extension and I only want NY, LA or CHI, the last one would be the best considering all the Lakers have is the lottery pick and nothing else while the Knicks have zero assets to play with. This may be comparable to a salary dump, but getting rid of long term deals in Martin and Brewer along with guys not apart of the long term plans may be wise. Plus getting a plethora of picks never hurts and they wouldn't be stuck in cap hell where they can't do much if anything at all. They may not be the highest, but they could use them to their advantage to move up in the draft if need be. They also get a good prospect in Mirotic who could be something useful.

Next phase, I'd deal Boozer to a team looking for cap relief or getting out of a bad deal. Here'd be my next trade:

Boston: Carlos Boozer, Luc Richard Mbah a Moute, J.J. Barea, Alexey Shved
Minnesota: Gerald Wallace, Joel Anthony, Keith Bogans, TPE, LAC 2015 first rounder, Boston second rounder in 2015 and Miami 2016 second rounder

Celtics eat expiring deals while sending out low value picks and get out of Wallace's contract.

Minnesota eats Wallace's contract and buys him out. They get rid of their bench mob while waiving Bogans who 's deal is non-guaranteed. They subsequently eat Anthony's deal while getting picks.

I may look into moving Pekovic too and you don't want to send him to a conference rival like the Thunder who are already a nuisance to deal with. Cleveland perhaps? If it came down to Cleveland, I'd consider a deal like this:

Cleveland: Nikola Pekovic, #19
Minnesota: Alonzo Gee, Tyler Zeller, #9

Cleveland slides down in the draft to get a great big in Pek who could do really well in Cleveland and can be that enforcer down the post.

Minnesota gets a young prospect in Zeller who may need a change of scenery while waiving a non-guaranteed Gee and getting the 9th pick.

Final finishing touch I'd do:

Sacramento: Chase Budinger, Alonzo Gee
Minnesota: Travis Outlaw, Jared Dudley, Jason Terry, #57
LA Clippers: Jason Thompson

Kings waive Gee while getting a shorter deal in Budinger and dump some deadweight expiring deals and a long term deal while opening up 2 roster spots.

T-Wolves eat some expiring deals and another potential expiring in Dudley while adding another second.

Clippers get that third big to solidify their rotation.

Final finishing touches:

Milwaukee: Jason Terry+Travis Outlaw
Minnesota: OJ Mayo, second rounder from Milwaukee via Toronto

Bucks get out of Mayo's contract while sending away a low second.

Minnesota gets some depth in tank commander OJ Mayo while adding a pick.

Potential lineup:

Rubio/?
Muhammad/Mayo
?/?
?/?
Dieng/Zeller/Anthony

#9, #13, #16, #40, #43, #48, #49, #53, #58+Plus rights to Mirotic

Tank away next year to get a high pick. They can fill out the roster with some good veterans on expiring deals while going through a youth movement with loads of cap room. We'll see what happens in the off-season.

[gaspar]

This is waaaaaaaaay too much for a one year rental and a bad contract.

[Grits n Gravy]

I'd do it as a Wolves fan.

[sisibilio]

Suns won't give up all their tradeable assets for a 1 year rental.

[Laimbeer]

2-Pek and Barea for Perkins, Lamb, PJIII

OKC gets a HUGE upgrade up front, at little cost. If they don't win it this year, they have to think about losing KD
Westbrook/Jackson/Barea
Thabo/Westbrook
KD/Thabo/Vet min
Ibaka/Collison
Pek/Collison

That team could win 70, if healthy. Pek would kill down low with so much attention away from him

Again, we see the old formula of Perk's bad contract + trinkets = good players. Why would Minny do this?

[pipfan]

I don't see Pek as a bad contract. I think if OKC does not win the title they must make a move now to keep OKC. Pek would be a HUGE upgrade for OKC. OKC is not giving up much here

As for the Suns, I wonder if Love would give up his option-I doubt it but that would be 2 years. I see the Suns with Love and KMart as a contender. They could also keep Green to play some back up 3.

[JDLAW]

The equivalent of 7 first round picks and a rotation player for Love rental and Martin? Kareem and Wilt were acquired for less. A ridiculous trade proposal.

[AQuintus]

The equivalent of 7 first round picks

This is probably my biggest pet peeve on the draft board - talking about first round picks in a general sense and acting like they have a lot of value.

The first overall pick in the draft is a first round pick and has a TON of value. The 14th pick in the draft is a first round pick and has some value. The 30th pick in the draft is a first round pick and has little or even no value. They're all first round picks, and yet, they all have wildly different trade values.

If I offer you picks 24 through 30 in the draft for your best player, are you going to jump at the deal because you're getting "7 first round picks!"? Of course not.

It's like offering J.J. Barea and Robbie Hummell for Lebron James and thinking it's fair since I'm only getting one NBA player and the Heat are getting two NBA players. Yeah, it's technically true, but it's significantly more nuanced than that.

[pacers33granger]

I don't see how this is too much for the Suns to give up for Love. Sure, it's a lot of assets, but you're getting a top 10 possibly top 5 guy whose also young. I'd be pretty confident that a new team that's fun, up and coming, in a nice climate, and fits very well with Love is enough to keep him from jumping ship to the Lakers. Would he really turn down that extra money on what would be a contender to go to another uncertain situation like the Lakers?

Like I said, the Suns do give up a lot of assets. But the Indy pick is a late first, the Wiz pick is a mid first, and the Suns pick is a late lottery. Sure they have value, but adding them all together gets you at best the 8th pick. Len and Goodwin both have potential, but neither has lit it up and both came from a historically weak draft. The Minny pick and Lakers picks both could be anywhere and both are protected.

I can understand why Suns fans wouldn't want to pull the trigger, but I don't think it's enough for Minny to bite unless Love explicitly tells them he's gone.

[pipfan]

I agree-Love stays with Dragic and Bledsoe-imagine the spacing when Frye and Love are in together. There are a lot of assets going to MInny, but Love is worth it. The Suns would have a super fun team that could win 60 if things break right for them (Bledsoe healthy and improves, Love the huge upgrade, another year of experience)

[JDLAW]

The equivalent of 7 first round picks

This is probably my biggest pet peeve on the draft board - talking about first round picks in a general sense and acting like they have a lot of value.

The first overall pick in the draft is a first round pick and has a TON of value. The 14th pick in the draft is a first round pick and has some value. The 30th pick in the draft is a first round pick and has little or even no value. They're all first round picks, and yet, they all have wildly different trade values.

If I offer you picks 24 through 30 in the draft for your best player, are you going to jump at the deal because you're getting "7 first round picks!"? Of course not.

It's like offering J.J. Barea and Robbie Hummell for Lebron James and thinking it's fair since I'm only getting one NBA player and the Heat are getting two NBA players. Yeah, it's technically true, but it's significantly more nuanced than that.

I do not care what your pet peeve is. First round picks have become the currency in today's NBA with shorter contracts and higher tax penalties. Need to recognize this. BTW your analogies especially the trade analogy are off point to the point of being ridiculous.

I am not advocating this trade for either party, I am just pointing out how bad it is for the Suns. I actually think this is a horrible trade for both teams.

[JDLAW]

I agree-Love stays with Dragic and Bledsoe-imagine the spacing when Frye and Love are in together. There are a lot of assets going to MInny, but Love is worth it. The Suns would have a super fun team that could win 60 if things break right for them (Bledsoe healthy and improves, Love the huge upgrade, another year of experience)

Sorry, but this is a terrible trade for the Suns and likely for Minnesota. There is way too much risk for the Suns, and way too much to give without a guarantee he will stay - and that guarantee is no in the cards.

[bondom34]

PHX wouldn't touch that, and I'm not a Suns fan.

The OKC trade doesn't work in trade machine.

I assume he wanted OKC to go into the tax by using the Martin TPE on Barea...




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Ah I see then.....

[GopherIt!]

Wolves trade for a SG like Afflalo and land a decent shooting back up PG, they are in A LOT better shape than all these knucklehead haters think. Rubio can and will improve his shooting. He's already improved over the second half of this season. Flip has stated that he needs to develop a floater a la Tony Parker. People need to get it out of their head that a point guard needs to be great shooter to be great player (like Parker, or Jason Kidd.)