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View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline goal.

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Post#16 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:49 pm by CanadaBucks

DWagner85 wrote:
jakecronus8 wrote:Oh yeah, IBTL


What is IBTL?

And why does Ellis need to be dumped, so to you it is not acceptable for players to go through phases of bad play? Well then we may as well just let the Bucks leave because every player that has gone through that door has had times when they did not play well.

IBTL=In before the lock as in this thread will get locked but I got my post in before that.

Part of the monta hate/dislike is who was on the other end of the deal too, but a lot has been his play this year.

This is a good board just a little too much noise sometimes(imo)
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Post#17 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:49 pm by trwi7

EastSideBucksFan wrote:
DWagner85 wrote:Was told this was a solid forum site, good discussions, guess I was mistaken.



We have guys who like to be jerks to outsiders. Don't let them sway you.

Bucks have the best board on RealGM.


It's true. I don't like change.
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Post#18 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:50 pm by MCH1

DWagner85 wrote:Was told this was a solid forum site, good discussions, guess I was mistaken.


Go to BrewHoop, where the fans are much more civil.

Check with RealGM for news from time to time, somebody always posts the news they've found on twitter or some other random site.
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Post#19 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:50 pm by Max Green

DWagner85 wrote:Honestly, I am a big fan of Monta Ellis. I cannot seem to understand the hatred that goes toward him.

He is a great scorer, who can finish at the rim. I agree he tends to chuck a little to often, but this is an easy fix, and something chemistry will even out.


Some guys go over the top with their hatred of him but he's been pretty bad as a scorer since he joined our team. Percentage wise he's been a worst scorer the RJ, Maggette and Post contact Salmons but averages more shots then all of them. If it was an easy fix to fixing his bad shot attempts it would've been done by now. That being said he does bring other things to the table like great passing for a shooting guard and his defen.se hasn't been t
Hat bad not counting the Bulls games and Jimmer scoring on him last night. Unless he's willing to embrace the Crawford/ Louis Williams role as the 6th man instant offense off the bench , it's time for him to go.
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Post#20 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:56 pm by EastSideBucksFan

CanadaBucks wrote:
DWagner85 wrote:
jakecronus8 wrote:Oh yeah, IBTL


What is IBTL?

And why does Ellis need to be dumped, so to you it is not acceptable for players to go through phases of bad play? Well then we may as well just let the Bucks leave because every player that has gone through that door has had times when they did not play well.

IBTL=In before the lock as in this thread will get locked but I got my post in before that.

Part of the monta hate/dislike is who was on the other end of the deal too, but a lot has been his play this year.

This is a good board just a little too much noise sometimes(imo)



What's the point of IBTL?

I view it as the same as guys who post FIRST!

Makes no sense to me
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Post#21 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:57 pm by DWagner85

Two things,

1) why would this post get locked?

2) If everyone is in consensus that Ellis must go, what do you want in return for him?
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Post#22 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:00 pm by raferfenix

DWagner85 wrote: If everyone is in consensus that Ellis must go, what do you want in return for him?


I think the consensus is that we need a steadier starting SG. Someone even just solid, who plays good D and can shoot the 3.

In terms of what we could get for him, some sort of package deal for Pau Gasol is the dream trade given Herb Kohl's demand that we win now.

It doesn't solve our SG issues, but gives us a lot more options.
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Post#23 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:02 pm by coolhandluke121

I'd like to see what Ellis could do as a starting pg with good shooters surrounding him. I really, really don't want to see the Bucks pay Jennings this summer, so that's a factor too. I don't know who the long-term pg would be, but my preference for making this team better right now and making something out of this team's potential would be to trade Jennings + sweetener for a guy like Eric Gordon or maybe Jennings/Gooden for Afflalo + sweetener.
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Post#24 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:03 pm by CanadaBucks

DWagner85 wrote:Two things,

1) why would this post get locked?

2) If everyone is in consensus that Ellis must go, what do you want in return for him?



The reason it would get locked is that there is a thread about possible trades for Monta already. Some on the board say they would trade Monta for anything although I suspect that's a bit of hyperbole.

What's the point of IBTL?

I view it as the same as guys who post FIRST!

Makes no sense to me


Good question
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Post#25 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:05 pm by DWagner85

CanadaBucks wrote:
DWagner85 wrote:Two things,

1) why would this post get locked?

2) If everyone is in consensus that Ellis must go, what do you want in return for him?



The reason it would get locked is that there is a thread about possible trades for Monta already. Some on the board say they would trade Monta for anything although I suspect that's a bit of hyperbole.

What's the point of IBTL?

I view it as the same as guys who post FIRST!

Makes no sense to me


Good question


If you read my topic Heading, my post is a VIEW on Monta Ellis, and then................ The teams trade deadline goal in your eyes. Some of you hate Monta Ellis so much you fail to read the second part of the heading because you just want to get your hate on.
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Post#26 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:09 pm by humanrefutation

trwi7 wrote:Nice of you to join the board, Dajuan Wagner. I can understand why you would be a fan of Monta Ellis.


Dammit I was gonna post that the moment I saw the OP.
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Post#27 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:09 pm by LUKE23

There is no way I'd want Ellis starting at PG. His handle is too weak and I want my PG to be able to shoot the 3. He'd average 5 TO per game easy as a PG IMO getting the minutes he normally does. He'd have to go against quicker defenders every night.
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Post#28 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:10 pm by EastSideBucksFan

People keep saying they want a "solid SG who can play decent D and shoot the 3"....well...we had that guy...his name was Carlos Delfino....and before him...we had Charlie Bell.....Monta is infinitely more talented than any SG we've had since Ray Allen.....if we can just get others on the team going, Monta wont' shoot as much and our offensive efficiency will rise....it's all about using him correctly and getting other guys on the team in a rhythm.

I don't hate Monta at all, I just want him to cut down on the long 2's.

His defense isn't that much of a problem with Moute back now and our bigs blocking shots the way they are.
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Post#29 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:14 pm by raferfenix

EastSideBucksFan wrote:People keep saying they want a "solid SG who can play decent D and shoot the 3"....well...we had that guy...his name was Carlos Delfino....and before him...we had Charlie Bell.....Monta is infinitely more talented than any SG we've had since Ray Allen.....if we can just get others on the team going, Monta wont' shoot as much and our offensive efficiency will rise....it's all about using him correctly and getting other guys on the team in a rhythm.

I don't hate Monta at all, I just want him to cut down on the long 2's.

His defense isn't that much of a problem with Moute back now and our bigs blocking shots the way they are.


Delfino and Bell both had good runs here, but then their games fell below solid.

Marquis Daniels is having a similar effect now, but not sure how he qualifies in this department either.

The key is what kind of player we need next to Jennings. Ellis is more talented than all these guys, but if he doens't play smarter, he won't supercede the kind of solid role player we need next to our highly erratic PG.
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Post#30 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:14 pm by averageposter

Ellis probably gets more hate than he deserves, he is what he is. On the one hand you can see really good passing instincts and feel for his team mates, the kind that great point guards have, but immediately following that 3 consecutive possessions with deep 2's don't go in. You are then left wondering why he just can't limit the jumpers to the keeping the defense honest variety and play that drive and dish game he is so so good at. But that's just it, he been in the league long enough and had coaches come and go that had to come to that same realization and he hasn't reigned himself in. Things don't have to change much it seems so easy, but its fools gold.

Still I can accept him as is, if he weren't paired with another guy who has shot selection issues. Jennings doesn't finish like Ellis and is probably less likely to draw a foul and hasn't shown me as much in pure pg play. You see flashes of a drive and dish game but then its gone for games on end without even a hint that it was there. I personally don't get it at this stage in his career. Perhaps I need to accept that its not changing. Jennings is a passable 3pt shooter bringing his numbers up, but for his volume there are still lots or bad choices.

The team needs to then make some big decisions about these two, assuming they have a feel for what Montas plans are they need to make a choice and more forward with one of these guys or none but not both. Which is sort of a bummer since you would want a stable management team in place to plan around the decision and since Hammond and Skiles have a year remaining as well obviously that's not happening. I really thought I would choose Jennings but I need to see some real consistency develop in the PG department if its going to be him. Monta needs to be the point if its going to be him, something he has never bought into throughout his career as a full time gig.
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Post#31 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:14 pm by GHOSTofSIKMA

EastSideBucksFan wrote:People keep saying they want a "solid SG who can play decent D and shoot the 3"....well...we had that guy...his name was Carlos Delfino....and before him...we had Charlie Bell.....Monta is infinitely more talented than any SG we've had since Ray Allen.....if we can just get others on the team going, Monta wont' shoot as much and our offensive efficiency will rise....it's all about using him correctly and getting other guys on the team in a rhythm.

I don't hate Monta at all, I just want him to cut down on the long 2's.

His defense isn't that much of a problem with Moute back now and our bigs blocking shots the way they are.


this post sums up my thoughts regarding monta too. monta is at his worst when he feels like he has to be the man. hes does pretty damn good when hes just fitting in.
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Post#32 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:15 pm by CanadaBucks

DWagner85 wrote:
CanadaBucks wrote:
DWagner85 wrote:Two things,

1) why would this post get locked?

2) If everyone is in consensus that Ellis must go, what do you want in return for him?



The reason it would get locked is that there is a thread about possible trades for Monta already. Some on the board say they would trade Monta for anything although I suspect that's a bit of hyperbole.

What's the point of IBTL?

I view it as the same as guys who post FIRST!

Makes no sense to me


Good question


If you read my topic Heading, my post is a VIEW on Monta Ellis, and then................ The teams trade deadline goal in your eyes. Some of you hate Monta Ellis so much you fail to read the second part of the heading because you just want to get your hate on.


Hey, I am not arguing with you, while I think BJ and Monta do not co-exist really well I am not in the camp that would trade Ellis for any offer. I we're winning I am fine with it.
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Post#33 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:17 pm by Max Green

DWagner85 wrote:Two things,

1) why would this post get locked?

2) If everyone is in consensus that Ellis must go, what do you want in return for him?


Gasol & Meeks is at the top of my list, I wouldn't mind guys like Afflalo etc... Another guy I would take that the majority probably disagrees with is Al Jefferson.
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Post#34 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:19 pm by AussieBuck

DWagner85 wrote:Honestly, I am a big fan of Monta Ellis. I cannot seem to understand the hatred that goes toward him.

He is a great scorer

Here's why you're confused, Monta isn't anything close to a great scorer. If he was a great scorer it would be odd that people hate him. He's an idiot who talks 10.5 jump shots a game and makes about 30% of them.
aol4532 wrote:what exactly is the difference between him (Bill Russell), and say a guy like Ryan Hollins, who is 20 lbs heavier and can get his head over the rim? He would get in foul trouble so quick, just trying to hold position.
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Post#35 Re: View on Monta Ellis, and trade deadline g
Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:23 pm by DWagner85

EastSideBucksFan wrote:People keep saying they want a "solid SG who can play decent D and shoot the 3"....well...we had that guy...his name was Carlos Delfino....and before him...we had Charlie Bell.....Monta is infinitely more talented than any SG we've had since Ray Allen.....if we can just get others on the team going, Monta wont' shoot as much and our offensive efficiency will rise....it's all about using him correctly and getting other guys on the team in a rhythm.

I don't hate Monta at all, I just want him to cut down on the long 2's.

His defense isn't that much of a problem with Moute back now and our bigs blocking shots the way they are.


That is my exact stance with Monta, he shoots because he has too, when others are rolling, he is almost too generous of a passer, giving up the rock when he himself has an open lane to the hoop. As I stated earlier I think the issue is chemistry and the fact this team is 3-15 heavy with guys that are 5th-7th men on a team. Trade some of the depth for upgrades, such as Post Scoring, or possibly a pure defensive minded backup SG for when we face the Nets of the world that will exploit Monta's height.
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