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europa wrote:]

One of the reasons Harris is gone is because he didn't mesh well with Jennings and Ellis.

Pretty big reach. I do know he didn't play well when he shared the court with them, including doing anything offensively, his calling card I guess. Defensively eyes will tell you he was behind the curve. I liked him, I would have rather they gave it more time, or better yet have started him some last year when he needed only displace a struggling Delfino. But he really didn't make his own case for minutes this year. The back court has lots of tangible problems we don't have to blame this years above average flu season on them.

DrugBust wrote:I've said it a few times this season: I actually like a lot of the pieces and the Bucks could be a fun team to watch if the right guys play. I love the front court rotation of Ersan, Sanders and Henson. Now we add an ideal SG/PG in Redick who fits perfectly.

It's the fact that the idiot swag twins are still around that puts a damper on the whole thing.

I like Redick more than some here and as you believe, the frontcourt has plenty of promise going forward.

That said, if say both Jennings/Redick are resigned in the offseason, it likely would end up costing somewhere in the range of 70-75 million for the two. Not a fan of that idea. Mix in what Sanders will end up costing, we could have a Sanders/Ersan/Redick/Jennings "core" all locked into long term pricey deals.

El Duderino wrote:That said, if say both Jennings/Redick are resigned in the offseason, it likely would end up costing somewhere in the range of 70-75 million for the two. Not a fan of that idea. Mix in what Sanders will end up costing, we could have a Sanders/Ersan/Redick/Jennings "core" all locked into long term pricey deals.

Yup. Even if Ellis leaves the Bucks probably end up overpaying Jennings and Redick so I'm not sure what you've really accomplished here. A guy who never should've been acquired in the first place is finally gone? Yay?

DrugBust wrote:I've said it a few times this season: I actually like a lot of the pieces and the Bucks could be a fun team to watch if the right guys play. I love the front court rotation of Ersan, Sanders and Henson. Now we add an ideal SG/PG in Redick who fits perfectly.

It's the fact that the idiot swag twins are still around that puts a damper on the whole thing.

But if they start Redick and only play Ellis when BJ is on the bench that solves that problem as well...

Resigning Redick would be a mistake. Anything above the MLE is a massive mistake. Thus, Hammond will do it.

Hammond needed to realize by 8am this morning that when he didn't have a deal, he was being played badly. But Hammond generally is a nice trusting guy. Ferry is a Duke prick. He should have known who he was dealing with.

At that time he needed to have a plan B and C in place to break up the swag twins with different deals. At least send one packing, because it made no sense to keep Jennings around and trade for Redick if you weren't bringing in Josh Smith. And it goes without saying last year's trade with GSW is now officially a disaster since we never capitalized on trading Monta for something in the past 11 months.

Once again Hammond got completely played here. But in the end, Kohl gets played because he's the one who signed off on another 8th seed treadmill move. I like Redick. This deal in isolation wasn't that bad. But come 30 days from now when we have all three of our poorly fitting guards wanting big paydays, the mistakes of today will come back to haunt us.

I was hoping Plan A was to trade Ellis for Smith. Still want to know why that wasn't done.

People here are planning bag nights, when they should be popping bottles of champagne. Ferry saved our asses.

As for this summer, I'm fine with paying Redick if he wants to stay for around $8 million and four years. Let Jr. and Daly walk.

My only singular hope at this point is Ellis opts out and is gone. If he opts in it's a nightmare. I don't even want to think about the possibility of the Bucks extending him.

paulpressey25 wrote:Hammond needed to realize by 8am this morning that when he didn't have a deal, he was being played badly. But Hammond generally is a nice trusting guy. Ferry is a Duke prick. He should have known who he was dealing with.

Great post. What changed for Hammond between last night and 2 o'clock? If the deal changed significantly ok, but if it was essentially the same the whole time and no new teams were showing up putiing in bids then it should have been become apparent well before 2 pm that there was a strong chance we were being strung along to be used as leverage by the hawks in negotiations with other teams that might come in and try to beat the Bucks offer right at the finish line and we should have taken some of our eggs out of that basket...

For a guy who wants to see the Bucks lose 60 games a season you sure seem pretty fired up about a team that appears to be a lock now to win around 40.

I've been making that claim for a number of years that they were the worst run in major American professional sports, let alone just NBA. After the last two trade deadline debacles, I'd have to up it to possibly the worst in the major sporting world, and of all-time in America. I couldn't even do a worse job of running a franchise if that was my goal.

DrugBust wrote:People here are planning bag nights, when they should be popping bottles of champagne. Ferry saved our asses.

As for this summer, I'm fine with paying Redick if he wants to stay for around $8 million and four years. Let Jr. and Daly walk.

My only singular hope at this point is Ellis opts out and is gone. If he opts in it's a nightmare. I don't even want to think about the possibility of the Bucks extending him.

If we're still trying to think glass half full then I think it's reasonable to assume that if it looks like we will sign Redick to a long term deal in the offseason to be the SG and resign BJ at point then that should make it more likely Monta opts out. Don't u think that's true?

There is something about a 28 year old having his best season in a contract year wanting starter money that concerns me. Awell, means nothing if Brandon and Ellis are still on the team they're horrific players. I pity the poor bastards who end up stuck with them for the next four-five years. Oh.

europa wrote:For a guy who wants to see the Bucks lose 60 games a season you sure seem pretty fired up about a team that appears to be a lock now to win around 40.

You keep saying I like the 'team'. I don't. I said like some of the pieces. I like Sanders, Ersan, Henson and Redick.

I didn't for a second think the Bucks were capable of tanking this season. It wasn't going to happen with Sanders play All-NBA defense and Ersan back to what he was doing last year. So short of dealing those two, I'm fine with continuing to collect good players that can be moved.

Baddy and Ellis can GTFO.

DrugBust wrote:

europa wrote:For a guy who wants to see the Bucks lose 60 games a season you sure seem pretty fired up about a team that appears to be a lock now to win around 40.

You keep saying I like the 'team'. I don't. I said like some of the pieces. I like Sanders, Ersan, Henson and Redick.

The problem is those pieces all play second fiddle to Jennings and Ellis. Even if Ellis is gone after this season how much will things really change with Jennings getting a long-term deal? Is he capable of relegating himself to a lesser role (which he should do given his offensive limitations)? Until that's done it's hard for me to get real fired up about this team regardless of whether they have a few nice pieces or not.

As far as tanking, the Bucks were never going to allow it so it was unrealistic on those grounds alone. This trade is further proof of that.

Personally, I differ from others in that I wish we would trade Sanders, Ersan etc. I don't see how keeping them helps anything. Tanking will be impossible as long as we have those guys around. This team needs a rebuilding from the ground up, and that unfortunately means letting go of some guys we really like.

europa wrote:

DrugBust wrote:

europa wrote:For a guy who wants to see the Bucks lose 60 games a season you sure seem pretty fired up about a team that appears to be a lock now to win around 40.

You keep saying I like the 'team'. I don't. I said like some of the pieces. I like Sanders, Ersan, Henson and Redick.

The problem is those pieces all play second fiddle to Jennings and Ellis. Even if Ellis is gone after this season how much will things really change with Jennings getting a long-term deal? Is he capable of relegating himself to a lesser role (which he should do given his offensive limitations)? Until that's done it's hard for me to get real fired up about this team regardless of whether they have a few nice pieces or not.

As far as tanking, the Bucks were never going to allow it so it was unrealistic on those grounds alone. This trade is further proof of that.

Well, no ****. I'm not fired up about this team either. I'm simply able to look at an individual deal and appreciate it. The Bucks today got the anti-Monta Ellis. I hope he sticks around a few years because he's good and he really fits.

As for Ellis and Jennings, I'm gonna hope like hell he hates it here enough to opt out, and I hope Jennings looks good enough with Redick that I'm not gonna feel physically ill when we re-sign him.

Sherman Douglas wrote:Personally, I differ from others in that I wish we would trade Sanders, Ersan etc. I don't see how keeping them helps anything. Tanking will be impossible as long as we have those guys around. This team needs a rebuilding from the ground up, and that unfortunately means letting go of some guys we really like.

I actually agree. I said it earlier today but if I were running the team I'd strip it down and tank like hell for a draft class in '14 that has legit franchise guys.

But it's not happening.

What I think DB is saying is that he would have welcomed the Bucks acquiring Udonis Haslem to play starting PF for us back in 2008-09.

Anyways, here is what will happen in the off-season:

Ellis will opt in for 11 million after coming to the conclusion that he won't be able to do better on the open market.

The Bucks in turn will be forced to let Redick go, not wanting to pay another 8-10 million for a shooting guard when they are such with Ellis on the payroll.

Jennings will be kept.

After that, Ellis will again have to face reality and accept that Milwaukee is the only place where a GM will be dumb enough to overpay him on a multi-year deal, and he will be re-sign here long term.