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Rubio Thread Seis (VI)

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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1681 » by Ashwinz. » Mon Sep 1, 2014 6:47 am

Feilong wrote:There is a difference between being critical and being hateful.
There 2-3 posters here that all they do is hate players. From Rubio to Pek, from Martin to Brewer, from Barea to Young etc etc. Almost the entire roster.
And why should i care about what an ESPN writer thinks?
I am critical also about Rubio's shooting skills and lack of improvement but i don't write nonsense like he is a huge liability on offense when every stat say the opposite.


I mean, why should you care what TakingBaconBack writes if you follow that logic?

Rubio's had the fortune to play with some great Shooting Bigs and has been able to hide his deficiencies so far in his professional Career. Let's see what he can do when he has the Key to this Engine.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1682 » by AussieBuck » Mon Sep 1, 2014 9:12 am

If Rubio's a huge liability on offense the other 4 starters last season must have been the best 4 guys of all time. :-?
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1683 » by AussieBuck » Mon Sep 1, 2014 9:19 am

114.1 points per 100 possessions with a huge liability at PG. For reference the highest mark Nash's GOAT offense Suns reached over a season was 115.3 Yeah that's going to be a tough argument to make that's going to involve a lot of talking up of the other guys on court with Rubio.
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We need a man shaped like a chicken nugget with the shot selection of a 21st birthday party.


GHOSTofSIKMA wrote:
if you combined jabari parker, royal ivey, a shrimp and a ball sack youd have javon carter
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1684 » by Nitroglycerin » Mon Sep 1, 2014 9:32 am

i think when the defense backs down,the opponent doesnt only give shooting space,but passing space
Especially now with the roster. Give him space and he'll just throw/lob it to Wiggins or Young
so I dont think he's that big of a liability. Opponents are still aware of what he can do
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1685 » by YaleS » Mon Sep 1, 2014 11:08 am

OFC Rubio is not liability on O, but it`s also true that he is limited, thusfar people can sack off him and that affects the other aspects of his game. Since 2 years I`ve been saying he`s not worth max contract, but that doesn`t mean he`s useless and we don`t need him. The only progression I see Rubio can make is being way more agressive and drawing more fouls, don`t think he`ll ever develop his jumper, it`s just the way things are - some people will not learn certant skills.
Still believe that Rubio is the right guy for us moving forward, cuz he can keep guys involved and give them gimmies, wich is important. I will be happy with a long term deal - 5 yr/ 10 per.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1686 » by urinesane » Mon Sep 1, 2014 8:19 pm

Ashwinz. wrote:
Feilong wrote:There is a difference between being critical and being hateful.
There 2-3 posters here that all they do is hate players. From Rubio to Pek, from Martin to Brewer, from Barea to Young etc etc. Almost the entire roster.
And why should i care about what an ESPN writer thinks?
I am critical also about Rubio's shooting skills and lack of improvement but i don't write nonsense like he is a huge liability on offense when every stat say the opposite.


I mean, why should you care what TakingBaconBack writes if you follow that logic?

Rubio's had the fortune to play with some great Shooting Bigs and has been able to hide his deficiencies so far in his professional Career. Let's see what he can do when he has the Key to this Engine.


Outside of Love (which he hasn't actually played that much with outside of last season) and Martin.

He has been surrounded by historically bad shooters. Rondo had shooting around him in Boston, which is why his offense wasn't nitpicked as much, Rubio has had very few capable shooters around him his entire time in MN.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1687 » by Takingbaconback » Tue Sep 2, 2014 8:51 am

Feilong wrote:There is a difference between being critical and being hateful.
There 2-3 posters here that all they do is hate players. From Rubio to Pek, from Martin to Brewer, from Barea to Young etc etc. Almost the entire roster.
And why should i care about what an ESPN writer thinks?
I am critical also about Rubio's shooting skills and lack of improvement but i don't write nonsense like he is a huge liability on offense when every stat say the opposite.


How do I "hate" on rubio's offense when he cant shoot or score anywhere for that matter? To act like his passing makes up for the fact that he is one of the worst backcourt shooters in the NBA is just homerism. I like most of the players on the roster even barea who I think has truly been given the short stick unlike rubio who had martin/love/pek in the lineup last year. He got two very good shooters and one of the best offensive big man in the league (2 fantastic matchup nightmares) and he struggled despite a few ooh ah moments in a game.

Dont be spiteful because your darling is getting picked apart for the single most important ability in basketball. Fact is this team going forward doesnt need him if he doesnt improve and wants some big contract. I'm sorry if I actually root for the best for this team (salary cap) and not individual players. Seems like that ak47 situation again with people clinging to players and willing to throw ridiculous money, and justifying with arbitrary stats that are blatantly misleading like how many points wolves gave up with him or without him. I dont care about rubio's extrapolated "production" for this team either getting 107 points or whatever it is. Without being able to score he will always be a poor offensive player.

http://mweb.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-ba ... n?v=1&vc=3

However, this is a new era for the Wolves and Flip Saunders doesn't have any need to keep Rubio as one of the faces of the franchise.


Zach Harper's piece about the situation, hes probably just a hater of rubio too. Really good point about comparing cp3 to rubio. Could compare him to magic, pistol, stockton, nash, and rubio puts up relatively similar numbers except for the fact that he cant score inside or shoot perimeter shots. Yes, it is that important to be able to get points in basketball; everything else can be there but just the lack of that one ability makes it night&day when you compare the effectiveness, efficiency, and consistency of those dudes.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1688 » by Takingbaconback » Tue Sep 2, 2014 9:22 am

urinesane wrote:
Ashwinz. wrote:
Feilong wrote:There is a difference between being critical and being hateful.
There 2-3 posters here that all they do is hate players. From Rubio to Pek, from Martin to Brewer, from Barea to Young etc etc. Almost the entire roster.
And why should i care about what an ESPN writer thinks?
I am critical also about Rubio's shooting skills and lack of improvement but i don't write nonsense like he is a huge liability on offense when every stat say the opposite.


I mean, why should you care what TakingBaconBack writes if you follow that logic?

Rubio's had the fortune to play with some great Shooting Bigs and has been able to hide his deficiencies so far in his professional Career. Let's see what he can do when he has the Key to this Engine.


Outside of Love (which he hasn't actually played that much with outside of last season) and Martin.

He has been surrounded by historically bad shooters. Rondo had shooting around him in Boston, which is why his offense wasn't nitpicked as much, Rubio has had very few capable shooters around him his entire time in MN.


How much of that is self inflicted? He cant shoot so teams dont have to worry about one of two backcourt players. If wolves had a scoring pg that could pass like lillard or lawson, dont you think martin, love, and shooters would benefit from that. Yeah rubio gets them couple wide open looks per game but big picture, it seems like having another offensive threat would help them more and be a lot more consistent and less dependent on one guy trying to make a play all the time for others.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1689 » by Sugarless » Tue Sep 2, 2014 9:44 am

Yep, you're clearly not hating.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1690 » by YaleS » Tue Sep 2, 2014 11:35 am

Takingbaconback wrote:
urinesane wrote:
Ashwinz. wrote:
I mean, why should you care what TakingBaconBack writes if you follow that logic?

Rubio's had the fortune to play with some great Shooting Bigs and has been able to hide his deficiencies so far in his professional Career. Let's see what he can do when he has the Key to this Engine.


Outside of Love (which he hasn't actually played that much with outside of last season) and Martin.

He has been surrounded by historically bad shooters. Rondo had shooting around him in Boston, which is why his offense wasn't nitpicked as much, Rubio has had very few capable shooters around him his entire time in MN.


How much of that is self inflicted? He cant shoot so teams dont have to worry about one of two backcourt players. If wolves had a scoring pg that could pass like lillard or lawson, dont you think martin, love, and shooters would benefit from that. Yeah rubio gets them couple wide open looks per game but big picture, it seems like having another offensive threat would help them more and be a lot more consistent and less dependent on one guy trying to make a play all the time for others.


I agree to some extend, but our starting 5 didn`t have any problem scoring points, that was not the problem, so I don`t think you can blame this on Rub.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1691 » by cojayar » Tue Sep 2, 2014 11:35 am

Who pissed on my bacon?
Now it tastes sour.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1692 » by Worm Guts » Tue Sep 2, 2014 12:25 pm

There's a reason people use plus/minus stats. Obviously Rubio is a terrible shooter but he's also really good at a lot of other things. When you look the plus/minus stats it tells you the positives outweigh the negatives.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1693 » by Viljanen » Tue Sep 2, 2014 1:34 pm

Worm Guts wrote:There's a reason people use plus/minus stats. Obviously Rubio is a terrible shooter but he's also really good at a lot of other things. When you look the plus/minus stats it tells you the positives outweigh the negatives.


Na…, don´t insist... some people just don´t want to get it.

We have many of those here in Spain too. A lot (majority I´d say) saying Sergio Rodríguez or Calderon are much better than Rubio and should start in the NT instead.

The eye test has tendency to focus only on made buckets. A good pass (not necessarily an assist), moving the ball to the right place, taking advantage here and there, avoiding a rival´s pass by being disruptive, forcing a fault, contesting a shot... those things mean much less than a made long two bucket for many basketball fans. They just don´t pay attention to those things. Here in the US you guys are lucky to have such incredible quantity of recorded data and people calculating stats like the Roster Adjusted Plus Minus (awesome one) but, even having that handy, to check, people will prefer to ignore reality and just focus on the surface.

On the other hand, I guess there is no problem with that… As long as everybody enjoys watching the game, that should be it. I enjoy watching Rubio, if somebody prefers OJ Mayo, that´s perfect. Now, how much is worth Ricky? I´d say that somebody is going to offer the max for him, just because he is very young and already playing at a great level. With just a small improvement he is a top 5 PG in the league (defense counts) and that´s worth a max contract at his age. Should the Wolves match? Sure.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1694 » by NewWolvesOrder » Tue Sep 2, 2014 2:23 pm

Takingbaconback wrote:
Feilong wrote:There is a difference between being critical and being hateful.
There 2-3 posters here that all they do is hate players. From Rubio to Pek, from Martin to Brewer, from Barea to Young etc etc. Almost the entire roster.
And why should i care about what an ESPN writer thinks?
I am critical also about Rubio's shooting skills and lack of improvement but i don't write nonsense like he is a huge liability on offense when every stat say the opposite.


How do I "hate" on rubio's offense when he cant shoot or score anywhere for that matter? To act like his passing makes up for the fact that he is one of the worst backcourt shooters in the NBA is just homerism. I like most of the players on the roster even barea who I think has truly been given the short stick unlike rubio who had martin/love/pek in the lineup last year. He got two very good shooters and one of the best offensive big man in the league (2 fantastic matchup nightmares) and he struggled despite a few ooh ah moments in a game.

Dont be spiteful because your darling is getting picked apart for the single most important ability in basketball. Fact is this team going forward doesnt need him if he doesnt improve and wants some big contract. I'm sorry if I actually root for the best for this team (salary cap) and not individual players. Seems like that ak47 situation again with people clinging to players and willing to throw ridiculous money, and justifying with arbitrary stats that are blatantly misleading like how many points wolves gave up with him or without him. I dont care about rubio's extrapolated "production" for this team either getting 107 points or whatever it is. Without being able to score he will always be a poor offensive player.

http://mweb.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-ba ... n?v=1&vc=3

However, this is a new era for the Wolves and Flip Saunders doesn't have any need to keep Rubio as one of the faces of the franchise.


Zach Harper's piece about the situation, hes probably just a hater of rubio too. Really good point about comparing cp3 to rubio. Could compare him to magic, pistol, stockton, nash, and rubio puts up relatively similar numbers except for the fact that he cant score inside or shoot perimeter shots. Yes, it is that important to be able to get points in basketball; everything else can be there but just the lack of that one ability makes it night&day when you compare the effectiveness, efficiency, and consistency of those dudes.



You are the most hateful poster on this board. You went on most hateful rants about Shved this summer. Now you switched on Rubio. If Flips gives him a big contract it will be bad for your health.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1695 » by Sugarless » Tue Sep 2, 2014 2:48 pm

Turnover_21 wrote:You are the most hateful poster on this board. You went on most hateful rants about Shved this summer. Now you switched on Rubio. If Flips gives him a big contract it will be bad for your health.

You can add Thad to that list.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1696 » by NewWolvesOrder » Tue Sep 2, 2014 3:16 pm

Sugarless wrote:
Turnover_21 wrote:You are the most hateful poster on this board. You went on most hateful rants about Shved this summer. Now you switched on Rubio. If Flips gives him a big contract it will be bad for your health.

You can add Thad to that list.


lol, forgot about that one :lol:
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1697 » by urinesane » Tue Sep 2, 2014 6:25 pm

Takingbaconback wrote:
urinesane wrote:
Ashwinz. wrote:
I mean, why should you care what TakingBaconBack writes if you follow that logic?

Rubio's had the fortune to play with some great Shooting Bigs and has been able to hide his deficiencies so far in his professional Career. Let's see what he can do when he has the Key to this Engine.


Outside of Love (which he hasn't actually played that much with outside of last season) and Martin.

He has been surrounded by historically bad shooters. Rondo had shooting around him in Boston, which is why his offense wasn't nitpicked as much, Rubio has had very few capable shooters around him his entire time in MN.


How much of that is self inflicted? He cant shoot so teams dont have to worry about one of two backcourt players. If wolves had a scoring pg that could pass like lillard or lawson, dont you think martin, love, and shooters would benefit from that. Yeah rubio gets them couple wide open looks per game but big picture, it seems like having another offensive threat would help them more and be a lot more consistent and less dependent on one guy trying to make a play all the time for others.


Look at how you could only list Love/Martin and then had to put "and shooters". Those are the only shooters Rubio has had with him since he got to MN and last year was the first year Rubio had a decent amount of playing time with them.

Who are all these other shooters Rubio has had around him? Having 2 guys that can hit open shots is a major issue that has nothing to do with Rubio's ability to shoot.

Watch the actual games, Rubio gets guys open shots often throughout games, but having guys like Wes Johnson, DWill, Trolliver, Martell Webster, Brandon Roy, etc does not help Rubio at all.

If Rubio had actual shooters around him that could hit open shots or amazingly a contested shot once in a while (outside of Love and Martin) he would average over 10 assists per game.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1698 » by urinesane » Tue Sep 2, 2014 6:27 pm

Takingbaconback wrote:
urinesane wrote:
Ashwinz. wrote:
I mean, why should you care what TakingBaconBack writes if you follow that logic?

Rubio's had the fortune to play with some great Shooting Bigs and has been able to hide his deficiencies so far in his professional Career. Let's see what he can do when he has the Key to this Engine.


Outside of Love (which he hasn't actually played that much with outside of last season) and Martin.

He has been surrounded by historically bad shooters. Rondo had shooting around him in Boston, which is why his offense wasn't nitpicked as much, Rubio has had very few capable shooters around him his entire time in MN.


How much of that is self inflicted? He cant shoot so teams dont have to worry about one of two backcourt players. If wolves had a scoring pg that could pass like lillard or lawson, dont you think martin, love, and shooters would benefit from that. Yeah rubio gets them couple wide open looks per game but big picture, it seems like having another offensive threat would help them more and be a lot more consistent and less dependent on one guy trying to make a play all the time for others.


Look at how you could only list Love/Martin and then had to put "and shooters". Those are the only shooters Rubio has had with him since he got to MN and last year was the first year Rubio had a decent amount of playing time with them (and despite Rubio's issues they had a top offense with one of the worst benches in the league).

Who are all these other shooters Rubio has had around him? Only having 2 guys that can hit open shots is a major issue that has nothing to do with Rubio's ability to shoot.

Watch the actual games, Rubio gets guys open shots often throughout games, but having guys like Wes Johnson, DWill, Trolliver, Martell Webster, Brandon Roy, etc does not help Rubio at all.

If Rubio had actual shooters around him that could hit open shots or amazingly a contested shot once in a while (outside of Love and Martin) he would average over 10 assists per game.

Also Takingbaconback is clearly just a negative cynical person (like many Wolves fans). Everyone can feel free to ignore him, he will always find something to b*tch about. You won't miss anything important.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1699 » by kmgarnett21 » Tue Sep 2, 2014 6:43 pm

Screw the haters and doubters. I think Rubio will flourish this year. IMO, Adelman was handcuffing Rubio's strengths and Rubio was having to play in a system that put his flaws at the forefront.

Let Rubio get up and down the court, use his creative abilities and run the offense through him (to an extent). The best we've seen of Rubio in the NBA was his rookie season, when he was playing HIS game and throwing lobs to and getting easy looks for Williams, Randolph and Wes, and making something out of nothing.

Rondo took a lot of heat for not being able to shoot his first few years. Prior to his injury, he was able to show he could score. Why not give Rubio the same benefit of the doubt and let his game mature and evolve? He'll never be a great outside shooter, but he's also never played under a coach who knows how to use him properly.
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Re: Rubio Thread Seis (VI) 

Post#1700 » by urinesane » Tue Sep 2, 2014 7:13 pm

kmgarnett21 wrote:Screw the haters and doubters. I think Rubio will flourish this year. IMO, Adelman was handcuffing Rubio's strengths and Rubio was having to play in a system that put his flaws at the forefront.

Let Rubio get up and down the court, use his creative abilities and run the offense through him (to an extent). The best we've seen of Rubio in the NBA was his rookie season, when he was playing HIS game and throwing lobs to and getting easy looks for Williams, Randolph and Wes, and making something out of nothing.

Rondo took a lot of heat for not being able to shoot his first few years. Prior to his injury, he was able to show he could score. Why not give Rubio the same benefit of the doubt and let his game mature and evolve? He'll never be a great outside shooter, but he's also never played under a coach who knows how to use him properly.


That is exactly how I view it.

Rock on sir.
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