Hassan Whiteside: Road To The Max II

[IggieCC]

Deng will easily get an offer around 14~16M range from other teams...yes that's the crazy side of the salary cap raising

This is unarguably correct. In fact, Deng is perhaps a bargain at that rate.

According to the reports today, Bradley Beal is going to get a 5 year max offer from the Wizards.

http://wizofawes.com/2016/05/27/washington-wizards-bradley-beal-max-contract-offer-report/

He averages 62 games per year. 16 ppg, 3 apg, 3.7 rpg with a PER of 14.3, and ORTG/DRTG of 102/106 p 100 possessions. <- That's negative. MInus 4. Last year he was Minus 5.

How much is his max? The same as Whiteside's:

Spoiler:

$21,564,143 (2016-17)
$23,181,454 (2017-18)
$24,798,764 (2018-19)
$26,416,075 (2019-20)
$28,033,386 (2020-21)

$123,993,821

The Wizards have full bird rights though and are expected to offer a 5 year deal. Those are some crazy numbers, right? Look at these numbers:

$23,741,060 (2016-17)
$25,289,390 (2017-18)
$26,837,720 (2018-19)

They are for the last 3 years of Chris Bosh's contract. Remember how people complained about his contract? Well, ok, Chris has had the blood clots for two seasons, so he's only played 97 games the last two years. He is still averaging 68 per season. Beal, by contrast, played 21 more games over the last two seasons than Chris. So, by syllogism, Beal has played 10 more games per season than our player who has been ruled out for play at the All-Star Break. Let that sink in.

My opinion is that Beal being offered a max sets a bottom line to how far teams will go with their money. Whiteside will get many max offers. Deng will get generous offers too. Adding another year to Deng's contract (as I suggested before) is possibly a way to win him over since (a) he likes playing in Miami (b) appreciates our fans and (c) likes his role and the teammates. He also wants to win.

Thanks GoM the real MVP. That's just insane. And I don't even like Deng 50% of the time

Let's just sign Whiteside and be happy gom

[gom]

Deng will easily get an offer around 14~16M range from other teams...yes that's the crazy side of the salary cap raising

This is unarguably correct. In fact, Deng is perhaps a bargain at that rate.

According to the reports today, Bradley Beal is going to get a 5 year max offer from the Wizards.

http://wizofawes.com/2016/05/27/washington-wizards-bradley-beal-max-contract-offer-report/

He averages 62 games per year. 16 ppg, 3 apg, 3.7 rpg with a PER of 14.3, and ORTG/DRTG of 102/106 p 100 possessions. <- That's negative. MInus 4. Last year he was Minus 5.

How much is his max? The same as Whiteside's:

Spoiler:

$21,564,143 (2016-17)
$23,181,454 (2017-18)
$24,798,764 (2018-19)
$26,416,075 (2019-20)
$28,033,386 (2020-21)

$123,993,821

The Wizards have full bird rights though and are expected to offer a 5 year deal. Those are some crazy numbers, right? Look at these numbers:

$23,741,060 (2016-17)
$25,289,390 (2017-18)
$26,837,720 (2018-19)

They are for the last 3 years of Chris Bosh's contract. Remember how people complained about his contract? Well, ok, Chris has had the blood clots for two seasons, so he's only played 97 games the last two years. He is still averaging 68 per season. Beal, by contrast, played 21 more games over the last two seasons than Chris. So, by syllogism, Beal has played 10 more games per season than our player who has been ruled out for play at the All-Star Break. Let that sink in.

My opinion is that Beal being offered a max sets a bottom line to how far teams will go with their money. Whiteside will get many max offers. Deng will get generous offers too. Adding another year to Deng's contract (as I suggested before) is possibly a way to win him over since (a) he likes playing in Miami (b) appreciates our fans and (c) likes his role and the teammates. He also wants to win.

Thanks GoM the real MVP. That's just insane. And I don't even like Deng 50% of the time

Let's just sign Whiteside and be happy gom

I wouldn't be happy with just signing Whiteside, but if we can sign Whiteside and keep Wade, I would consider the offseason successful.

If we can sign Whiteside and keep Deng and Wade too, it's freaking amazing.

That's right. Status quo = AMAZING.

Keep Joe and add productive shooting for Green's position and a backup center who can help Whiteside (instead of Amar`e and Haslem combo), promote Liggins... I would be a very happy fan. That's what it would take to be happy for me. My expectations are high, but that's Riley's fault. LOL

[IggieCC]

This is unarguably correct. In fact, Deng is perhaps a bargain at that rate.

According to the reports today, Bradley Beal is going to get a 5 year max offer from the Wizards.

http://wizofawes.com/2016/05/27/washington-wizards-bradley-beal-max-contract-offer-report/

He averages 62 games per year. 16 ppg, 3 apg, 3.7 rpg with a PER of 14.3, and ORTG/DRTG of 102/106 p 100 possessions. <- That's negative. MInus 4. Last year he was Minus 5.

How much is his max? The same as Whiteside's:

Spoiler:

$21,564,143 (2016-17)
$23,181,454 (2017-18)
$24,798,764 (2018-19)
$26,416,075 (2019-20)
$28,033,386 (2020-21)

$123,993,821

The Wizards have full bird rights though and are expected to offer a 5 year deal. Those are some crazy numbers, right? Look at these numbers:

$23,741,060 (2016-17)
$25,289,390 (2017-18)
$26,837,720 (2018-19)

They are for the last 3 years of Chris Bosh's contract. Remember how people complained about his contract? Well, ok, Chris has had the blood clots for two seasons, so he's only played 97 games the last two years. He is still averaging 68 per season. Beal, by contrast, played 21 more games over the last two seasons than Chris. So, by syllogism, Beal has played 10 more games per season than our player who has been ruled out for play at the All-Star Break. Let that sink in.

My opinion is that Beal being offered a max sets a bottom line to how far teams will go with their money. Whiteside will get many max offers. Deng will get generous offers too. Adding another year to Deng's contract (as I suggested before) is possibly a way to win him over since (a) he likes playing in Miami (b) appreciates our fans and (c) likes his role and the teammates. He also wants to win.

Thanks GoM the real MVP. That's just insane. And I don't even like Deng 50% of the time

Let's just sign Whiteside and be happy gom

I wouldn't be happy with just signing Whiteside, but if we can sign Whiteside and keep Wade, I would consider the offseason successful.

If we can sign Whiteside and keep Deng and Wade too, it's freaking amazing.

That's right. Status quo = AMAZING.

Keep Joe and add productive shooting for Green's position and a backup center who can help Whiteside (instead of Amar`e and Haslem combo), promote Liggins... I would be a very happy fan. That's what it would take to be happy for me. My expectations are high, but that's Riley's fault. LOL

Oh yeah, I wasn't implying to let Wade go of course. lol I'm under the impression that Pat is gong to take care of Wade, and Whiteside is the No1 priority.

I feel like the core of Dragon, Wade, Whiteside, Winslow, TJ, and JRich is a good mix of young and old. Bosh is huge unknown and will break or make our next season unfortunately... other than that I'm okay with whomever the FO can sigh with the remaining cap.

I guess I'm not too freaking out about the possibilities of not being able to resign the likes of Deng and Jo because I'm half excited about giving more opportunities to Winslow, Jrich and TJ. They are not ready for prime time by any means, but maybe they don't need to be just yet. I am somewhat at peace with what it takes for this team to be a contender again given the circumstances.

[Chalm Down]

No its the reality of the free agency market this offseason. You are asking someone who will get offers to not only get the max 21+ but be a franchise player yet want to offer them 14 mil instead? You will lose Whiteside so fast and thats assuming we havent lost him already. Deng out performed his contract and now will want to get paid. Deng is all about business because he understands that this is a business not a family. Deng will get offers of 15 mil, we offer basically half and its a no brainer he leaves. Wade is Wade and with this coming market and how he showed up in the playoffs will get at least 15 but honestly if Whiteside leaves which is a huge reality Wade will know we will have more than enough to offer him 20+ mil for at least a season. No way he would take 12. Business is business.

Deng outplayed his contract? He just made twenty million in two years as a 4th option at best. His numbers this year were roughly the same as his career averages, so he didn't outperform what was expected from him on the court. He will be 31 this coming season and you want him to get a 50% raise on his previous contract? He signed a 10 million per year contract when he was 24. He made two all star teams at his absolute best and he was making roughly 13 million those two years. Now he's worth more just because the amount of dollars a team can spend went up. He's not an allstar anymore and was very borderline even then. 15 million?

So what's the max we can offer a guy like Whiteside? 20 million a year? I'm suggesting 15 because he's got the productivity of an all star, but the mental game of a below average player. Sure, he's a physical marvel who produces. I like him a lot. Is he a superstar? No. He's not a guy you build around to win a championship. Those guys can get the max. This random idea that every good player should get max is crazy. Lebron and Durant should get max. Those type of players.

Wade will take less if he wants to win or contend for a championship in his 35-38 year old NBA career. Wade has made Miami into what it is, a championship city. He's set for life in the Heat organization. Paying him what would equate to another 40+ million in the years where his body WILL break down and he'll only be playing one side of the floor is a very good deal for him.

Once again, if you want to pay everybody like a superstar then you're not going to win a championship, or even seriously contend. Pay Deng 15, Hassan 20+, Wade 20+, etc., etc. How much money do we have to spend by the way? Me thinks our cup runneth over with all these deals.

If you were GM, would you let Whiteside walk if he wanted max?

[DayofMourning]

If you were GM, would you let Whiteside walk if he wanted max?

I'd take a long, hard look at things if he outright refused to take less than the max based off his 1 and 1/2 years of production. It would depend on a lot of factors. I wouldn't want him to leave and I'd pay Wade what he wanted, so that would mean Deng would be gone and we'd be rolling with a worse lineup than last year. That's not very palatable.

This current squad has a very small window of opportunity, then we'll have to rebuild. Guys would have to be willing to work out their salaries in order to field a contending team. They know it as much as we do. If they're fine earning the most amount of money they can, then I'm not going to fault them for that. Who knows what I'd do if I were them. However, if I'm the GM, I know that iffy max contracts don't earn you rings. Rings get fans. Fans buy merchandise off those rings....for years.

[Flash4thewin]

If you were GM, would you let Whiteside walk if he wanted max?

I'd take a long, hard look at things if he outright refused to take less than the max based off his 1 and 1/2 years of production. It would depend on a lot of factors. I wouldn't want him to leave and I'd pay Wade what he wanted, so that would mean Deng would be gone and we'd be rolling with a worse lineup than last year. That's not very palatable.

This current squad has a very small window of opportunity, then we'll have to rebuild. Guys would have to be willing to work out their salaries in order to field a contending team. They know it as much as we do. If they're fine earning the most amount of money they can, then I'm not going to fault them for that. Who knows what I'd do if I were them. However, if I'm the GM, I know that iffy max contracts don't earn you rings. Rings get fans. Fans buy merchandise off those rings....for years.

Basically you lose Whiteside. There is nothing wrong with the organization that lost Lebron to follow that up with Whiteside leaving. Honestly thats not the best move but sometimes its best to look at this in another perspective. Whitesides max is give or take 4 years and 85+ mil (give or take a few mil) and thats with the cap going up. Roy Hibbert just made 15 mil this season. Next season assuming Durant signs a 1+1 contract Durant will be getting a max starting at around 35 mil a year. What Durant will make in one season is almost half of Whitesides total contract.

If Durant signed a two-year deal with OKC, with an opt-out in 2017, Durant would make $25.9 million next season and would then opt out. Here is the incredible five-year max deal he’d be able to sign with Oklahoma City in July of 2017:

2017-18: $35.8 million
2018-19: $38.5 million
2019-20: $41.4 million
2020-21: $44.5 million
2021-22: $47.9 million

Sum total of $208.1 million over five NBA seasons

I hope this helps put things into perspective with figures and end the idea of players taking paycuts for this business.

[DayofMourning]

Basically you lose Whiteside. There is nothing wrong with the organization that lost Lebron to follow that up with Whiteside leaving. Honestly thats not the best move but sometimes its best to look at this in another perspective. Whitesides max is give or take 4 years and 85+ mil (give or take a few mil) and thats with the cap going up. Roy Hibbert just made 15 mil this season. Next season assuming Durant signs a 1+1 contract Durant will be getting a max starting at around 35 mil a year. What Durant will make in one season is almost half of Whitesides total contract.

If the player can earn a max contract and is looking to earn every single allowable cent he can possibly make under the new cap, then that's his prerogative. I won't fault them for doing that.

A similarly unbalanced player (though he was considered a superstar), Carmelo, chose to take the biggest contract he could get instead of sacrificing like his BFFs did. His BFFs got titles. He got an awesome contract and a chance to go down as a ringless player. If I was in his position, then I wouldn't worry too much. I had a successful career and a nice bank account. However, it may nag him that Bosh has two rings, Lebron has two rings, Wade has three rings. He'll get to hear the media buzzing in his ear that he was a ringless star who wasn't good enough to take his team to the promised land. He will always be considered a cut below. What matters most to the player is key. Having a ridiculous amount of money and rings, or having an even more ridiculous amount of money and no rings? Some guys want the whole fantasy to come true. If they're not complete Antoine Walkers, then they'll be able to take that filthy amount of money they have and invest it and make even more ridiculous amounts of money. There's a limit to how much money you need in order to "feed your family".

[QUIZ]

It's crazy how we've heard that the league is changing and that centers are going extinct and then OKC murders GS's death lineup and all of that is thrown out of the window.

Small ball only works when its beastly offensively, if you aren't scoring a ton of points its weaknesses such as defense and rebounding will be exposed.

Hassan showed flashes of switching on to perimeter ball handlers but he was still clearly uncomfortable. That is the area where we hope he makes strides. The NBA is a PnR heavy league and if he can combine his rim intimidation with the ability to contain dribble penetration he'll win DPOTY.

[Chalm Down]

It's crazy how we've heard that the league is changing and that centers are going extinct and then OKC murders GS's death lineup and all of that is thrown out of the window.

Small ball only works when its beastly offensively, if you aren't scoring a ton of points its weaknesses such as defense and rebounding will be exposed.

Hassan showed flashes of switching on to perimeter ball handlers but he was still clearly uncomfortable. That is the area where we hope he makes strides. The NBA is a PnR heavy league and if he can combine his rim intimidation with the ability to contain dribble penetration he'll win DPOTY.

Tbf the most damage is being caused by OKC's own "small" line-up with Ibaka at center. They're still bigger than GSW since they have two 7-footers at forward, but that line-up doesn't have a traditional center.

[PizzaLord305]

Its funny how reactionary we can be when its time to sign a guy. People were saying Dragic should have gotten over 100 million on his contract. Now they're saying he's overpaid.

hahaha yeah he's getting paid less than enes kanter and tristan thompson , but people think hes overpaid. I think he's going to play above his contract the next few years. seems like hes found a comfort zone with the team and played like a borderline all star after the all star break.

No. We think that Kanter and Thompson are overpaid too.

Where does this borderline all-star come from. There were at least 10 pgs as good as him after the break.

There are like almost ten borderline all star/all star level pg's point guards lol, the position is as deep as they say. conley, lowry, dragic after the break, wall, irving, curry, Isaiah, chris paul, reggie jackson, dame lillard and kemba walker.

I would take dragic over thomas, maybe kemba, and reggie jackson at this point. this team took it to another level when he started playing comfortably,they shouldve beat toronto, and were lucky to have him for what hes getting paid.

[PizzaLord305]

Deng will easily get an offer around 14~16M range from other teams...yes that's the crazy side of the salary cap raising

This is unarguably correct. In fact, Deng is perhaps a bargain at that rate.

According to the reports today, Bradley Beal is going to get a 5 year max offer from the Wizards.

http://wizofawes.com/2016/05/27/washington-wizards-bradley-beal-max-contract-offer-report/

He averages 62 games per year. 16 ppg, 3 apg, 3.7 rpg with a PER of 14.3, and ORTG/DRTG of 102/106 p 100 possessions. <- That's negative. MInus 4. Last year he was Minus 5.

How much is his max? The same as Whiteside's:

$21,564,143 (2016-17)
$23,181,454 (2017-18)
$24,798,764 (2018-19)
$26,416,075 (2019-20)
$28,033,386 (2020-21)

$123,993,821

The Wizards have full bird rights though and are expected to offer a 5 year deal. Those are some crazy numbers, right? Look at these numbers:

$23,741,060 (2016-17)
$25,289,390 (2017-18)
$26,837,720 (2018-19)

They are for the last 3 years of Chris Bosh's contract. Remember how people complained about his contract? Well, ok, Chris has had the blood clots for two seasons, so he's only played 97 games the last two years. He is still averaging 68 per season. Beal, by contrast, played 21 more games over the last two seasons than Chris. So, by syllogism, Beal has played 10 more games per season than our player who has been ruled out for play at the All-Star Break. Let that sink in.

My opinion is that Beal being offered a max sets a bottom line to how far teams will go with their money. Whiteside will get many max offers. Deng will get generous offers too. Adding another year to Deng's contract (as I suggested before) is possibly a way to win him over since (a) he likes playing in Miami (b) appreciates our fans and (c) likes his role and the teammates. He also wants to win.

i think dengs post all star break run as a stretch 4 revived his appeal a great deal, and i can see him getting like 12-13 a year for sure from someone. good starters are probably going to cost at least that much going forward. good starters with position versatility are probably gonna cost more than that tbh.

[HIF]

Can't believe that people are entertaining NOT offering Hassan the max.

[krikor]

Can't believe that people are entertaining NOT offering Hassan the max.

Because whiteside earning max ala durant, curry, lebron, westbrook etc.. is not right and he doesnt belong in same sentence with those.

If you give max to whiteside, whats left to build the other parts of the team? need to keep wade, deng, joe jhonson..
and add something as well.

[KingDavid]

Can't believe that people are entertaining NOT offering Hassan the max.

Because whiteside earning max ala durant, curry, lebron, westbrook etc.. is not right and he doesnt belong in same sentence with those.

If you give max to whiteside, whats left to build the other parts of the team? need to keep wade, deng, joe jhonson..
and add something as well.

Whiteside's max is not their max. He's at a much lower percentage. The players you mentioned have more years in the league than hassan.

That's the cost of free agency. If we don't offer Hassan his max, other teams will. You can sign Hassan and trade him later for some assets if you want. But you don't let him walk for nothing.

[Bishop45]

Can't believe that people are entertaining NOT offering Hassan the max.

Because whiteside earning max ala durant, curry, lebron, westbrook etc.. is not right and he doesnt belong in same sentence with those.

If you give max to whiteside, whats left to build the other parts of the team? need to keep wade, deng, joe jhonson..
and add something as well.

Whiteside's max is not their max. He's at a much lower percentage. The players you mentioned have more years in the league than hassan.

That's the cost of free agency. If we don't offer Hassan his max, other teams will. You can sign Hassan and trade him later for some assets if you want. But you don't let him walk for nothing.

I was going to say, but too annoyed of the "max" narrative to respond.

Same stuff will be perpetuated tomorrow tho

[Burnie Riley]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/736424712906133504[/tweet]
Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

Per 36: 9 pts, 13 reb, 2.6 blk

Spoiler:

9 pts

[KingDavid]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/736424712906133504[/tweet]
Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

Per 36: 9 pts, 13 reb, 2.6 blk

Spoiler:

9 pts

Holy hell...if that's the precedent, everyone is getting crazy money this offseason.

[Heat_Fan_87]

which is why hassan at 22mil is not that bad.

[Flashpoint]

It's fascinating how differently some of our fanbase views Whiteside. This is going to be an offseason of ludicrous signings. Players far less valuable than Hassan are going to get the max or close to it. Of course you re-sign him to what it's going to take to keep him.

[Flash4thewin]

But we knew everyone was going to get crazy deals? Thats why hearing people say sign him to as discount or the organization should try to talk him down from signing from the max is literally (Please Use More Appropriate Word). What Durant is going to make next year assuming the 1+1 contract is 35+ mil in his first year is almost half of Whitesides entire contract. So hearing people talk about "well we have less taxes so Whiteside should sign for less" is (Please Use More Appropriate Word) lol