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Derrick Williams: Time to Move On?

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Derrick Williams: Stay or Go?

He didn't pan out and it's time to get value back while we can.
77
58%
Keep him! Only letting him go in the perfect deal.
55
42%
 
Total votes: 132

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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#341 » by Calinks » Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:10 am

Question.

Derrick Williams or Marvin Williams? Who would you rather have?
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#342 » by C.lupus » Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:15 pm

So if you take Love out of that ridiculous "rumor" on the Celtics board, the remaining pieces are intriguing. What do you guys think of something based on Williams for Lee and Sully? We'd have to add somebody else, maybe Malcolm, or get a third team involved but I don't hate the idea.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#343 » by shrink » Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:40 pm

C.lupus wrote:So if you take Love out of that ridiculous "rumor" on the Celtics board, the remaining pieces are intriguing. What do you guys think of something based on Williams for Lee and Sully? We'd have to add somebody else, maybe Malcolm, or get a third team involved but I don't hate the idea.


For me, it's a lot of crossing your fingers on Lee. He is not producing the numbers he was last year (6.2 vs 11.4 PPG), and the long, 4-year contract scares me a lot. Curse you for making me like this, Troy Hudson! People disagree with me on the Trade Board, but I don't think that Lee has positive trade value, and Williams has got to be worth more than Fab Melo.

I agree with you that they are intiguing, since both players are nice fits here. I might build a package around Ridnour or Barea for that price, but I'm not a fan of using Derrick Williams that way. Besides - they'd still have Jeff Green in front of DW.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#344 » by C.lupus » Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:50 pm

I understand the hesitance with Lee. Looking at his stats, though, the only thing that is really down significantly this year is his 3 pt shooting. It could very well just be a system thing. You could look at it this way, too: He looked better under Adelman than under Rivers. It is a risk, though.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#345 » by Dewey » Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:03 pm

shrink wrote:
C.lupus wrote:So if you take Love out of that ridiculous "rumor" on the Celtics board, the remaining pieces are intriguing. What do you guys think of something based on Williams for Lee and Sully? We'd have to add somebody else, maybe Malcolm, or get a third team involved but I don't hate the idea.


For me, it's a lot of crossing your fingers on Lee. He is not producing the numbers he was last year (6.2 vs 11.4 PPG), and the long, 4-year contract scares me a lot. Curse you for making me like this, Troy Hudson! People disagree with me on the Trade Board, but I don't think that Lee has positive trade value, and Williams has got to be worth more than Fab Melo.

I agree with you that they are intiguing, since both players are nice fits here. I might build a package around Ridnour or Barea for that price, but I'm not a fan of using Derrick Williams that way. Besides - they'd still have Jeff Green in front of DW.


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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#346 » by shrink » Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:46 pm

Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#347 » by theGreatRC » Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:34 pm

shrink wrote:Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.


Yes! Thank you. JJ is not 100% going to be here and getting Bud, JJ and Pek back to nice contracts is far fetched.

I'd rather we try to trade for Afflalo (As does everyone here) or Courtney Lee
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#348 » by Klomp » Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:43 pm

I'd rather we do nothing. Yes, nothing.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#349 » by Worm Guts » Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:56 pm

shrink wrote:Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.


You must be fairly confident then that Williams isn't going to go down the path Wesley Johnson and Jonny Flynn. At least more confident than I am.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#350 » by Esohny » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:06 pm

shrink wrote:Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.


The money that wouldn't be paid to Williams would take care of the bulk of Redick's salary. If Roy comes off the books like everyone is confident he will, I don't see the issue with resigning all 3 guys. Barea/Ridnour could be traded as well to free up money if necessary. I certainly don't see adding a very good NBA player who also happens to fit both Adelman's system and the roster needs perfectly as wasting Williams; quite the opposite in fact.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#351 » by AQuintus » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:09 pm

shrink wrote:Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.


Williams is going to be paid $5 million next year. As good as Redick is, I kind of doubt that he'll get paid much, if any, more than that. So, depending on the Bird rights situation, I don't think we'd have any more problem bringing back Redick, Budinger, and Pekovic than we would have bringing back Budinger and Pekovic with Williams on the books.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#352 » by theGreatRC » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:12 pm

Klomp wrote:I'd rather we do nothing. Yes, nothing.



You're still riding that high from last nights win, i'll let you come back down to earth before giving you the -> :o
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#353 » by C.lupus » Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:50 pm

I doubt Redick commands the $8m that Afflalo would be paid so it would probably be easier to resign Pek and Bud with Redick. We have to pay somebody to play the 2.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#354 » by LordBaldric » Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:38 pm

shrink wrote:Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.


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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#355 » by cube » Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:05 pm

Why the hell would you want to trade for Redick??? I get it, he's a great shooter but he can't do much more. He is not going to fix our defensive problems at SG and is going to get a nice payday.
The player I would go after is Dudley, good defender on a great contract and is able to shoot the 3. Imo he's the ideal fit for this team. While im not sure I would like to trade Derrick straight up for him, there is also no point of keeping him rotting on the bench.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#356 » by shrink » Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:17 pm

Worm Guts wrote:
shrink wrote:Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.


You must be fairly confident then that Williams isn't going to go down the path Wesley Johnson and Jonny Flynn. At least more confident than I am.


It doesn't matter. At this point, no one knows if Williams will succeed ro fail, and in that hope, he still has trade value greater than a useful expiring.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#357 » by shrink » Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:23 pm

AQuintus wrote:Williams is going to be paid $5 million next year. As good as Redick is, I kind of doubt that he'll get paid much, if any, more than that. So, depending on the Bird rights situation, I don't think we'd have any more problem bringing back Redick, Budinger, and Pekovic than we would have bringing back Budinger and Pekovic with Williams on the books.


If you believe this, then you definitely shouldn't want us to trade for Redick.

I'm not saying that we're never trading Williams. He might be off the books next year, and he might not. However, trading him for Redick simply means we are getting him for the rest of this season, and have the right to match any offer at $5 mil. We don't have anyone lined up for the MLE, so if we traded Williams elsewhere - say for an expiring and a cheap prospect or pick, then next year we could have that value PLUS Redick with the MLE.

If we use Williams to fill the SG spot, you need to get a fix for more than just the last 60 games - he needs to be a 2-year deal at least. Moreover, I'd suspect we'd be sending him out attached to one of our back-up PG's or Roy for a more expensive, better player.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#358 » by Klomp » Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:29 am

theGreatRC wrote:
Klomp wrote:I'd rather we do nothing. Yes, nothing.



You're still riding that high from last nights win, i'll let you come back down to earth before giving you the -> :o

Actually, I've been thinking this for a while, ever since my initial trade push for Pau. I've backed off on that, and would rather wait for any moves until the offseason. There's no reason to rush into a trade.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#359 » by Worm Guts » Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:36 am

shrink wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
shrink wrote:Our desperate need for a SG has me concerned that the win-now wolves will waste Derrick Williams on JJ Redick.

Redick would be a great fit with Adelman of course, but he's an expiring, and we would struggle to sign both he and Buddinger (and Pek, of course) next year. If the choice is DW or potentially only 60 games of Redick, I hope we keep Williams.


You must be fairly confident then that Williams isn't going to go down the path Wesley Johnson and Jonny Flynn. At least more confident than I am.


It doesn't matter. At this point, no one knows if Williams will succeed ro fail, and in that hope, he still has trade value greater than a useful expiring.


It does matter if you choose to hold on to him. Getting a useful SG, even for just half a season, is more beneficial than just waiting until his value falls to nothing.
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Re: Derrick Williams: Time to Move On? 

Post#360 » by shrink » Sat Dec 22, 2012 3:17 am

Worm Guts wrote:
shrink wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:You must be fairly confident then that Williams isn't going to go down the path Wesley Johnson and Jonny Flynn. At least more confident than I am.


It doesn't matter. At this point, no one knows if Williams will succeed ro fail, and in that hope, he still has trade value greater than a useful expiring.


It does matter if you choose to hold on to him. Getting a useful SG, even for just half a season, is more beneficial than just waiting until his value falls to nothing.


Maybe I should rephrase for clarity.

I don't have to be confident that Williams is not going to fail to say no to trading him for Redick's expiring. I just have to be confident that one of the other 29 GMs would offer a better deal than this -- and of that, I'm pretty dang confident.
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