Jabari Parker-What's your bid?

[buckboy]

Just curious mostly. This is a very complicated situation, and in no way do I think the Bucks would trade him, even if I think they should.

Given the fact that you'll have to do something contract-wise with him next summer, and he's not likely to play more than 30 games next year, what's he worth?

[MotownMadness]

I still say he gets the max just given what a talent he is. Someone is taking that chance on him but his injuries are kinda scary at this point.

[asitter]

I'll be honest; I haven't seen him play much at all since being drafted. Is he solidly a PF in today's NBA? Looking at his stats, he seems to play like a traditional stretch 4, but he seems to lack something on the defensive end. So he'd need to pair with a good rim protecting 5, correct? How about Myles Turner?

Not sure what the Pacers would offer though.

[bdpecore]

I'll be honest; I haven't seen him play much at all since being drafted. Is he solidly a PF in today's NBA? Looking at his stats, he seems to play like a traditional stretch 4, but he seems to lack something on the defensive end. So he'd need to pair with a good rim protecting 5, correct? How about Myles Turner?

Not sure what the Pacers would offer though.

He plays more SF since Giannis is better utilized playing PF as a secondary rim protector. He has no trouble playing man on man defense but gets lost when they start switching in their defensive scheme. But his offensive game is getting better and better and he was even more explosive after coming back from his first ACL tear. Worst case scenario, he loses some athleticism when he returns and has to change his game to mimic Paul Pierce. IMO he's still gonna give you 20ppg a night regardless.

[Djh7475]

I'll be honest; I haven't seen him play much at all since being drafted. Is he solidly a PF in today's NBA? Looking at his stats, he seems to play like a traditional stretch 4, but he seems to lack something on the defensive end. So he'd need to pair with a good rim protecting 5, correct? How about Myles Turner?

Not sure what the Pacers would offer though.

He plays more SF since Giannis is better utilized playing PF as a secondary rim protector. He has no trouble playing man on man defense but gets lost when they start switching in their defensive scheme. But his offensive game is getting better and better and he was even more explosive after coming back from his first ACL tear. Worst case scenario, he loses some athleticism when he returns and has to change his game to mimic Paul Pierce. IMO he's still gonna give you 20ppg a night regardless.

Paul Pierce was an incredible defender during the front end of the big 3 era even with his lack of athleticism. Parker wasn't a great defender with legit athleticism prior to his injury. Also, changing his offensive game to mimic Paul Pierce (one of the craftiest guys to play the game) is easier said than done. Paul Pierce was a better shooter and was much smarter about drawing fouls and using great footwork and ball fakes to get to his spots.

I'm not saying Parker isn't incredibly skilled because he is, but Pierce was a regular 23-25 PPG guy throughout his prime and ends with a career average right below 20 PPG due to the last few years of his career being throw-away years. Parker had a 50 game stretch averaging 20 PPG before tearing his ACL a 2nd time. Acting as if Paul Pierce is still his worst case comparison before seeing how he responds to his 2nd surgery seems outrageously optimistic.

People seem to forget how good Pierce was in his heyday simply because he stayed in the NBA way past his expiration date. I'm a big Parker fan, but with this latest injury and his contract situation, it really is tough to give up enough value to make the Bucks what would be considered a fair offer. As a guy who has grown into a mini-Bucks fan, I think you keep him and hope for the best.

[rugbyrugger23]

I think the LaVine for Parker debate is interesting.

For Bucks, imagine LaVine shooting with Middleton. LaVine could even play NON offense initiating PG with Giannis handling ball.

For Wolves, Parker doesn't improve defense Thibs needs, but doesn't make it worse. And if Wiggins is ideal at SG, and like sooooo many Wolves fans have tried to convince me (since I don't agree) if Wolves choose between LaVine and Wiggins, it's Wiggins. And rather then regulate LaVine to bench super 6th, trade him for Parker. Parker can play next to Wiggins at SF and small ball 4 as needed.

[Texas Chuck]

Paul Pierce was an incredible defender during the front end of the big 3 era even with his lack of athleticism. Parker wasn't a great defender with legit athleticism prior to his injury. Also, changing his offensive game to mimic Paul Pierce (one of the craftiest guys to play the game) is easier said than done. Paul Pierce was a better shooter and was much smarter about drawing fouls and using great footwork and ball fakes to get to his spots.

I'm not saying Parker isn't incredibly skilled because he is, but Pierce was a regular 23-25 PPG guy throughout his prime and ends with a career average right below 20 PPG due to the last few years of his career being throw-away years. Parker had a 50 game stretch averaging 20 PPG before tearing his ACL a 2nd time. Acting as if Paul Pierce is still his worst case comparison before seeing how he responds to his 2nd surgery seems outrageously optimistic.

People seem to forget how good Pierce was in his heyday simply because he stayed in the NBA way past his expiration date. I'm a big Parker fan, but with this latest injury and his contract situation, it really is tough to give up enough value to make the Bucks what would be considered a fair offer. As a guy who has grown into a mini-Bucks fan, I think you keep him and hope for the best.

Im almost certain he wasn't claiming he would be a Truth-level player, but rather using him as an example of a player who was still effective offensively without elite athleticism.

[bdpecore]

I'll be honest; I haven't seen him play much at all since being drafted. Is he solidly a PF in today's NBA? Looking at his stats, he seems to play like a traditional stretch 4, but he seems to lack something on the defensive end. So he'd need to pair with a good rim protecting 5, correct? How about Myles Turner?

Not sure what the Pacers would offer though.

He plays more SF since Giannis is better utilized playing PF as a secondary rim protector. He has no trouble playing man on man defense but gets lost when they start switching in their defensive scheme. But his offensive game is getting better and better and he was even more explosive after coming back from his first ACL tear. Worst case scenario, he loses some athleticism when he returns and has to change his game to mimic Paul Pierce. IMO he's still gonna give you 20ppg a night regardless.

Paul Pierce was an incredible defender during the front end of the big 3 era even with his lack of athleticism. Parker wasn't a great defender with legit athleticism prior to his injury. Also, changing his offensive game to mimic Paul Pierce (one of the craftiest guys to play the game) is easier said than done. Paul Pierce was a better shooter and was much smarter about drawing fouls and using great footwork and ball fakes to get to his spots.

I'm not saying Parker isn't incredibly skilled because he is, but Pierce was a regular 23-25 PPG guy throughout his prime and ends with a career average right below 20 PPG due to the last few years of his career being throw-away years. Parker had a 50 game stretch averaging 20 PPG before tearing his ACL a 2nd time. Acting as if Paul Pierce is still his worst case comparison before seeing how he responds to his 2nd surgery seems outrageously optimistic.

People seem to forget how good Pierce was in his heyday simply because he stayed in the NBA way past his expiration date. I'm a big Parker fan, but with this latest injury and his contract situation, it really is tough to give up enough value to make the Bucks what would be considered a fair offer. As a guy who has grown into a mini-Bucks fan, I think you keep him and hope for the best.

I meant Paul's offensive game not defensive. And when i meant worst case, I was referring to not regaining his full athleticism. Will he be able to replicate Pierce's production? Probably not but he does have enough drive and current offensive skills (footwork, handles, shooting and ability to finish through contact) to change up his game if necessary.

[HartfordWhalers]

Just curious mostly. This is a very complicated situation, and in no way do I think the Bucks would trade him, even if I think they should.

Given the fact that you'll have to do something contract-wise with him next summer, and he's not likely to play more than 30 games next year, what's he worth?

They don't. This is easy.

You wait and in the summer of '18 he is a restricted free agent, and worse case you match a 2+1PO contract that is more money and less years than you like. But you wait and see how it works next year and what the market is. Unless he wants to sign up for a discount now.

Either way, don't worry the contract imo. Now, if you are worried long term fit/team defense/fit/his health, then put him out to bid. But it feels a bad time to be selling and maximizing the return.

[goober]

I remember the Favors for Jabari talks just a year ago, how does the value for that look now?

[buckboy]

Just curious mostly. This is a very complicated situation, and in no way do I think the Bucks would trade him, even if I think they should.

Given the fact that you'll have to do something contract-wise with him next summer, and he's not likely to play more than 30 games next year, what's he worth?

They don't. This is easy.

You wait and in the summer of '18 he is a restricted free agent, and worse case you match a 2+1PO contract that is more money and less years than you like. But you wait and see how it works next year and what the market is. Unless he wants to sign up for a discount now.

Either way, don't worry the contract imo. Now, if you are worried long term fit/team defense/fit/his health, then put him out to bid. But it feels a bad time to be selling and maximizing the return.

I'm worried about all of it. And, yeah, I think the contract is the most important factor. I'm going to have to base my offer, or my choice to match an offer, on 30 games, tops.

Personally, I'd trade him if I could get what I'd consider fair value, which is also fairly debatable. I'm in the minority of Bucks fans there though.

[HartfordWhalers]

I think the LaVine for Parker debate is interesting.

For Bucks, imagine LaVine shooting with Middleton. LaVine could even play NON offense initiating PG with Giannis handling ball.

For Wolves, Parker doesn't improve defense Thibs needs, but doesn't make it worse. And if Wiggins is ideal at SG, and like sooooo many Wolves fans have tried to convince me (since I don't agree) if Wolves choose between LaVine and Wiggins, it's Wiggins. And rather then regulate LaVine to bench super 6th, trade him for Parker. Parker can play next to Wiggins at SF and small ball 4 as needed.

I like it. I particularly like the LaVine Giannis fit idea.

[jbent87]

seems like Jabari is in Embiid trade value territory now, no? As in presents so much more value to original team if he remains healthy its just better off holding onto him than selling him for less value to a team scared about the injuries.

[tiderulz]

I'll be honest; I haven't seen him play much at all since being drafted. Is he solidly a PF in today's NBA? Looking at his stats, he seems to play like a traditional stretch 4, but he seems to lack something on the defensive end. So he'd need to pair with a good rim protecting 5, correct? How about Myles Turner?

Not sure what the Pacers would offer though.

He plays more SF since Giannis is better utilized playing PF as a secondary rim protector. He has no trouble playing man on man defense but gets lost when they start switching in their defensive scheme. But his offensive game is getting better and better and he was even more explosive after coming back from his first ACL tear. Worst case scenario, he loses some athleticism when he returns and has to change his game to mimic Paul Pierce. IMO he's still gonna give you 20ppg a night regardless.

Paul Pierce was an incredible defender during the front end of the big 3 era even with his lack of athleticism. Parker wasn't a great defender with legit athleticism prior to his injury. Also, changing his offensive game to mimic Paul Pierce (one of the craftiest guys to play the game) is easier said than done. Paul Pierce was a better shooter and was much smarter about drawing fouls and using great footwork and ball fakes to get to his spots.

I'm not saying Parker isn't incredibly skilled because he is, but Pierce was a regular 23-25 PPG guy throughout his prime and ends with a career average right below 20 PPG due to the last few years of his career being throw-away years. Parker had a 50 game stretch averaging 20 PPG before tearing his ACL a 2nd time. Acting as if Paul Pierce is still his worst case comparison before seeing how he responds to his 2nd surgery seems outrageously optimistic.

People seem to forget how good Pierce was in his heyday simply because he stayed in the NBA way past his expiration date. I'm a big Parker fan, but with this latest injury and his contract situation, it really is tough to give up enough value to make the Bucks what would be considered a fair offer. As a guy who has grown into a mini-Bucks fan, I think you keep him and hope for the best.

lets not forget that Pierce was putting up 20 FGA/game as the #1 option in Boston during his prime. Parker did 20 ppg on 16 FGA this year.

[Golabki]

I don't think we've seen Parker show he's even an average NBA starter if healthy... and he may never be healthy.

Parker isn't really good at anything but scoring and even when the Parker hype train was full steam he clearly wasn't a good enough scorer to be a number 1 scoring option (the bucks were hot boiled garbage when running offense through Parker in Giannis-free bench units).

If you but him on a roster with an elite point forward, 2 good 2-way guards, and a quality center he can hit in well as a complementary piece... which is good because that's what the bucks have... but that's more about how good Giannis is than how good Parker is

[bdpecore]

I don't think we've seen Parker show he's even an average NBA starter if healthy... and he may never be healthy.

Parker isn't really good at anything but scoring and even when the Parker hype train was full steam he clearly wasn't a good enough scorer to be a number 1 scoring option (the bucks were hot boiled garbage when running offense through Parker in Giannis-free bench units).

If you but him on a roster with an elite point forward, 2 good 2-way guards, and a quality center he can hit in well as a complementary piece... which is good because that's what the bucks have... but that's more about how good Giannis is than how good Parker is

Jabari was scoring 20ppg while spending most of the time sitting in the corner. He had to create his own shot when given the opportunity.

Here is a great write up about his offensive game and how Kidd has not been utilizing him properly.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/news/jabari-parker-bucks-offense-breakdown-giannis-antetokounmpo/1xh79r7byl82p1pkgjpyuc2x5u

[OrlandoDream]

If I were to judge him only when he plays Orlando, probably worth the #1 pick. He had a career year but those injuries scare me; especially as he is suffering them at a young age. He is still just 22 and has had season ending injuries 2 of his 3 first seasons. I hope he comes back strong and has a career year but Id be afraid to trade too much value unless he can prove to stay healthy.

[Golabki]

I don't think we've seen Parker show he's even an average NBA starter if healthy... and he may never be healthy.

Parker isn't really good at anything but scoring and even when the Parker hype train was full steam he clearly wasn't a good enough scorer to be a number 1 scoring option (the bucks were hot boiled garbage when running offense through Parker in Giannis-free bench units).

If you but him on a roster with an elite point forward, 2 good 2-way guards, and a quality center he can hit in well as a complementary piece... which is good because that's what the bucks have... but that's more about how good Giannis is than how good Parker is

Jabari was scoring 20ppg while spending most of the time sitting in the corner. He had to create his own shot when given the opportunity.

Here is a great write up about his offensive game and how Kidd has not been utilizing him properly.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/news/jabari-parker-bucks-offense-breakdown-giannis-antetokounmpo/1xh79r7byl82p1pkgjpyuc2x5u

The Sporting News still exists?!

[bdpecore]

I don't think we've seen Parker show he's even an average NBA starter if healthy... and he may never be healthy.

Parker isn't really good at anything but scoring and even when the Parker hype train was full steam he clearly wasn't a good enough scorer to be a number 1 scoring option (the bucks were hot boiled garbage when running offense through Parker in Giannis-free bench units).

If you but him on a roster with an elite point forward, 2 good 2-way guards, and a quality center he can hit in well as a complementary piece... which is good because that's what the bucks have... but that's more about how good Giannis is than how good Parker is

Jabari was scoring 20ppg while spending most of the time sitting in the corner. He had to create his own shot when given the opportunity.

Here is a great write up about his offensive game and how Kidd has not been utilizing him properly.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/news/jabari-parker-bucks-offense-breakdown-giannis-antetokounmpo/1xh79r7byl82p1pkgjpyuc2x5u

The Sporting News still exists?!

I'm not sure if they still print actual newspapers but their online content is still top notch.

[UTJazzFan_Echo1]

I remember the Favors for Jabari talks just a year ago, how does the value for that look now?

After two ACL tears and with his contract coming up soon? Jabari is essentially worthless now. The Buck would probably need to add their 1st round pick from this year to make the value even close.

At least, that's true when using the same logic that most people on these forums use when judging Favors value.

"Two injury riddled seasons means he'll never get healthy and he'll get paid too much money soon"

Sounds JUST like Jabari, but Jabari is even worse off.