Bucks/Hawks - 1/23

[jokeboy86]

As far as the Dallas game, sometimes teams just take nights off because on National tv they're putting a beating on Detroit. Don't look now but Conley is actually having a good game so it looks like that thread and this trade talk will continue for another week.

I'm starting to worry can we hold off teams like NJ, Chi, and even teams like NY and Cha if they get on a run. It looks like its going to be even harder now with Bogut basically playing at 75% for the rest of the year.

[steger_3434]

Flip giving the Bucks a big F U

That was the trade that killed the Bucks and continues to kill the Bucks. We basically rented GP and then gave the keys to Redd. The rest is history.

Ray, Flip, and a pick (Ridnour?)

for

GP and Dez

[steger_3434]

There can't be more than 35 people still watching this game. The Bucks owe us tickets, 2 medium pizzas and $59.

[Buck You]

Pizzas from Dominos.

[jerrod]

chubbly bubbly indeed

[GrandAdmiralDan]

Flip giving the Bucks a big F U

That was the trade that killed the Bucks and continues to kill the Bucks. We basically rented GP and then gave the keys to Redd. The rest is history.

Ray, Flip, and a pick (Ridnour?)

for

GP and Dez

It isn't that simple.
Ray Allen was NOT getting it done for us, in some ways (please pay attention to my exact words there, people) similar to how Redd is not getting it done for us now.

We weren't going anywhere with that team.
That trade had two ways of working.

1) Gary Payton fits in well with the team and gets us back on the right track winning wise (either alongside Sam Cassell or we use Cassell in a trade for a different player). Desmond Mason pans out and ends up being a nice addition to that deal. We re-sign Payton to a reasonable contract. We save significant money in this deal compared to our payroll and lux tax situation prior to the trade

2) Payton doesn't re-sign here and completes a financial savings for us that when all is said and done saves Kohl about ~$39 mil once all lux tax implications are accounted for.

#1 didn't happen, but #2 did.

If we hadn't made a trade like that, if the Bucks had continued to flounder in mediocrity with Ray Allen still on the roster (as we were that season PRIOR to the trade already), Kohl would have taken another bath as far as the money he'd lose on the team, which could have been the straw that broke the camel's back as far as his decision on whether or not to sell the team. As it was he BARELY pulled back from selling to Jordan. Take another $39 mil out of his pocket before he makes that decision? I think that would have pushed him into selling. Now, I'm no fan of Kohl's ownership tenure here at all, so perhaps that would have been a GOOD thing for the Bucks.

I was suspicious of that Jordan ownership group though, as far as them moving the team.

Anyway, you really have to consider all of that when talking about the Ray Allen trade. You HAVE to consider the financial side, just as you do when you talk about the upside to trading Redd and/or RJ.

I understand Ray Allen ended up having a career resurgence, but at that time things didn't seem so rosy. If you want to look at the more haunting "could have been" with Ray Allen and the Bucks, if Redd had signed with the Cavs in the 2005 offseason, we would have signed Ray Allen instead of Redd (and also instead of Simmons, since Allen didn't have that low cap hold advantage that Redd had).