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Potential Jennings trade thread (POLL ADDED)

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Would you trade Jennings before the deadline

Yes (if yes, let us know what it would take)
31
46%
No (what would you sign him to, long term)
36
54%
 
Total votes: 67

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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#181 » by Nebula1 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:27 pm

milweskee wrote:Keep Jennings and pair him with a good SG.


That's the right answer.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#182 » by InsideOut » Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:31 pm

Seems to me this another problem with the Bucks plan of perpetual mediocrity (also known as win now while trying to add pieces). You end up drafting in a position where you get players that aren't so great as you just pay them or they are bad enough that you don't really care if they leave. BJ is like the Bucks...good enough to keep you from being bad and bad enough that he'll never make you great. He, like many on the roster, keep you stuck in perpetual mediocrity.

Then come contract time he is good enough that you don't want to lose him for nothing yet he isn't good enough to trade for a great piece. That leaves you either paying what will most likely be more than he is worth or trading him in a deck chair move. At the end of the day the move with the best upside seems to be sign him (not sure he wants to stay) and hope he breaks out. I think that is a rotten way to try and build a team. Give me a top 5 pick over overpaying a guy and praying that he takes the leap that he didn't take during his first four years.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#183 » by ampd » Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:44 pm

Baddy Chuck wrote:To just elaborate on this, here is the list (in my opinion) of guys who became more then role players in the league the past 10 years who were drafted as sophomores or younger so they would be somewhere around 24 or younger at the time their 4 years were over.

I'm bolding the ones who really improved after their fourth season.

[list of guys]
Mo Williams


I don't think your list is all that accurate.

Mo Williams TS his first 4 seasons in the NBA - .433, .504, .518, .519. It wasn't until his 5th year that he improved to .566, yet magically he isn't bolded on your list?

I agree with the general sentiment that its better if they break out earlier, and that generally later break out guys don't become superstars but I don't think its a long shot that he improves.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#184 » by -Jragon- » Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:46 pm

mlloyd10 wrote:I doubt the raptors would ever trade Ross, but what about this

Lowry/Ross/Bargnani for Ilyasova/Gooden/Jennings

They were linked to Ilyasova in the off season.

The way I looked at is Jennings is going to make $10mil next year so would you rather have Lowry/Bargnani or Jennings/Gooden for $16 mil?


I'd pull that trigger and I don't even know who Ross is.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#185 » by Nebula1 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:48 pm

Terrence Ross have it all. For real though, he's fun to watch and an exciting prospect.

That said, Jennings is superior to Lowry and getting Bargnani makes me a little nauseous. No deal.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#186 » by M-C-G » Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:20 pm

Nebula1 wrote:
milweskee wrote:Keep Jennings and pair him with a good SG.


That's the right answer.


Agreed, Jennings has had exactly one NBA coach prior to Boylan. That coach seems to have a reputation for not holding players accountable on the offensive end, and conflicting reports about said coaches ability to construct an effective offense.

Up until a year ago, he hasn't been paired with another true scorer, and then when we get one, we get possibly the worst possible match for Jennings game.

I'd like to see a coach that forces him to focus on creating offense, high paced, alley oops, etc AND give him someone that can stroke the three and and run the court at SG. I'd be really excited to see what's possible from there.

As mentioned before 3/4 of this board if not more completely bailed on Larry Sanders as hopeless after the summer league. It would be sad to bail on someone with so much potential without seeing how he reacts to a different coach, and someone that can match his game at SG.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#187 » by paulpressey25 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:29 pm

M-C-G wrote:As mentioned before 3/4 of this board if not more completely bailed on Larry Sanders as hopeless after the summer league.


Larry Sanders is breaking out in year 3 after not getting a lot of opportunities in the first two seasons. Brandon has had the starting job now for four years.

The other major distinction is that we do not need to make a decision on paying Larry Sanders for at least another year. Brandon is 5.5 months out.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#188 » by giraldo5 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:05 pm

Nebula1 wrote:
giraldo5 wrote:
Nebula1 wrote:Should have already extended Jennings


Too bad Morey is too smart to trade for him. Could kill two birds with one stone in that scenerio.



Would you trade Jennings/Ilyasova for Lin/Patterson?

http://basketball.realgm.com/tradecheck ... de/6208390


No. Lin might be the one PG I prefer Brandon too.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#189 » by linguini8 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:19 pm

Nebula1 wrote:
emunney wrote:Swap Terrence Jones for Patterson and I'm in.


I think the deal would have to get bigger then to go with Jones like adding Tobias Harris.

http://basketball.realgm.com/tradecheck ... de/6208401

Jennings/Ilyasova/Harris for Lin/Patterson/Jones


Woof.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#190 » by CanadaBucks » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:26 pm

linguini8 wrote:
Nebula1 wrote:
emunney wrote:Swap Terrence Jones for Patterson and I'm in.


I think the deal would have to get bigger then to go with Jones like adding Tobias Harris.

http://basketball.realgm.com/tradecheck ... de/6208401

Jennings/Ilyasova/Harris for Lin/Patterson/Jones


Woof.

No thanks.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#191 » by linguini8 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:31 pm

M-C-G wrote:
Nebula1 wrote:
milweskee wrote:Keep Jennings and pair him with a good SG.


That's the right answer.


Agreed, Jennings has had exactly one NBA coach prior to Boylan. That coach seems to have a reputation for not holding players accountable on the offensive end, and conflicting reports about said coaches ability to construct an effective offense.

Up until a year ago, he hasn't been paired with another true scorer, and then when we get one, we get possibly the worst possible match for Jennings game.

I'd like to see a coach that forces him to focus on creating offense, high paced, alley oops, etc AND give him someone that can stroke the three and and run the court at SG. I'd be really excited to see what's possible from there.

As mentioned before 3/4 of this board if not more completely bailed on Larry Sanders as hopeless after the summer league. It would be sad to bail on someone with so much potential without seeing how he reacts to a different coach, and someone that can match his game at SG.

I agree with most of what you said. A new coach with more of an offensive mindset could definitely help bring out the potential in him. But he doesn't need a coach telling him to get out and run and try to find the ways for his team to score. That's his game now. That's likely what he's been told to do for the last 3 seasons. He needs a coach that can teach him floor vision and decision making. Not running lanes and alley oops.

If Jennings could learn to cut out 2 or 3 bad shots per game and instead pass the ball, his efficency and impact on the game would sky rocket. He also needs to learn how to draw contact and get to the line 5 or 6 times per game. I'd like to keep him. He's only 23, has all this potential still, but he isn't worth $10million. He hasn't shown any significant improvements yet. When you open up the boxscore on any given night, you are likely going to see Jennings: 6-14FG, 2-3FT, 3Reb, 4Ast, 16Pts.

We've seen the same from Jennings for 4 years now.

Also Larry Sanders has shown significant improvement in his shot selection and decision making on the offensive side of the ball. FG% years 1/2/3: 43%, 45%, 54% Jennings has the same coaching staff. Has had the same coaching staff for 4 years. I'm sure they tell him to work on his shot selection often. Jennings FG% years 1-4: 37%, 39%, 41%, 40%.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#192 » by raferfenix » Sat Jan 19, 2013 8:25 pm

Glad to see Rondo on the list.

Would trade Jennings / Moute / Udoh for him.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#193 » by Baddy Chuck » Sat Jan 19, 2013 8:38 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:
M-C-G wrote:As mentioned before 3/4 of this board if not more completely bailed on Larry Sanders as hopeless after the summer league.


Larry Sanders is breaking out in year 3 after not getting a lot of opportunities in the first two seasons. Brandon has had the starting job now for four years.

This.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#194 » by Baddy Chuck » Sat Jan 19, 2013 8:41 pm

ampd wrote:I don't think your list is all that accurate.

Mo Williams TS his first 4 seasons in the NBA - .433, .504, .518, .519. It wasn't until his 5th year that he improved to .566, yet magically he isn't bolded on your list?

I agree with the general sentiment that its better if they break out earlier, and that generally later break out guys don't become superstars but I don't think its a long shot that he improves.

Fair enough, looking at those numbers Mo should be bolded. With that said, if Brandon turned into Mo Williams I don't know how that makes him a great, or even good player. There's a reason Mo was run out of town and Brandon has all those on the court problems and some.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#195 » by LUKE23 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 8:43 pm

I'd say we just keep every player we draft until their extension, then swap them for a non-impact veteran because we don't want to pay them, then pick in the early to mid teens, then repeat the process again.

I'm only half kidding, unfortunately. None of any of these trades matter unless there is a tank put on, and that is the problem. At some point, if we aren't going to tank, we need to pick a core of guys and see what we have. Dumping Ilyasova for expirings and Jennings for Kyle Lowry doesn't help us any more now or any more in the future. Unless you think FA is going to be how the Bucks make their hay. And it sure as hell isn't.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#196 » by Baddy Chuck » Sat Jan 19, 2013 8:50 pm

LUKE23 wrote:I'm only half kidding, unfortunately. None of any of these trades matter unless there is a tank put on, and that is the problem. At some point, if we aren't going to tank, we need to pick a core of guys and see what we have. Dumping Ilyasova for expirings and Jennings for Kyle Lowry doesn't help us any more now or any more in the future. Unless you think FA is going to be how the Bucks make their hay. And it sure as hell isn't.

This is one thing I don't get. Alright, you don't want to be stuck in the mediocrity loop. Why are you keeping guys like Ersan and Jennings, who aren't great players, for big contract? Maybe you lose guys like Dunleavy and Monta and you are worse, but you keep guys like Ersan and Jennings just because they are "young" and you surely aren't a bottom 10 team, you're likely in the Philly category which is just as bad as we are now. Unless guys like Ersan or Brandon greatly improve their games they are not worth their contracts to a team like us. I don't see either as core pieces to a winning or tanking team.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#197 » by LUKE23 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 8:53 pm

Because I believe the team could make a big leap with a different SG, and I don't believe we'll find a younger/better PG prospect than Jennings in the draft or the open market. Adding Lowry and Marion does NOTHING to help this team long-term. Great, it gives a one-year stop gap, we're still not high in the lottery, and then we're still searching for long-term pieces. What is wrong with seeing what Jennings/new SG/Moute/Ilyasova/Sanders/Harris/Udoh/Lamb has. Grab another pick in a Monta deal too. It's not like our cap is in trouble at all, especially if we finally smarten up and amnesty Gooden.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#198 » by coolhandluke121 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:01 pm

Jennings for a pg and a big man?? Whatever. God that's dumb. Hardly any team in the history of the league has needed a 2-for-1 or 3-for-1 trade more than the Bucks do right now, and Ford has them pulling a 1-for-2.

Jennings and a big man for an upgrade at pg or sg would make a lot of sense though.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#199 » by Baddy Chuck » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:11 pm

LUKE23 wrote:Because I believe the team could make a big leap with a different SG, and I don't believe we'll find a younger/better PG prospect than Jennings in the draft or the open market. Adding Lowry and Marion does NOTHING to help this team long-term. Great, it gives a one-year stop gap, we're still not high in the lottery, and then we're still searching for long-term pieces. What is wrong with seeing what Jennings/new SG/Moute/Ilyasova/Sanders/Harris/Udoh/Lamb has. Grab another pick in a Monta deal too. It's not like our cap is in trouble at all, especially if we finally smarten up and amnesty Gooden.

See, I think adding Marion and Lowry do help you long term. Next year they are assets. I honestly don't believe Ersan holds much if any value in the league and whatever value he holds may just be a salary dump for a guy like Humphries or Marion. He's not the player we saw, he's not the player we even thought he'd be. He's looking more and more every day like an inconsistent 10/5, 20 minute a game backup. Especially to a team in our position now and moving forward, that $8 million is a burden. Our cap may not be bad but that is a bad contract. Brandon I'm not sure. A sign and trade wouldn't net us any value and the longer you hold him the longer his value just stays stagnant. If he doesn't improve, which looks more likely every day. whats holding his value higher then a Monta Ellis? Is a 40 million dollar investment worth the eventual swap for a mid first round pick or a B list prospect? That's where I see his contract heading.

If Jennings improves I really like most of our young pieces you listed. I feel like Henson is surely in that mix and should clearly be seeing starter minutes over Ersan though and at 8 million a year, and only able to play one position which he is being outplayed in, I think it's an easy choice to abandon ship with that deal whenever you get the chance.
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Re: Ford: Jennings #7 on players most likely to be traded 

Post#200 » by Nebula1 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:20 pm

giraldo5 wrote:No. Lin might be the one PG I prefer Brandon too.


Yet Morey was smart enough to move Lowry and sign Lin. For the record I wouldn't make the deal either for the Bucks and I like Lin more than Lowry.

I will say that Lin suffered from not getting an offseason of work due to injury and should take a leap next season with work in the summer of 2013. He's plenty quick, with handles and vision. Just needs the 3 ball to hit at a better rate which the offseason should provide.

In the end, the Bucks need to focus on getting the right 2 guard with the young core (26 and under) already in place (Jennings, Harris, Henson, Sanders, Udoh, Ilyasova, Moute, Lamb) as opposed to moving these pieces or win-now moves. This has been reiterated intelligently by different folks.

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