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Hammond Comments: Boston Model?

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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#76 » by CanadaBucks » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:53 pm

The only bad move Presti made was the Allen trade imo. I just don't agree when people say there was no luck involved and that this is a model that is easily followed. You're relying on ping-pong ball drops, not drafting total busts, and multiple other factors that may interfere with "The OKC Model". h/t to Presti for a job well done but with bad luck it could have been a draft pool like 2006 or they get Oden instead of Durant in 07. Chicago trades LMA for Tyrus Thomas and then turns a 1.7% chance at the #1 pick into Rose. Yes they put themselves in that position but if they keep Aldridge do they still get Rose? What if the 8th team that year picked 1st? Joe Alexander for Derrick Rose is a very nice trade imo. Just saying there's luck involved here.
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#77 » by Badgerlander » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:57 pm

Westbrook wasn't a "no-brainer" pick
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#78 » by LUKE23 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:07 pm

GoS wrote:

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The "only place a case can be made" is where he drafted three stars and another guy who will possibly see some all-star games in his career. Ok. And Green for Perkins is lateral? Green added nothing of value, while Perkins is a really good defender. Westbrook/Harden/Durant/Ibaka/Perkins/Sefolosha are guys that would be in the top 8 of any rotation in the league, and Presti acquired all of them. You're making yourself look like a fool.

dont forget all the trades he made....... a recipe of trading current nba talent for non current nba talent with virtually no exception. skill or bad management? luck or unbelievable foresight? its a difficult evaluation. he has acquired some great talent, but there is also strong evidence that perhaps with all the moves hes made that he doesnt have the first fcking clue how this all fell into his lap.


:rofl: :rofl:
Trade Impact:

Before: 30-23, 104.4 O, 102.2 D, 93.9 Pace, 1.42 SRS, .547 TS, .154 TOV
Now: 36-36, 102.8 O, 102.4 D, 93.8 Pace, -.16 SRS, .537 TS, .156 TOV
MCW Per 36 w/MIL: 15.9 PTS, 4.2 REB, 6.5 AST, 2.2 STL, 3.9 TO, .482 TS, .257 USG, .188 TOV
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#79 » by El Duderino » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:09 pm

DocHoliday wrote:Westbrook wasn't a "no-brainer" pick


Neither was Harden at the third pick. He was projected to go between the the 3rd and 6th
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#80 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:18 pm

maybe i shouldnt have said harden and westbrook were no brainers..... thats maybe not fair. durant was the one no brainer.

a better description would be that he picked players projected to go in the range they got picked. that was his shining moment..... he didnt blow it by reaching for guys further down the board.
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#81 » by JimmyTheKid » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:20 pm

DocHoliday wrote:Westbrook wasn't a "no-brainer" pick


Neither was Harden
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#82 » by LUKE23 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:21 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:maybe i shouldnt have said harden and westbrook were no brainers..... thats maybe not fair. durant was the one no brainer.

a better description would be that he picked players projected to go in the range they got picked. that was his shining moment..... he didnt blow it by reaching for guys further down the board.


And by sticking to a long-term plan, and scouting well, and not adding any bad contracts, and amassing young assets/picks to make future moves.

The Bucks method has worked out much better for sure.
Trade Impact:

Before: 30-23, 104.4 O, 102.2 D, 93.9 Pace, 1.42 SRS, .547 TS, .154 TOV
Now: 36-36, 102.8 O, 102.4 D, 93.8 Pace, -.16 SRS, .537 TS, .156 TOV
MCW Per 36 w/MIL: 15.9 PTS, 4.2 REB, 6.5 AST, 2.2 STL, 3.9 TO, .482 TS, .257 USG, .188 TOV
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#83 » by Sigra » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:21 pm

JimmyTheKid wrote:
LUKE23 wrote:Besides drafting Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Ibaka, trading Green for Perkins, and trading a mid 20's 1st for an elite wing defender in Sefolosha, and amassing multiple 1sts wherever possible, I agree, Presti has done very little of significant impact.


:lol:

Durant was the ONLY no-brainer on that list.


Durant was no-brainer as you say. Westbrook was mistake IMO (Love was aviable).

Harden and Ibaka were great picks indeed.

Trading for Perkins mistake. Trading Harden mistake. Coach choise mistake. Everything else mistake.

Harden and Ibaka picks made them look inteligent. Everyting else blah.
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#84 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:28 pm

LUKE23 wrote:
And Green for Perkins is lateral? Green added nothing of value, while Perkins is a really good defender. Westbrook/Harden/Durant/Ibaka/Perkins/Sefolosha are guys that would be in the top 8 of any rotation in the league, and Presti acquired all of them


i know perkins and sefolosha play good defense. :roll:

he gave up the return on prime ray allen, and the pick that became taj gibson to get them. go ahead and give the guy an award for his amazing moves to fill out the roster if you want to. i know presti is a god to you. lets just move on.
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#85 » by LUKE23 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:31 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:he gave the return on ray allen, and the pick that became taj gibson to get them. go ahead and give the guy an award for his amazing lateral moves to fill out the roster if you want to. i know presti is a god to you. lets just move on.


I'm not the one saying crazy things here. Lets remember that you are a person that has lauded the work Hammond has done to ridiculous levels, even though we're well under .500 under his watch, and are now taking all the work Presti has done and basically boiling it all down to luck. I'm fine moving on, just stop saying ridiculous ****.
Trade Impact:

Before: 30-23, 104.4 O, 102.2 D, 93.9 Pace, 1.42 SRS, .547 TS, .154 TOV
Now: 36-36, 102.8 O, 102.4 D, 93.8 Pace, -.16 SRS, .537 TS, .156 TOV
MCW Per 36 w/MIL: 15.9 PTS, 4.2 REB, 6.5 AST, 2.2 STL, 3.9 TO, .482 TS, .257 USG, .188 TOV
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#86 » by 4xBuck » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:32 pm

LUKE23 wrote:Besides drafting Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Ibaka, trading Green for Perkins, and trading a mid 20's 1st for an elite wing defender in Sefolosha, and amassing multiple 1sts wherever possible, I agree, Presti has done very little of significant impact.


No doubt OKC has done it the right way, also liking how Cleveland is doing it now.

But, OKC also got lucky, which is OK… If OKC gets Beasley rather than Durant, they’re no better than Denver & Utah- two other teams doing it right but not lucky enough to land a franchise player.
paulpressey25 wrote:Sessions and Adrien are win now players
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#87 » by Kerb Hohl » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:33 pm

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GrendonJennings wrote:2011-2012: 32-34
2012-2013: 42-40
2013-2014: 39-43
2014-2015: 44-38
2015-2016: 35-47
2016-2017: 40-42
2017-2018: (Las Vegas)
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#88 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:34 pm

LUKE23 wrote:

The Bucks method has worked out much better for sure.


i know. we tanked the wrong years and didnt trade guys like redd and bogut for nothing in order to suck and tank in even more years :x
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#89 » by 4xBuck » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:38 pm

E-Buck wrote:Hammond is an idiot if he doesn't realize that he just lacks an eye for talent. A prime example was taking Henson instead of J.Lamb. Like why?


You’re power whining is gonna fit right in around here. All the cool chicks love to turn every thread into a bitch fest.

Well done!
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#90 » by LUKE23 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:43 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:
i know. we tanked the wrong years and didnt trade guys like redd and bogut for nothing in order to suck and tank in even more years :x


And signed Gooden. And signed Salmons. And traded for Maggette. And traded for Jax while moving down in the draft 12 spots. And refused to clear Redd and RJ for full salary relief. And wasted assets we weren't going to keep anyway (Sessions) even when we could have gotten good assets back.

I will give Hammond some credit, overall he's drafted well with respect to draft position. Overall his FA work has been pretty bad. His trades for the most part have been either lateral or have hurt us (Jax, Maggette). But hey, it's just all bad luck anyway, right?
Trade Impact:

Before: 30-23, 104.4 O, 102.2 D, 93.9 Pace, 1.42 SRS, .547 TS, .154 TOV
Now: 36-36, 102.8 O, 102.4 D, 93.8 Pace, -.16 SRS, .537 TS, .156 TOV
MCW Per 36 w/MIL: 15.9 PTS, 4.2 REB, 6.5 AST, 2.2 STL, 3.9 TO, .482 TS, .257 USG, .188 TOV
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#91 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:44 pm

LUKE23 wrote:
GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:he gave the return on ray allen, and the pick that became taj gibson to get them. go ahead and give the guy an award for his amazing lateral moves to fill out the roster if you want to. i know presti is a god to you. lets just move on.


I'm not the one saying crazy things here. Lets remember that you are a person that has lauded the work Hammond has done to ridiculous levels, even though we're well under .500 under his watch, and are now taking all the work Presti has done and basically boiling it all down to luck. I'm fine moving on, just stop saying ridiculous ****.


i was going to move on until you called what i say ridiculous sht. thats low man!

see you in the game thread. we win this then 5-2 and hammond for prez :wink:
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#92 » by randy84 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:46 pm

I think the big point that people are missing on this is that two different approaches were taken by the Thunder and the Celtics at the same time.

Thunder decided to blow it up and built through draft, Celtics decided to built a team by trading for veterans.
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#93 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:47 pm

joking about hammond btw... i like him alright but when i see him monday night im gonna lay into him a bit if i get the chance.
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#94 » by GHOSTofSIKMA » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:49 pm

randy84 wrote:I think the big point that people are missing on this is that two different approaches were taken by the Thunder and the Celtics at the same time.

Thunder decided to blow it up and built through draft, Celtics decided to built a team by trading for veterans.


thats been our biggest mistake. weve not tanked, and weve gone for 2nd rate vets by not offering players AND picks. weve been straddling the fence.
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Re: Hammond Comments: Boston Model? 

Post#95 » by Badgerlander » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:53 pm

GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:thats been our biggest mistake. weve not tanked, and weve gone for 2nd rate vets by not offering players AND picks. weve been straddling the fence.


You mean like giving the Bobcats the 7th pick in the draft AND Maggette for Jax and the 19th pick?

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