Trade & Transaction Ideas

raferfenix · Post #461 » by **raferfenix** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 1:58 pm

I'm not ready to declare Monroe to be a failure here. He's only 25 and our team has played precious few games as a unit so far.

That said, if Monroe does not work out, when do we think the earliest would be that we would seriously consider a trade?

Of course that would be opportunity dependent too. Like if Kupchak throws a last win-now hailmary by offering Russell / Hibbert for something like MCW / Monroe + whatever else.

That might be an extreme example insofar as what we could get in return. But if something of that surprisingly-high caliber would turn out to be available, we do know Hammond (for all his faults) does have a positive history of cutting bait on failed moves.

Ron Swanson · Post #462 » by **Ron Swanson** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:10 pm

Lakers are not bailing on Russell that early, it's a pipe dream.

Jarnell Stokes just got sent to the d-league. I wonder how much the Heat actually value him considering it seemed like he was a throw-in for the Chalmers trade. I wasn't too high on him in the draft but he's a young big who can rebound and still has some upside. A straight up Bayless for Stokes swap seems like appropriate value.

Zeezprah · Post #463 » by **Zeezprah** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:12 pm

russell sucks, no idea why we'd want him

DingleJerry · Post #464 » by **DingleJerry** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:17 pm

Zeezprah wrote:russell sucks, no idea why we'd want him

Totally agree, yea I think most 19yr old rookies should be forever judged based on their first 15 games playing on a dysfunctional team coached by an idiot. Yea, no way he has any talent that could be molded by good coach/system. I wouldn't give up one of our top 55 protected 2nd rounders for him.

Post #465 » by **Prez** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:23 pm

Russell has looked fine his past few games. The guys get put under a microscope because he plays for the Lakers but overall he's been really solid in recent games as he's gotten more comfortable, the talent is clear.

Teenage guards routinely struggle their first years, and it's even worse when you play for a dumpster fire team with dumb chuckers and probably the worst coach in the NBA who is doing everything in his power to screw over your development.

Russell would be the perfect PG here going forward. Lakers aren't trading him but I'd love to pair him with GA/JP

RRyder823 · Post #466 » by **RRyder823** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:25 pm

BadgersBucks wrote:
Zeezprah wrote:russell sucks, no idea why we'd want him

Totally agree, yea I think most 19yr old rookies should be forever judged based on their first 15 games playing on a dysfunctional team coached by an idiot. Yea, no way he has any talent that could be molded by good coach/system. I wouldn't give up one of our top 55 protected 2nd rounders for him.

It's not like plenty if people would still love a trade for Exum or something..... oh crap..... There "might" be a few that would be ecstatic by that trade even still but revile at the though of trading for Russell after 15 games? Double standards and biases.... Gotta love em

Badgerlander · Post #467 » by **Badgerlander** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:42 pm

Josh RobbinsVerified account ‏@JoshuaBRobbins 6m6 minutes ago
Tonight, Victor Oladipo will come off the bench. Magic starters: Payton, Fournier, Harris, Frye and Vucevic.

Time to pick up the phone

Post #468 » by **ReasonablySober** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:43 pm

Badgerlander wrote:
Josh RobbinsVerified account ‏@JoshuaBRobbins 6m6 minutes ago
Tonight, Victor Oladipo will come off the bench. Magic starters: Payton, Fournier, Harris, Frye and Vucevic.

Time to pick up the phone

Have no idea what they would want, but **** yea.

Badgerlander · Post #469 » by **Badgerlander** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:48 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
Badgerlander wrote:
Josh RobbinsVerified account ‏@JoshuaBRobbins 6m6 minutes ago
Tonight, Victor Oladipo will come off the bench. Magic starters: Payton, Fournier, Harris, Frye and Vucevic.

Time to pick up the phone

Have no idea what they would want, but **** yea.

we could absorb him into Zaza's TPE so 2017 1st plus ?

DingleJerry · Post #470 » by **DingleJerry** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:51 pm

If only we had an extra 1st round pick lying around to help sweeten a deal.

SupremeHustle · Post #471 » by **SupremeHustle** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:54 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
Badgerlander wrote:
Josh RobbinsVerified account ‏@JoshuaBRobbins 6m6 minutes ago
Tonight, Victor Oladipo will come off the bench. Magic starters: Payton, Fournier, Harris, Frye and Vucevic.

Time to pick up the phone

Have no idea what they would want, but **** yea.

This is Scott Skiles we're talking about. I'm thinking Bayless ought to get 'er done.

SupremeHustle · Post #472 » by **SupremeHustle** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 4:55 pm

But seriously, I'd give up Vaughn, Inglis and a protected first.

Ron Swanson · Post #473 » by **Ron Swanson** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:01 pm

I'm not as enamored with Oladipo's upside as a lot of other people apparently are, and it has nothing to do with his numbers. If the price is low enough, sure. But I'm guessing the Magic want a pretty substantial return.

Badgerlander · Post #474 » by **Badgerlander** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:14 pm

BMatt07 · Post #475 » by **BMatt07** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:35 pm

I'd kill to have Oladipo on the Bucks.

DingleJerry · Post #476 » by **DingleJerry** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:41 pm

I'd like him at PG with our lineup and for the future. He can do everything they hoped MCW would and shoot above 30% from 3. Can't really think of a good trade that works with them other than draft picks. I think they're first round pick from Europe would be considered a SG so likely not interested in Vaughn.

Ron Swanson · Post #477 » by **Ron Swanson** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 6:49 pm

BadgersBucks wrote:I'd like him at PG with our lineup and for the future. He can do everything they hoped MCW would and shoot above 30% from 3. Can't really think of a good trade that works with them other than draft picks. I think they're first round pick from Europe would be considered a SG so likely not interested in Vaughn.

The things is, he's not. I get that people want to mold him into one, but the "Oladipo at the point" experiment was pretty much a failure and the Magic (under two different coaches) have essentially admitted as much by moving him to the 2-guard almost full-time (even playing him at SF in small-ball lineups), and now, as a spark-plug off the bench type role.

If we're acquiring him to play the 2, I'm all for it (depending on what we give up), but if you're expecting him to be the PG of the future, then you're falling into the same Brandon Knight logic of trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.

DingleJerry · Post #478 » by **DingleJerry** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:07 pm

They're whole stated goal is positionless basketball, call it what you will. It's called a PG in this system but it's not in the traditional sense. He is a better version of MCW, he does every thing equal or better than him on the court other than be 2 inches shorter. It makes even less sense to get him as a 2 when you already have middleton. The four of Mid, Giannis, Jab, Oladipo would have to play together or else why bother with getting him. The championship Bulls teams didn't have a true PG and it worked fine, I think this is their goal, have several guys that can do everything and have the ability to switch on D.

If you just disagree with that strategy it's fine but a different argument. If they're going to what they're trying now, Oladipo is a clear upgrade to MCW

Ron Swanson · Post #479 » by **Ron Swanson** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:39 pm

BadgersBucks wrote:They're whole stated goal is positionless basketball, call it what you will. It's called a PG in this system but it's not in the traditional sense. He is a better version of MCW, he does every thing equal or better than him on the court other than be 2 inches shorter. It makes even less sense to get him as a 2 when you already have middleton. The four of Mid, Giannis, Jab, Oladipo would have to play together or else why bother with getting him. The championship Bulls teams didn't have a true PG and it worked fine, I think this is their goal, have several guys that can do everything and have the ability to switch on D.

If you just disagree with that strategy it's fine but a different argument. If they're going to what they're trying now, Oladipo is a clear upgrade to MCW

That's fine to call it that, but you're still asking him to play the role of primary ball-handler in a lineup lacking true ball-handlers (assuming you have Middleton at the 2). It's not positionless if you still have him initiating the offense (like MCW does the majority of the time he's on the floor).

It didn't work with Oladipo at the point under 2 coaches in Orlando (much like it didn't work with Knight in Detroit), so I think any expectations that you won't have the same kind of ball-movement issues that have plagued this offense in the past, is really unreasonable and entirely wishful thinking. There's a reason that Orlando's offense flows much better with a distributor/defensive specialist like Payton in the back-court.

That said, if Giannis or Jabari start initiating the offense as the primary ball-handler, then that solves a lot of problems. Oladipo's poor-to-average court vision and P&R offense being one of them.

DingleJerry · Post #480 » by **DingleJerry** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 7:51 pm

You make another point. If they want this positionless team then why does MCW initiate almost every time. There is 4 capable ball handlers in the starting 5.

But really your point was that you'd just prefer a real PG rather than this strategy, which is totally fair and I wouldn't even disagree really. All I'm saying is he's an upgrade to MCW and the more talent you get the better. Coaches need to find a way to make it work from there. If you'd rather wait for a real PG that's fair, but it probably doesn't make sense to get Oladipo then as we are already set at those positions.