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I was factoring in the Milwaukee premium on those deals. 4/40 for Milsap and 4/32 for Mayo

Teams with cap space go for bigger fish in FA like Dwight, Paul, etc. The good teams only have the MLE or mini MLE come next summer.

Houston could sign both but I don't see Morey spending that type of dough for either.

I just don't see FA being a viable option for the Bucks. I'd rather have Milsap and Mayo over Gay too but odds are the Bucks won't get an opportunity to make that choice. It'll likely be Gay or middling-type vets or Gay or nothing. Free agency has never been a strong option for the Bucks and it's not like Kohl has been shy about overpaying for players. I don't see Milwaukee suddenly becoming a viable FA destination anytime soon.

paulpressey25 wrote:For the price of Gay at 18 million a year we can sign Milsap at 10 million and Mayo at 8 million a year.

Not that those are franchise changing ideas, but a team like ours can't commit long term to guys making 18-20 million a year who haven't made a few all star teams at some point in their career.

Can we though? By that same logic we can just amnesty gooden and sign Dwight Howard, Josh Smith or CP3.

europa wrote:I just don't see FA being a viable option for the Bucks. I'd rather have Milsap and Mayo over Gay too but odds are the Bucks won't get an opportunity to make that choice. It'll likely be Gay or middling-type vets or Gay or nothing. Free agency has never been a strong option for the Bucks and it's not like Kohl has been shy about overpaying for players. I don't see Milwaukee suddenly becoming a viable FA destination anytime soon.

So in your opinion the options are

A. A slim chance at free agents
B. Nothing, cheap free agents and mostly rolling with what we have
C. Middle tier free agents like Redick, Jack, Landry
D. Gay

And your favorite option of the bunch is Gay? I can honestly say out of those options he's easily the last one IMO. A move like that that is the definition of .500 ball for atleast 2 more years.

I think our best bet is to emulate the Rockets. Assemble as many trade assets at various levels of salary as you can, and try to get involved in every single trade for a star that you can.

It gives you 3 ways to succeed - either you manage to put together some magical combination of guys like the Pistons and you can contend for years without ever bottoming out talent wise so that you don't end up like cleveland with a star but nobody around them and still horrible, or one of your draft picks overperforms and turns into a star, or you package your assets together for a star.

paulpressey25 wrote:I was factoring in the Milwaukee premium on those deals. 4/40 for Milsap and 4/32 for Mayo

Teams with cap space go for bigger fish in FA like Dwight, Paul, etc. The good teams only have the MLE or mini MLE come next summer.

Houston could sign both but I don't see Morey spending that type of dough for either.

Both Paul and Dwight will end up on the same team - So there will be other team like ATL, CLE, HOU, IND, NOH and Sac that could offer those two that have more then the MLE.

I'm not even sure many middling-type FAs are going to want to play for the Bucks. Like I said, just last summer Hinrich and Meeks both turned down superior offers from the Bucks to play elsewhere. I really don't see free agency being a way to land impact players. Maybe you get a Mike Dunleavy type again which was a great signing but more often it'll probably be guys like Marquis Daniels. I think the value of cap space is lost on a team like the Bucks as it pertains to trying to sign quality players. I have no problem with those who don't want to take on Gay's contract. I don't like it either. I simply disagree that you could realistically use the same money you'd pay for Gay and get players like Milsap or Mayo or guys like that. I don't see many players like that wanting to come to Milwaukee.

Baddy Chuck wrote:

europa wrote:I just don't see FA being a viable option for the Bucks. I'd rather have Milsap and Mayo over Gay too but odds are the Bucks won't get an opportunity to make that choice. It'll likely be Gay or middling-type vets or Gay or nothing. Free agency has never been a strong option for the Bucks and it's not like Kohl has been shy about overpaying for players. I don't see Milwaukee suddenly becoming a viable FA destination anytime soon.

So in your opinion the options are

A. A slim chance at free agents
B. Nothing, cheap free agents and mostly rolling with what we have
C. Middle tier free agents like Redick, Jack, Landry
D. Gay

And your favorite option of the bunch is Gay? I can honestly say out of those options he's easily the last one IMO. A move like that that is the definition of .500 ball for atleast 2 more years.

If you make them take Gooden, You have to look at it as we are paying 11 Mil for Gay next year

Let look at the Salaries guaranteed next year if we would do this trade

???/Wroten
???/lamb
Gay/Luc/Harris
Ilyasova/Henson
Sanders/Udoh

Would be 43.3 Mil with roughly 15 mil to spend

europa wrote:Giving them another bad contract long-term isn't likely going to get a deal done.

But that's where financially you have to walk away then. We can debate whether the salary cap debacle the Bucks were in four years ago (having to dump assets to get cap space to sign draft picks and match a Ramon offer sheet) was a result of Redd's salary, RJ's salary or Gadzuric's salary. But they all played a part. If we don't have Gadzuric then we aren't panicked like we were that season. That $6.5mm he was due made a big difference.

Same would hold true with Gooden. Dump him out in any Gay deal and the financial impact on your front office one and two off-seasons from now is significantly lessened.

paulpressey25 wrote:

europa wrote:Giving them another bad contract long-term isn't likely going to get a deal done.

But that's where financially you have to walk away then. We can debate whether the salary cap debacle the Bucks were in four years ago (having to dump assets to get cap space to sign draft picks and match a Ramon offer sheet) was a result of Redd's salary, RJ's salary or Gadzuric's salary. But they all played a part. If we don't have Gadzuric then we aren't panicked like we were that season. That $6.5mm he was due made a big difference.

Same would hold true with Gooden. Dump him out in any Gay deal and the financial impact on your front office one and two off-seasons from now is significantly lessened.

Without question. I'd obviously love to dump Ellis and Gooden in the same deal but it's not a dealbreaker for me here. If the Grizzlies want Ellis, I would do everything in my power to get this deal done. That's all the incentive I need. I want him gone and if the Bucks get a better player in return who addresses an enormous team need in the process that's outstanding even if he carries a less-than-palatable contract. They don't need to take Gooden for me to get this trade done. I'm not sure the Bucks could get anything better for Ellis. I don't see a lot of teams clamoring to get him, at least not ones willing to give up anything of relative value.

I think Philly makes sense for Rudy Gay

Phoenix and Memphis are talking.

DrugBust wrote:Phoenix and Memphis are talking.

Grizzlies reportedly want a package involving Dudley and a future first.

Phoenix would make a move like that. Man they are horribly run.

Ugh....nooooooo, this would be such a standard Bucks move, straight out of the playbook.

I have to admire Memphis. They're 22-10 and yet are completely realistic about their chances of contending.

DrugBust wrote:I have to admire Memphis. They're 22-10 and yet are completely realistic about their chances of contending.

This seems to be primarily about avoiding the luxury tax. I think they'd prefer to keep Gay if possible.

As the Wiretap suggest above, the Suns and Grizzles have been discussing a Gay for Dudley trade. I wish we could get into this

Bucks get: Dudley
Grizzles get: Ellis/Beasley
Suns get: Gay

So I think we can put this one to bed. No way the Bucks should be making a move like this without Skiles as coach.