How much more money is there playing in a big market?

[stellation]

With the frantic race to clear space for 2010, and the assumption that if a big market like NY or LA can clear enough then they are a lock to get the big Free Agents because they are the big markets it made me curious- how much more money is there really in playing in a big market? LBJ as the prime example, how much more money will he get from Nike if he plays out of NY instead of out of Ohio?

Particuarly interested in the opinions of Bucks fans since Milwaukee is obviously at the other end of the market size scale.

[jeremyd236]

A lot of it is money, but not all of it. You get a lot more stardom/recognition playing in famous NBA organizations like the Lakers, Celtics, or Knicks. Imagine if Lebron signs with the Knicks...they're going to have absolutely huge posters/billboards of him everywhere. Who doesn't want that?

[stellation]

I guess the thing for me, and obviously it's just pointless, is that Lebron has the talent and the opportunity to make the Cavs a famous NBA organization.

Making an NBA organization great > playing for a great NBA organization

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

For 99% of players there is a difference. Non-stars like Bogut can get regional endorsements with car dealerships, grocery stores, etc, and the ones in NYC can afford to pay more than the ones in Milwaukee. The difference is probably as high as a couple million a year, which would change their total income by 20% or more.

For Lebron in particular though, I don't think there's much of a difference. He's already transcended location and has the world as his market. Same as Tiger Woods and Michael Jordan before him. Doing commercials for local car dealerships might actually hurt his brand value, so they shouldn't have much influence on his decision.

LBJ as the prime example, how much more money will he get from Nike if he plays out of NY instead of out of Ohio?

None I think.

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

A lot of it is money, but not all of it. You get a lot more stardom/recognition playing in famous NBA organizations like the Lakers, Celtics, or Knicks. Imagine if Lebron signs with the Knicks...they're going to have absolutely huge posters/billboards of him everywhere. Who doesn't want that?

How much bigger will they be compared to the huge Lebron billboards that have always been in NYC? Will they cover entire city blocks or something?

[jerrod]

I guess the thing for me, and obviously it's just pointless, is that Lebron has the talent and the opportunity to make the Cavs a famous NBA organization.

Making an NBA organization great > playing for a great NBA organization

the "great" franchises are already set for the most part. the cavs could be great until lebron leaves and then they're just a small market team again. when popovich and duncan leave at the same time what's san antonio going to be?

How much bigger will they be compared to the huge Lebron billboards that have always been in NYC? Will they cover entire city blocks or something?

picture the statue of liberty in a lebron jersey

[paulpressey25]

This is unfortunately the way it works in the NBA.....the super/duper/superstars somehow end up in LA or NY (or Chicago). It happened with Kareem....happened with Shaq.....it will happen with LeBron now after these trades today.

I think LeBron will make more money with his Nike contracts, etc by being in NYC. Think of how hard Nike for example can plaster subway stations with Nike ads with LeBron. And that marketing will carry more since LBJ will be representing the entire NY metro area by virtue of playing with the Knicks.

[drew881]

True. I don't think endorsements have much to do with it. The difference is lifestyle. He can hang out with elite people, go to the top clubs and restaurants etc. in NY or LA, as opposed to Cleveland where he probably can only do this in the offseason when he has time to get on his plane (assuming he has one) and fly there.

[El Duderino]

I guess the thing for me, and obviously it's just pointless, is that Lebron has the talent and the opportunity to make the Cavs a famous NBA organization.

Making an NBA organization great > playing for a great NBA organization

Most great athletes have a huge ego and LeBron surely does

The thought of going to a place like New York that is starving for a winner in basketball has to be very appealing to him because he knows that he'd be treated like a God there. Just imagine if he went to New York and lead the Knicks to a title after all these years of them sucking, he'd own that city and owning Cleveland just isn't like owning New York and Madison Square Garden.

[stellation]

For 99% of players there is a difference. Non-stars like Bogut can get regional endorsements with car dealerships, grocery stores, etc, and the ones in NYC can afford to pay more than the ones in Milwaukee. The difference is probably as high as a couple million a year, which would change their total income by 20% or more.

For Lebron in particular though, I don't think there's much of a difference. He's already transcended location and has the world as his market. Same as Tiger Woods and Michael Jordan before him. Doing commercials for local car dealerships might actually hurt his brand value, so they shouldn't have much influence on his decision.

LBJ as the prime example, how much more money will he get from Nike if he plays out of NY instead of out of Ohio?

None I think.

That's exactly what I was thinking, Adam. I can see the majority of players wanting to go there for the reasons you stated- but I just can't see that someone like Lebron is going to get more from his major sponsors, or will have much room to take on many more sponsors.

I definitely get the prestige thing, though.

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

This is unfortunately the way it works in the NBA.....the super/duper/superstars somehow end up in LA or NY (or Chicago). It happened with Kareem....happened with Shaq.....it will happen with LeBron now after these trades today.

I think LeBron will make more money with his Nike contracts, etc by being in NYC. Think of how hard Nike for example can plaster subway stations with Nike ads with LeBron. And that marketing will carry more since LBJ will be representing the entire NY metro area by virtue of playing with the Knicks.

But Nike already does fantastic business in NYC, and Lebron is already hugely popular there. People line up in the streets for limited edition Lebron sneakers. There are Lebron subway ads. I'm having trouble picturing the increased business that would make it worth Nike's cash to up the ante for Lebron. I own a billionth of a percent of Nike's stock or something like that, so believe me I want whatever is best for Nike, but honestly, I think the market that we want Lebron to dominate is abroad.

[JoeHova]

If LeBron wasn't such a bandwagon guy (seriously, whose favorite teams are the Cowboys, Yankees, Seminoles and Bulls?), I would say that NY wouldn't have much chance of getting him because of the home state angle, the $30 million more the Cavs can offer, and the fact that (as adam mentioned) LeBron has already transcended location in terms of marketing power. Because he doesn't seem to have much Ohio sports loyalty though, who knows?

Also, what big free agents have signed with NY lately? Allan Houston? I must have missed the legends all lining up to sign with the Knicks for less money.

[andonewheel]

I don't agree with the argument that Lebron has transcended location. Look how big Kobe is playing in LA. Shaq was a bigger story playing in LA than in Orlando or Miami. Same thing with A-Rod and the Yankees and every other example like that. New York City is the capitol of the world and unfortunately where I expect Lebron to end up.

[JoeHova]

I don't agree with the argument that Lebron has transcended location. Look how big Kobe is playing in LA. Shaq was a bigger story playing in LA than in Orlando or Miami. Same thing with A-Rod and the Yankees and every other example like that. New York City is the capitol of the world and unfortunately where I expect Lebron to end up.

According to http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/more/specials/fortunate50/2008/ that article, LeBron already makes twice what Kobe makes in endorsements (probably somewhat impacted by Kobe's rape charge) and 5 times what A-Rod gets. He makes twice what Shaq gets and more than twice what D-Wade gets and 3 times what KG gets.

That seems like evidence that he has transcended location.

[MetroDrugUnit]

LeBron will make more money in the long run in NY then in Cleveland even though the max offer will be somewhere around 40 Million less due to NBA rules giving players incentive to resign with their team. NY is the is in the top 5 Media markets in the world were money and exposure are endless. When's the last time something cool happened in Cleveland? the Eagle's being Elected to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame doesn't count. LeBron is already a global figure and is a brand within himself, sorry Cleveland but ya got no chance. Tough to compete with the glit and glam of NYC where you can kick it with Jay Z and his hot ass wife when your city is the belt buckle of the Rust Belt

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

I don't agree with the argument that Lebron has transcended location. Look how big Kobe is playing in LA. Shaq was a bigger story playing in LA than in Orlando or Miami. Same thing with A-Rod and the Yankees and every other example like that. New York City is the capitol of the world and unfortunately where I expect Lebron to end up.

Lebron's already bigger than every one of those guys. His only peers are Tiger Woods and Michael Jordan.

[El Duderino]

I don't agree with the argument that Lebron has transcended location. Look how big Kobe is playing in LA. Shaq was a bigger story playing in LA than in Orlando or Miami. Same thing with A-Rod and the Yankees and every other example like that. New York City is the capitol of the world and unfortunately where I expect Lebron to end up.

According to http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/more/specials/fortunate50/2008/ that article, LeBron already makes twice what Kobe makes in endorsements (probably somewhat impacted by Kobe's rape charge) and 5 times what A-Rod gets. He makes twice what Shaq gets and more than twice what D-Wade gets and 3 times what KG gets.

That seems like evidence that he has transcended location.

James has financially, but put him in New York and thus the Knicks start winning, he becomes a God to the sports following masses and celebrities in the most important city in America. If he chooses the Knicks, IMO, it will be as much or more for him wanting to play in the limelight of New York city and Madison Square Garden than it will be about bigger endorsements. Some big time athletes just crave the bigger attention that comes from playing in a huge media market and none are bigger than New York.

None of us know James though, so we can only speculate just how much he desires to play and live in larger limelight. Some athletes crave and thrive in that fishbowl lifestyle that NY brings with it, while others prefer the quieter life that smaller cities allow for.

[mg]

If our economy keeps going south I wonder how much extra money a Nike or any other corporation could dish out to LeBron if he relocated to NYC. Not to be an alarmist but alot of companies will be out of business by 2010 and the remaining ones have already begun to cut back on advertising. LeBron has already made it clear he wants to be a billionaire athlete so don't see him leaving the extra dough on the table to sign with another team even the Knicks. Regardless we'll have to listen to the LeBron to NYC talk the next few years.

[LISTEN2JAZZ]

http://www.cnbc.com/id/27925375/site/14 ... &par=yahoo

This article destroys the NY bonus myth.

[InsideOut]

If LeBron wasn't such a bandwagon guy (seriously, whose favorite teams are the Cowboys, Yankees, Seminoles and Bulls?), I would say that NY wouldn't have much chance of getting him because of the home state angle, the $30 million more the Cavs can offer, and the fact that (as adam mentioned) LeBron has already transcended location in terms of marketing power. Because he doesn't seem to have much Ohio sports loyalty though, who knows?

Also, what big free agents have signed with NY lately? Allan Houston? I must have missed the legends all lining up to sign with the Knicks for less money.

The reason is because they had Isiah running the team so they've sucked and more importantly have been over the cap for over a decade now. The true test will be in 2yrs when they will have cap space for the first time in a while.