PG Thread (Charlotte) - 5 losses in a row

[bucksbrewers3]

First off, let me apologize for my constant Kidd bashing. I know it probably gets old, but this is my only way to vent. However, you should be mad at him for constantly being so dumb, making me this way. Anyways...

Jabari played 40 minutes just LAST NIGHT.

He played 20 friggin' minutes in the first half tonight.

He then played the ENTIRE 3rd quarter.

AND HE WAS STILL ON THE FLOOR TO OPEN THE 4TH!!

He finally got a rest 6 minutes into the 4th.

That means he played 38 of the possible 42 minutes. Jesus Christ. This guy is insane.

And people wanna question why these guys are playing with no energy?? They've been run into the damn ground since the AS break, that's why.

I cannot believe we replaced Larry Drew with an even dumber coach. That's just our luck, I guess.

Jesus Christ. First people are complaining about Parker and Giannis not in the game now it's they are in there too long.


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[Magic Giannison]

Seriously, how can people defend Kid at this point. I can give him all the credit you want for his personal developing and insisting on Giannis being pg but as a coach he is a complete failure.
Its not like Kidd does this crap in last games only, he has done crappy lineups/bad decision whole year long.He puts up a freaking 2 center line up when we need perimeter D and goes small when we need paint defense.....
What exactly besides the Giannis thing would justify Kidd's defense at this point, what has he done that makes people want to defend him ?

[LuessiT]

Seriously, how can people defend Kid at this point. I can give him all the credit you want for his personal developing and insisting on Giannis being pg but as a coach he is a complete failure.
Its not like Kidd does this crap in last games only, he has done crappy lineups/bad decision whole year long.He puts up a freaking 2 center line up when we need perimeter D and goes small when we need paint defense.....
What exactly besides the Giannis thing would justify Kidd's defense at this point, what has he done that makes people want to defend him ?

Seriously, how can you moan every single time. It's so annoying.

Who should Kidd bring in instead of Plumlee and Henson? Right now we have an 7-8 player rotation with Bayless, Middleton, Giannis, Jabari, Monroe, Henson, Plumlee and Ennis due to his recent emergence (yes, the guy you bash at every given opportunity). I myself would like to include Inglis, but Kidd is the coach and might have reasons to not play him that often. When guys like Vaughn or JOB play, everybody blames Kidd for using players that are simply not good enough (right now).
So on the one hand you want to rest Jabari and Giannis, on the other hand you don't want to see two centers on the floor? That's not going to happen.
And I don't have statistics right now, but even though the spacing is horrible with both Henson and Plumlee in the lineup, but from what I remember we haven't done that bad with those two on the floor.

[Chapter29]

It's going to be hard to be excited about next season.

Middleton has been struggling to hit the three lately. His three point percentage is under 40% on the season now.

The positive is Ennis played well.

Really? Wow. I feel the exact opposite.

Middleton needs to settle into his role, but that will take Giannis and Parker to establish themselves as the true #1 and #2 on the team. It will also take us to be able to shore up our complimentary players at least in part. That will hopefully get Middleton better looks. Too many of his 3's are taken in that Brandon Knight way, off dribble pull ups and regardless far too often with a defender in his face. I hope we never see that Kobe post fade of his that he almost never seems to hit. He must hit those in practice or something but in games its simply awful.

Next season will be another step in that direction and I am very excited about it. Giannis, Parker and the teams overall growth. Gonna be a fun year. 45, 50, 55 win team I suspect but the offseason is pretty critical to get this team right.

This game was brutal. Ennis did show some signs. Nice to see. Could be our backup PG. Hmmm...what to do with MCW if we can't trade him?

[Magic Giannison]

Seriously, how can people defend Kid at this point. I can give him all the credit you want for his personal developing and insisting on Giannis being pg but as a coach he is a complete failure.
Its not like Kidd does this crap in last games only, he has done crappy lineups/bad decision whole year long.He puts up a freaking 2 center line up when we need perimeter D and goes small when we need paint defense.....
What exactly besides the Giannis thing would justify Kidd's defense at this point, what has he done that makes people want to defend him ?

Seriously, how can you moan every single time. It's so annoying.

Who should Kidd bring in instead of Plumlee and Henson? Right now we have an 7-8 player rotation with Bayless, Middleton, Giannis, Jabari, Monroe, Henson, Plumlee and Ennis due to his recent emergence (yes, the guy you bash at every given opportunity). I myself would like to include Inglis, but Kidd is the coach and might have reasons to not play him that often. When guys like Vaughn or JOB play, everybody blames Kidd for using players that are simply not good enough (right now).
So on the one hand you want to rest Jabari and Giannis, on the other hand you don't want to see two centers on the floor? That's not going to happen.
And I don't have statistics right now, but even though the spacing is horrible with both Henson and Plumlee in the lineup, but from what I remember we haven't done that bad with those two on the floor.

So its annoying when people complain about his bad coaching that ruins our team but its ok to blindly defend him ?
Kidd knows or should know that jabari and Monroe doesnt work together yet he plays them together. Kidd knows he can start Jabari and Henson which would improve paint defense while keeping Jabari involve don offense yet he barely used that lineup.

Its not about resting Giannis and Jabari, its about them being totally misused and bad managed. Nobody wants to see Ennis Bayless doing high PNR with Middleton and have him post up while Giannis and Jbari sit on the corner....

Kidd has been doing these since last year but he can lucky because we had a terrific bench and no matter which lineup he used it mostly worked.
I do not understand why are you guys fine with a bad coach.

[M-C-G]

if kidds leading the tank, why no inglis?
if we arent tanking...lol.

I'm very curious why we aren't seeing any Inglis...set back maybe?

[M-C-G]

Inglis isn't gonna be mistaken for being an athletic freak anytime soon. But he does seem very crafty...and he seems to know what he's doing out there. Especially on defense. That's pretty impressive for a young guy who missed his entire rookie season.

It's also why it's frustrating as hell that he isn't seeing more PT down the stretch here.

Totally agree with this. It was obvious he wasn't conditioned earlier in the year, but has looked fit since, and much more deserving of minutes. Impossible to justify keeping him on the bench this much if he isn't hurt or on some kind of minutes restriction.

Completely unacceptable.

[UWM_Brew_Buck]

Seriously, how can people defend Kid at this point. I can give him all the credit you want for his personal developing and insisting on Giannis being pg but as a coach he is a complete failure.
Its not like Kidd does this crap in last games only, he has done crappy lineups/bad decision whole year long.He puts up a freaking 2 center line up when we need perimeter D and goes small when we need paint defense.....
What exactly besides the Giannis thing would justify Kidd's defense at this point, what has he done that makes people want to defend him ?

Seriously, how can you moan every single time. It's so annoying.

Who should Kidd bring in instead of Plumlee and Henson? Right now we have an 7-8 player rotation with Bayless, Middleton, Giannis, Jabari, Monroe, Henson, Plumlee and Ennis due to his recent emergence (yes, the guy you bash at every given opportunity). I myself would like to include Inglis, but Kidd is the coach and might have reasons to not play him that often. When guys like Vaughn or JOB play, everybody blames Kidd for using players that are simply not good enough (right now).
So on the one hand you want to rest Jabari and Giannis, on the other hand you don't want to see two centers on the floor? That's not going to happen.
And I don't have statistics right now, but even though the spacing is horrible with both Henson and Plumlee in the lineup, but from what I remember we haven't done that bad with those two on the floor.

So its annoying when people complain about his bad coaching that ruins our team but its ok to blindly defend him ?
Kidd knows or should know that jabari and Monroe doesnt work together yet he plays them together. Kidd knows he can start Jabari and Henson which would improve paint defense while keeping Jabari involve don offense yet he barely used that lineup.

Its not about resting Giannis and Jabari, its about them being totally misused and bad managed. Nobody wants to see Ennis Bayless doing high PNR with Middleton and have him post up while Giannis and Jbari sit on the corner....

Kidd has been doing these since last year but he can lucky because we had a terrific bench and no matter which lineup he used it mostly worked.
I do not understand why are you guys fine with a bad coach.

I agree with most of this but it is not a big deal now, losses are important. I am not really a fan or hater of Kidd. His GMing is unacceptable and needs to end ASAP but I can deal with his weird lineups and minute management because the most important thing by far now is player development and I think he is done a good job at that. I know you can argue nature vs nurture but we have a big 3 core of players emerging and I don't think it is a coincidence. Either way you have to happy with the results, for years I think we would have taken just 1 emerging core piece.

Now if Kidd gets replaced next year I won't lose any sleep over it. My biggest fear of him as a coach is that our offense is an afterthought and our defense which was amazing last year has been figured out and we have not adjusted at all.

[Prez]

if kidds leading the tank, why no inglis?
if we arent tanking...lol.

I'm very curious why we aren't seeing any Inglis...set back maybe?

He's looked perfectly fine when he's out there imo. Especially his defense, he's been surprisingly really good on that end. Don't think there's a setback at all, I think Kidd is just being Kidd.

[Buck Dweller]

Whatever dude. I'm actually starting to feel a little bad for you.

One hell of a counter argument...you realize that makes YOU look foolish, right?

Here, how about I just post this on every page so that my argument doesn't get lost.

If it were a Larry Drew or Jim Boylan or Scott Skiles, and not HOF PG Jason Kidd, they'd have issues with it.

My lack of complaining is not simply because he's a HOF PG, but because he has an incredible influence around the league, and he's done an amazing job developing Giannis and Middleton, and we're starting to see it with Parker. The young guys always gush over him as a coach but because they play a few extra minutes a game, and he brings his guys in on short, cheap deals to surround our core full of non-Schwartz guys, people freak out every single game.

It's not even like he favors his Schwartz clients. Bayless plays a lot, but he benched MCW and has been happy to DNP or <10 min to Vaughn and Ennis. That's it, 3 guys on rookie deals and Bayless. He brought in his former teammatess, Kenyon on 10 days (signed but cut), Copeland, who barely ever saw the court and got cut, and Vasquez, who I think Kidd said he liked him from playing in the Olympics and Playoffs. Even then, there have been rumors that ownership hasn't liked what they've seen from GM Kidd and we might not be seeing so much of it in the future.

If you want to complain about the Lasrys and all the rest of the cooks in the kitchen, fine. But to me the biggest difference is that these guys aren't content, probably ever with anything. They are hungry people who want to make money and, from what I can tell, win a lot of championships. The old regime liked to sit back and watch our team be competitive, even if it meant sacrificing our future. The only hopes they fed us of a championship were the years as the 8th seed and the mentality of "hey, anything could happy right?". These guys are not like that.

It really does not bother me whatsoever that Jabari played long stretches of minutes tonight. He needs to get his legs under him. He still doesn't have enough confidence in that leg. If he was truly tired, he would come out of the game, plain and simple. Another example of just not having a freaking clue as to how things work in the NBA. It's not NBA 2k where the guy is locked in on the court until Overseer Kidd tells him to come out. A quick look to the bench is all it takes. He's not doing that. He's young and he's fine. This is essentially the garbage time of the season and this time is incredibly important for Parker. Not to mention that the game was a blowout from the get-go. Kidd knew he'd sit Parker so he kept him out there.

It also does not bother me when we get a look at guys on expiring or 10 day contracts, maybe at the expense of Inglis who we have next season, or Vaughn who we have the next 3 years with. I just find it so bizarre how people on this board are so all over Kidd's rotations and minute distributions at this point in the season, or rather this season at all. If Kidd is running 11 man rotations and playing Giannis/Jabari for an entire half with no rest in the playoffs or a competitive March, then we have something to talk about.

I would also like to point out that Kevin Durant averaged 39 minutes his 2nd season. He averaged over 38 until he was 27. Does anybody think that guy is playing too many minutes? Paul Pierce played 38 minutes a game when he was 23 and 40 when he was 24. That guy sure hasn't had a long and successful career or anything. Ray Allen averaged over 40 minutes in his sophomore season with us. Did anybody think we were running him into the ground? Good players play a lot of minutes, especially in their developmental years.

You can call me foolish but if being the smartest just means being the loudest, I'll happily stay foolish forever.

The question would be how were Paul Pierce, KD, and Ray Allen's minutes distributed. You can play Jabari 40 minutes, I have no issue with that. But the way in which those 40 minutes are distributed could be better and is a legit concern. I'm pretty sure it's not a good idea to just trot out guys for 38 minutes in 40 minute stretches.

[VooDoo7]

^Exactly. Playing almost non-stop for the first 3 quarters is just ridiculous. Come the 4th quarter, guys are beat. No idea how anybody can defend that. It's terrible coaching, period. And then you add in a guy who's coming off an ACL tear, and these being meaningless games, and it becomes even more silly.

And if it happened every now and then, fine. But he's been doing this all too often with Giannis, Jabari and Middleton.

[mke_design]

Jeezy is still relevant

[imithanos]

Ok, I get the Kidd hate, but last night Jabari played the first 8' and then he entered again on the 2nd Q. That was a decent rest (4' playing time -which is more in real time- plus the 2' break between quarters). And then he played in the 3rd Q after the halftime.

So it wasn't that bad. I understand that if we were in the game and wanted him more fit in the 4th Q, the PT distribution would be extremely bad. But we were out of the game pretty early, so his PT distribution last night was ok imo.

[BucksFanSD]

Contrary to most it seems, I'm loving this. Surely everyone else has thought at least one point in the season, "wow, this core looks great but we sure could just use one more star to this mix". It appears it's about to happen. I've seen what I wanted to see from the core. I'm ready to shut it down, add that last star we need in the draft, and make the necessary tweaks to the roster so that it's smooth sailing ahead. Season was a success in terms of the core, now the last piece for this season's success is highest pick obtainable in the draft. I'm excited for this rebuild.

[raferfenix]

Why are people are complaining that Kidd is tanking?

Giannis / Middleton / Jabari already showed what they could do without Monroe and MCW. That is not going away.

Rather adding a better pick to the equation will make more of a difference than a few more games of experience during the part of the season when teams are trying the least.

[Profound23]

If we can lose the next two we might get to 10 in a row.

[breakchains]

Phoenix is a train wreck. If we can manage to lose that one, I'll be impressed.

[Ron Swanson]

"We have 12 games left and we're going to play everybody and we're going to see how guys handle different situations," Kidd said. "We're going to look at different guys from here on out and try to win every game but also see how guys handle different situations."

And tell me again why any of these FA names being bantered around (Delly, Chalmers, Galloway, etc.) provide more than what Ennis has given you the last 10 or so games....

[Chuck Diesel]

Last Bucks game I attended in Milwaukee was the game 6 massacre against the Bulls. Really know how to pick winners. Good to see GAD though!

[LuessiT]

Denver lost versus LAC but SAC is up by 17 at half time. We could make top 7 with a few more losses.