Potential Jennings trade thread (POLL ADDED)

[whatthe_buck!?]

We often agree on other things but you guys have seriously gone off the rails on this

Yeah, what the h*ll man!? I agree with most of what u say as well baddy, but Vasquez > Jennings?!?!? U don't really believe that do u???

At the very least the Hornets aren't going to give up anything of much value when they have a player who isn't much worse then Jennings. But yeah, I think I'd take Vasquez over Jennings. Now if you told me in a few years Vasquez was getting $10+ million as well I would cut ties with him too. I don't think Jennings is going to improve. I think he's an inefficient 18 points without any qualities that make a point guard, Vasquez looks to have made the jump to a guy I would love to watch running the offense.

Vasquez at 7-8 Mil a season is twice as bad and immovable of a contract as Jennings at 10 mil per. And if we traded or signed Vasquez and he continued to put up the stats he's putting up this that's what we'd have to pay him, sooner rather than later. I would be so pissed if we traded Jennings for a Vasquez or a Calderon type point guard. And Vasquez isn't young either, he's 26...

[Baddy Chuck]

Calderon is the right comparison for Vasquez.

But unless he improves, is Jennings more then Nick Van Exel? I think you could make an argument either way who you want of Jose Calderon or Nick Van Exel. We have a ton of good big men who really aren't scoring unless it's created for them. I think a guy like that creating for them would be a lot more enjoyable to watch then Jennings shooting 40%.

[Bad Midget]

None of the players discussed in this 31 page monstrosity are superstars. Brandon is what he is, an above average PG who's as erratic as any player in the league. If we don't overpay, I'm fine. If we do, then it's obviously not good. End of story.

[paulpressey25]

There's a 20% difference between $8 and $10 million. So let's stop saying between $8-$10 like they're one and the same. There have been people in this thread that have said they'd be fine with him at $8 million, but would balk at $10.

Does it matter all that much? In some sense it certainly does but at the same time if you don't trade him, you've got to be ready to match a 4/$44 type deal at a minimum. So in a sense while I started my hypothetical at $8.5mm, you've got to be ready to pay $11 million a year if you don't trade him at the deadline.

It doesn't mean he gets an offer sheet like that. But it isn't out of the realm of possibility. Many years there is always one desperate team with tons of cap space to blow to meet min payroll or a guy like Cuban who loses out on everything else out there.

[cellomac1212]

Calderon is the right comparison for Vasquez.

But unless he improves, is Jennings more then Nick Van Exel? I think you could make an argument either way who you want of Jose Calderon or Nick Van Exel. We have a ton of good big men who really aren't scoring unless it's created for them. I think a guy like that creating for them would be a lot more enjoyable to watch then Jennings shooting 40%.

There is only so much creating you can do... Your bigs are never going to be scorers short of maybe Henson... Larry has some moves, but will max out at about 12ppg... I actually think both Monta and Jennings have been doing a good job spreading the ball as they aren't really getting assists off of each other, illy has been on and off, and dunleavy is the only guy on the team who is money when he's open...

[ReasonablySober]

We often agree on other things but you guys have seriously gone off the rails on this

Yeah, what the h*ll man!? I agree with most of what u say as well baddy, but Vasquez > Jennings?!?!? U don't really believe that do u???

At the very least the Hornets aren't going to give up anything of much value when they have a player who isn't much worse then Jennings. But yeah, I think I'd take Vasquez over Jennings. Now if you told me in a few years Vasquez was getting $10+ million as well I would cut ties with him too. I don't think Jennings is going to improve. I think he's an inefficient 18 points without any qualities that make a point guard, Vasquez looks to have made the jump to a guy I would love to watch running the offense.

Hey, I love watching him on offense too. Unfortunately he's a lot worse on defense than he is good on offense.

[whatthe_buck!?]

Calderon is the right comparison for Vasquez.

But unless he improves, is Jennings more then Nick Van Exel? I think you could make an argument either way who you want of Jose Calderon or Nick Van Exel. We have a ton of good big men who really aren't scoring unless it's created for them. I think a guy like that creating for them would be a lot more enjoyable to watch then Jennings shooting 40%.

This is the whole key to this debate. The problem is nobody can predict what's going to happen with Jennings. I like to think he still has a lot of room for improvement but it could definitely go either way. That's exactly why I don't mind having Jennings on the trade block. Trading him for good value saves us from having to take the risk of signing him to a contract we all know its very possible that he won't live up to...

[ReasonablySober]

There's a 20% difference between $8 and $10 million. So let's stop saying between $8-$10 like they're one and the same. There have been people in this thread that have said they'd be fine with him at $8 million, but would balk at $10.

Does it matter all that much? In some sense it certainly does but at the same time if you don't trade him, you've got to be ready to match a 4/$44 type deal at a minimum. So in a sense while I started my hypothetical at $8.5mm, you've got to be ready to pay $11 million a year if you don't trade him at the deadline.

It doesn't mean he gets an offer sheet like that. But it isn't out of the realm of possibility. Many years there is always one desperate team with tons of cap space to blow to meet min payroll or a guy like Cuban who loses out on everything else out there.

Well, yea. That's why I move him. I think it's more likely he gets $10 million than $8 million, and $8.5 million is basically the lowest to which I think he's still an asset.

To me it's a no brainer.

[paulpressey25]

To me it's a no brainer.

I voted to move him.

While he's restricted, this could get out of control come July 1st. If the Toronto fans can't get a restraining order on Brian Colangelo I could see a 4/$50 deal coming in the hopes we don't match it.

[Baddy Chuck]

When you look at players paid over $10 million you are clearly looking a different level of player then Jennings.

[ackypoo]

When you look at players paid over $10 million you are clearly looking a different level of player then Jennings.

there are 55 players in the nba making over 10m a year. ill take jennings for 10m.

[H2tObes]

Yeah you can make an argument that Jennings is a top 55 player. He's arguably top 10 in a position that's absolutely stacked.

[ReasonablySober]

When you look at players paid over $10 million you are clearly looking a different level of player then Jennings.

Here's the list:

Bryant 27.8
Dirk 20.9
Arenas 20.8
Stoudemire 19.9
Johnson 19.7
Anthony 19.4
Howard 19.2
Gasol 19.0
Paul 17.8
James 17.5
Bosh 17.5
Durant 17.5
D. Williams 17.2
Wade 17.0
Bynum 16.4
Roy 16.3
Pierce 16.8
Rose 16.4
Brand 16.0
A. Jefferson 15.0
Boozer 15.0
Davis 14.85
Iguodala 14.7
Ginobili 14.1
Westbrook 13.7
Lopez 13.7
Hibbert 13.7
R. Lewis 13.7
E. Gordon 13.7
Griffin 13.6
Harden 13.6
Love 13.6
Chandler 13.6
Okafor 13.5
Deng 13.3
J. Smith 13.2
Bogut 13.1
Nene 13.0
Aldridge 13.0
Granger 13.0
Martin 12.9
D. Lee 12.7
Parker 12.5
Garnett 12.5
B. Gordon 12.4
Ibaka 12.3
Humphries 12.0
Horford 12.0
Batum 11.9
Turkoglu 11.8
Noah 11.1
Rondo 11.0
Holiday 11.0
Ellis 11.0
Lawson 10.7
Maggette 10.9
Calderon 10.6
Jordan 10.5
S. Jackson 10.1
Jefferson 10.1
Bargnani 10.0
McGee 10.0
West 10.0

The thing is, there comes a point where you ask what the point is? Is Pau Gasol a great player? This season not withstanding, the answer is yes. Is he worth even half of what he's making over the next two seasons? Not even close.

You also have to ask yourself if some of those guys are worth having around, even if they are productive. Would you rather have Nene for $15 million or Ilysasova for half that. Nene is a good player, but he isn't double Ilyasova.

I'd argue the majority of that list is overpaid relative to expectations, and probably every available metric.

[H2tObes]

I'd easily take Jennings over any player getting paid less then 11 million on that list.

[ackypoo]

and about 20 guys getting paid more than 11 mil on that list.

[paulpressey25]

When you look at players paid over $10 million you are clearly looking a different level of player then Jennings.

If Jennings somehow makes the all-star team, and Cuban strikes out on Dwight, he's going to have enough cap room to keep Mayo around at $8mm a year, add Jennings at $12 million a year and also add Iggy at $10mm a year.

Do I think that is a great team? No. But Cuban has to do something this summer.

[ackypoo]

if youre of the opinion that we cant win a title with jennings, trading him for anything but picks is not the answer, and we should tank.

[SkilesTheLimit]

The reason I would vote YES is because if they go into the off-season as is, once again this organization will be acting from a defensive position. Instead of a) proactively offering him a contract in the $8 mil/per arena before this season or b) pursuing a trade of Jennings for future assets at the deadline, they will be in a position where they may have to "overpay" due to some other team's assessment of his value (Tor, Dal?) or choose not to match and lose arguably their most valuable asset for nothing.

I just don't trust this franchise to maximize their assets.

[mattg]

Calderon is the right comparison for Vasquez.

But unless he improves, is Jennings more then Nick Van Exel? I think you could make an argument either way who you want of Jose Calderon or Nick Van Exel. We have a ton of good big men who really aren't scoring unless it's created for them. I think a guy like that creating for them would be a lot more enjoyable to watch then Jennings shooting 40%.

If you think Calderon is a guy who creates a lot of offense you haven't seen him play. Hate saying it but its the truth. Calderon is a notorious ball mover, not a guy who creates tons of opportunities for guys who can't create for themselves. It's also why you need to be careful when reasoning using metrics like double digit assist games or something.

[drew881]

When you look at players paid over $10 million you are clearly looking a different level of player then Jennings.

If Jennings somehow makes the all-star team, and Cuban strikes out on Dwight, he's going to have enough cap room to keep Mayo around at $8mm a year, add Jennings at $12 million a year and also add Iggy at $10mm a year.

Do I think that is a great team? No. But Cuban has to do something this summer.

And this is why you lock Jennings up when there was that report earlier this year that he would take 4/36, no? I thought that was pretty reasonable.