OKC/DEN/PHI Shoring up OKC

Post #1 » by **Texas Chuck** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:30 am

Denver out: Mosgov/Foye
Denver in: Lamb/2015 OKC 1st(meaningless top 10 protection attached)/2015 2nd from Philly

Philly out: 2015 2nd rounder from their stash
Philly in: Perkins/McGary

OKC out: Perkins/Lamb/McGary/2015 1st
OKC in: Mosgov/Foye

Why for Denver--they can't really compete in the West, they can't move McGee and so they need to play him and Nurkic. This gets them a couple assets for the future and saves them money

Why for Philly--get another asset for taking on Perkins' deal for this year.

Why for OKC-- with Morrow now out for awhile on top of the Durant injury, and needing a better center to pair with Adams already they cash in some assets they won't miss(McGary maybe eventually, but you got to give to get) and get a veteran center to share the spot with Adams and a veteran shooter to start next to Westbrook.

*Denver could obviously decide to just cut Philly out and take Perkins and McGary for themselves.

marcush · Post #2 » by **marcush** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:49 am

No for sixers. Not close to enough incentive to absorb Perkins contract.

HornetJail · Post #3 » by **HornetJail** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 1:44 am

I can't see what use McGary has to Philly, considering they've already got Noel, Embiid, and Sims at the center position moving forward.

the_process · Post #4 » by **the_process** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 2:27 am

Sixers say no, even though McGary will be (if he isn't already) much better than Sims and would be an ideal 3rd big to play behind both Noel and Embiid, it's not enough to eat 9.7m of Perkins. Maybe if the Sixers can send JRich out they would say yes.

Denver definitely says no, as they wont tank apparently, and this is a tanking type trade.

OKC snaps this up in a heartbeat as it would probably be enough to snag a title before CLE gels and rips off a three-peat.

What about if we added Minnesota...

MIN gets McGee, DEN 2015 1st top 10 protected, and OKC 2015 1st
OKC gets Pekovic
PHI gets Perkins and Lamb
DEN gets JRich and GSW 2015 2nd

MIN gets a 1st for Pek, and a 1st for taking McGee
OKC gets their C and a ring if they put Pek on the Wade plan
PHI eats 5m for a prospect SG
DEN dumps McGee on the cheap especially since it's 50/50 whether they actually give up their 2015 pick

Post #5 » by **Texas Chuck** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 3:42 am

In thinking about the Philly portion of this deal I took into account them still being beneath the salary floor so they aren't really adding the full value of Perkins' contract here.

I understand the possibly opportunity costs for the Sixers but considering some of the salary dumps that happened without them, I'm not sure this hurts them in that regard. They would still have $15M-$20M in cap space after this.

And the incentives could be changed around a bit if McGary is the wrong piece for them. I was trying to get them a guy with a full 4 years of rookie deal left as that should be more valuable to them.

Does anyone have thoughts on the Thunder/Nuggets portion? It's actually the real crux of the deal.

Post #6 » by **bondom34** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:27 am

Yes please for me. I feel like the OKC/Denver part is fair value, and McGary could be swapped for PJ if needed, but I don't feel like that makes a difference to Philly either. I love it.

Post #7 » by **MoneyTalks41890** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:18 am

I'd rather keep McGary for PJ if possible. Doubt Denver bites.

Post #8 » by **Domejandro** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:33 am

I actually think Denver is the team that says no thanks.

Why would Philadelphia say no to this? That makes no sense what so ever, you trade for an overpriced player for one season and get a player on a 7.5/4 year deal in Mitch McGary. Joel Embiid is completely out this year, and best case scenario they get an excellent back up with him. They would consider this very strongly, why wouldn't they? As I have repeated 4 times in these sentences, it makes no sense for them not to. Joel is out the whole season, and McGary is a very solid young prospect that fell greatly simply due to his injury concern. He either pans out, which would be excellent, or is injured and does not help them win. Either way it is a massive success.

greenandgold · Post #9 » by **greenandgold** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 9:32 am

Okc says no. All this for Mozgov? Okc already stacked with young centers with Adams, Mcgary and Pleiss coming from Europe next year.

Lamb and Foye are a wash and Id rather bet on Lambs extreme youth. Statistcally he did fine as a 21 year old player.

Fair value is a first round pick for Moz. Thsts it. Okc will pay NOTHING to get rid of Perks expiring contract.

Post #10 » by **MoneyTalks41890** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 11:11 am

greenandgold wrote:Okc says no. All this for Mozgov? Okc already stacked with young centers with Adams, Mcgary and Pleiss coming from Europe next year.

Lamb and Foye are a wash and Id rather bet on Lambs extreme youth. Statistcally he did fine as a 21 year old player.

Fair value is a first round pick for Moz. Thsts it. Okc will pay NOTHING to get rid of Perks expiring contract.

I don't like McGary in this, but I don't think a pick around 25 is enough for Denver for Mozgov.

LloydFree · Post #11 » by **LloydFree** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:23 pm

As a 76ers fan, I would do that, but I know Hinkie isn't going to do that. If they wouldn't take Jeremy Lin or Jarrett Jack to get a 1st round pick, they won't take McGary to accept Perkins' contract. The 76ers are financing the tank, by keeping costs down.

On the other hand: I'm surprised OKC fans would do that. That seems like a lot to give up for Mozgov.

Post #12 » by **HartfordWhalers** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 1:55 pm

MoneyTalks41890 wrote:
greenandgold wrote:Okc says no. All this for Mozgov? Okc already stacked with young centers with Adams, Mcgary and Pleiss coming from Europe next year.

Lamb and Foye are a wash and Id rather bet on Lambs extreme youth. Statistcally he did fine as a 21 year old player.

Fair value is a first round pick for Moz. Thsts it. Okc will pay NOTHING to get rid of Perks expiring contract.

I don't like McGary in this, but I don't think a pick around 25 is enough for Denver for Mozgov.

I don't. Cheap. Passable starting center in the NBA for a pick around 25? I'm not saying he is worth the lotto, but Moz should get closer to 15 than 25 imo.

If I am Cleveland I'm offering 2 late firsts for him and not blinking for instance.

Post #13 » by **HartfordWhalers** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 3:18 pm

Domejandro wrote:I actually think Denver is the team that says no thanks.

Why would Philadelphia say no to this? That makes no sense what so ever, you trade for an overpriced player for one season and get a player on a 7.5/4 year deal in Mitch McGary. Joel Embiid is completely out this year, and best case scenario they get an excellent back up with him. They would consider this very strongly, why wouldn't they? As I have repeated 4 times in these sentences, it makes no sense for them not to. Joel is out the whole season, and McGary is a very solid young prospect that fell greatly simply due to his injury concern. He either pans out, which would be excellent, or is injured and does not help them win. Either way it is a massive success.

Philly didn't take on Thornton for Zeller and a 1st, and I would argue that Thornton is a better contract than Perkins (money is very similar). Maybe they weren't offered it (i doubt it), but McGaryis a so so return for Perkins, not anything special. And Philly has been extraordinarily stingy with cap space up until the last minutes of the trade deadline.

I think itwouldlook better for Philly if McGary and the 2015 pick were switched. Philly gets a pick probably later than McGary, but can take a guy at a spot of need, and at a time where they want (later).

For Denver, ignoring that I hate the value, switching McGary for the 2015 1st should work, as he fits well after trading Mozgov and the value should be in line between McGary and the pick.

Post #14 » by **MoneyTalks41890** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 4:50 pm

Make it a 3 way with Boston:

Boston out: Thorton

Boston in: Perk, Jarrett, 2017 Memphis 2nd

Boston gets Perk back for a year to fill the hole at C, several Celtics fans have been on board with taking him for nothing.

Denver out: Foye, Mozgov

Denver in: Lamb, PJ3, Telfair, 2015 1st

Denver gets assets for Mozgov to help with the future development of the team and a pick this year.

OKC out: Perkins, Lamb, PJ3, Telfair, Jarrett, 2015 1st

OKC in: Thorton, Foye, Mozgov

OKC gets a good center to pair with Adams and a couple of shooters to add to the bench.

Russ/RJ
Morrow/Foye/Thorton
KD/Roberson/Thomas
Ibaka/Collison/McGary
Adams/Mozgov

nomansland · Post #15 » by **nomansland** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 11:52 pm

Chuck Texas wrote:Does anyone have thoughts on the Thunder/Nuggets portion? It's actually the real crux of the deal.

It makes no sense.

- the Nugs think they can compete in the West
- yet another deal that Denver supposedly does to "save money" when nobody says they're actually trying to save money
- even if they were trying to save money, Mozgov is on a really good deal for a starting big, even for a backup
- the picks they get back are worthless
- if anyone is on the block at this point, it's McGee

greenandgold · Post #16 » by **greenandgold** » Sun Oct 26, 2014 2:12 pm

Mozgov had a solid year last season but he's now 28. He's a solid player, without much upside, on a sub-midlevel contract. That has value. Two first round picks? Not likely. My guess is one first round pick is his market value. Thaddeus Young netted one first round pick, the 2015 Cavs pick which will obviously be very late. Arron Afflalo netted Evan Fournier and a very late second round pick. Is Mozgov worth more than those guys? I don't think so.

McGary is 22, and locked into a cost controlled contract for the next 4 to 5 years. He's undersized but he is a true center (6'11", 260 pounds, 7 foot wingspan), not a power forward. He's part of the longtime solution for OKC's frontcourt.

OKC loves McGary. He's not going to be a throw-in into any trade for stopgap players. Lamb and Jones may be available, but not McGary or Roberson.

skywalker33 · Post #17 » by **skywalker33** » Sun Oct 26, 2014 10:29 pm

greenandgold wrote:Fair value is a first round pick for Moz. Thsts it. Okc will pay NOTHING to get rid of Perks expiring contract.

Well, DEN has already turned down a first from CLE, so your wrong about that.....maybe from an OKC perspective it's good value, not from the DEN side

As for the OP, it's done by DEN only at the deadline and only if they way out of the playoffs, which they don't anticipate from what I've read.

the_process · Post #18 » by **the_process** » Sun Oct 26, 2014 11:09 pm

greenandgold wrote:Mozgov had a solid year last season but he's now 28. He's a solid player, without much upside, on a sub-midlevel contract. That has value. Two first round picks? Not likely. My guess is one first round pick is his market value. Thaddeus Young netted one first round pick, the 2015 Cavs pick which will obviously be very late. Arron Afflalo netted Evan Fournier and a very late second round pick. Is Mozgov worth more than those guys? I don't think so.

McGary is 22, and locked into a cost controlled contract for the next 4 to 5 years. He's undersized but he is a true center (6'11", 260 pounds, 7 foot wingspan), not a power forward. He's part of the longtime solution for OKC's frontcourt.

OKC loves McGary. He's not going to be a throw-in into any trade for stopgap players. Lamb and Jones may be available, but not McGary or Roberson.

Thaddeus Young fetched the Heat 1st rounder, actually. Should be middle of the round. Also your 2015 1st will be way too low to facilitate any kind of Perkins upgrade.

skywalker33 · Post #19 » by **skywalker33** » Mon Oct 27, 2014 3:13 am

oyoyer wrote:
greenandgold wrote:Mozgov had a solid year last season but he's now 28. He's a solid player, without much upside, on a sub-midlevel contract. That has value. Two first round picks? Not likely. My guess is one first round pick is his market value. Thaddeus Young netted one first round pick, the 2015 Cavs pick which will obviously be very late. Arron Afflalo netted Evan Fournier and a very late second round pick. Is Mozgov worth more than those guys? I don't think so.

McGary is 22, and locked into a cost controlled contract for the next 4 to 5 years. He's undersized but he is a true center (6'11", 260 pounds, 7 foot wingspan), not a power forward. He's part of the longtime solution for OKC's frontcourt.

OKC loves McGary. He's not going to be a throw-in into any trade for stopgap players. Lamb and Jones may be available, but not McGary or Roberson.

Thaddeus Young fetched the Heat 1st rounder, actually. Should be middle of the round. Also your 2015 1st will be way too low to facilitate any kind of Perkins upgrade.

Well, in that trade you are dismissing MIN's NEED for a PF, Bennett was nothing more than potential, who else did they have to fill the role left open by Love's departure. ??

Post #20 » by **HartfordWhalers** » Mon Oct 27, 2014 3:43 am

skywalker33 wrote:
oyoyer wrote:
greenandgold wrote:Mozgov had a solid year last season but he's now 28. He's a solid player, without much upside, on a sub-midlevel contract. That has value. Two first round picks? Not likely. My guess is one first round pick is his market value. Thaddeus Young netted one first round pick, the 2015 Cavs pick which will obviously be very late. Arron Afflalo netted Evan Fournier and a very late second round pick. Is Mozgov worth more than those guys? I don't think so.

McGary is 22, and locked into a cost controlled contract for the next 4 to 5 years. He's undersized but he is a true center (6'11", 260 pounds, 7 foot wingspan), not a power forward. He's part of the longtime solution for OKC's frontcourt.

OKC loves McGary. He's not going to be a throw-in into any trade for stopgap players. Lamb and Jones may be available, but not McGary or Roberson.

Thaddeus Young fetched the Heat 1st rounder, actually. Should be middle of the round. Also your 2015 1st will be way too low to facilitate any kind of Perkins upgrade.

Well, in that trade you are dismissing MIN's NEED for a PF, Bennett was nothing more than potential, who else did they have to fill the role left open by Love's departure. ??

lol. How is he dismissing that Minnesota trade for him because they wanted him? He correctly pointed out that the pick for a player like Thad, was far more than said. I suppose if the goal is to trade a player to where they aren't wanted you could get a worse return, but that seems like not an argument i would use to say someone else was dismissing something.

In terms of Mozgov, if greenandgold doesn't think he is worth two super late firsts, I think he is wrong, and one is definitely not enough. If its a pick more in teh middle of the first, then 1 would work.