A petition for the firing Billy King (please help us)

[Net Sentence]

Pierce should have never dropped that far because he was a beast during his last year at Kansas, the only other wing player I would have taken over him was Vince Carter.

You can definitely fault King for taking Hughes over PP, i think PP's main knock was his lack of athleticism but you could tell the guy was a legit shooter and scorer with good size, Hughes was drafted strictly based off of potential.

Pierce was a 3 year player and 22 coming out of the draft. he was also said to be a tweener and there were questions on if he could gaurd wings in the NBA.

Larry hughes was just a 1 year player in college... and he was an absolute phenom his 1 year at st. louis. crazy athleticism, ball handling and had a huge ceiling.

i dont think it was a bad pick with hughes over pierce. hindsight makes it look alot worse but its always tough going with an older college guy who isnt super athletic over a freshman college player with unreal athleticism and an a high ceiling.

you could say its a mistake not to take pierce over hughes, but that same logic could be applied to say taking kerry kittles over kobe bryant

Besides the fact Pierce had red flags regarding his off the court lifestyle. It took nearly getting stabbed to death for him to turn his life around.

[MrDollarBills]

Pierce was also dropping 20 a game though. I had thought teams were crazy to pass on him then and I still do now. He was way more skilled than Hughes at that age despite the potential.

The only reason Kittles got picked over Bryant is because of collusion between the Lakers and Bryant. The Nets wanted Bryant badly but were scared off.

[MrDollarBills]

Pierce should have never dropped that far because he was a beast during his last year at Kansas, the only other wing player I would have taken over him was Vince Carter.

You can definitely fault King for taking Hughes over PP, i think PP's main knock was his lack of athleticism but you could tell the guy was a legit shooter and scorer with good size, Hughes was drafted strictly based off of potential.

Pierce was a 3 year player and 22 coming out of the draft. he was also said to be a tweener and there were questions on if he could gaurd wings in the NBA.

Larry hughes was just a 1 year player in college... and he was an absolute phenom his 1 year at st. louis. crazy athleticism, ball handling and had a huge ceiling.

i dont think it was a bad pick with hughes over pierce. hindsight makes it look alot worse but its always tough going with an older college guy who isnt super athletic over a freshman college player with unreal athleticism and an a high ceiling.

you could say its a mistake not to take pierce over hughes, but that same logic could be applied to say taking kerry kittles over kobe bryant

Besides the fact Pierce had red flags regarding his off the court lifestyle. It took nearly getting stabbed to death for him to turn his life around.

Oh yeah, i forgot about that part. I think he was gang affiliated or something.

[King_Supreme]

I feel terrible for you guys. I've been there with Billy King since I'm a 6ers fan. I saw him back out on a deal that would have sent Larry Hughes to Toronto for McGrady.

We could of had IVERSON & MCGRADY on the same team in their prime god damnit.

I saw him sign mediocre players to monster contracts which scewed us for the long term, I saw him trade away draft picks and never once trading for meaningful draft picks.

--------

So my question, what exactly can the Nets do going forward to get them out of this situation? Is it simply a waiting game?

Didn't know about the possible deal for McGrady. Failing to do that trade and picking Larry Hughes over the next two guys selected, Dirk and Pierce. That must be frustrating as a fan.

I think there's only two real options:
1. overpay young talent that we hope grows into their contract. Example would be Harrison Barnes. He's young, a great shooter, a good athlete. The Warriors might not be willing to match a huge offer for him. He cannot effectively create his own shots, some have questioned his drive - can he really reach that next level. It would be a gamble hoping he can take that next step.

2. Short-term contracts until we can hit reset in 2019. The model would be some of the contracts the Knicks handed out this summer like the Afflalo deal. We could target Eric Gordon on a 1-2 year deal over market value. Keeps cap flexibility going forward and raises the floor so we're not giving away top picks to the C's.

The only thing though is that damn near every team will have cap space, so getting a Harrison Barnes or short overpays(Gordon; Courtney Lee, Brandon Jennings, etc) will be tough. I highly doubt you guys get quality FA's that can turn ya'll into a 7th or 8th seed, since the East is getting better(Magic; Celtics, and 76ers will compete for the low seeds next year), and also because the Nets only have room for a max slot and maybe a quality role player(assuming the cap goes to 89 mil this summer).

The ugly truth is that the Nets are in a long road and need to own it. The new GM should try to get as many picks as possible(regardless if there late 1st rounders or 2nd rounders) and shift a bulk of the attention to scouting. Obviously it'll be tough to rebuild with no picks of your own, but you guys can become good(or at least have a good future) with a 5 year approach to rebuilding.

How it could work:
- New GM takes over in May 2016
- In June 2016, Brook Lopez traded to Indy for a 2017 lotto protected 1st rounder, 2017 2nd rounder, and 2018 2nd rounder
- After the 2016-2017 season , see if any team is willing to give up a 1st rounder in exchange for taking on their bad contracts.
- Draft BPA for the 2017 and 2018 drafts.
- Tank for the 2019 and 2020 drafts.

Obviously doing these moves isn't as simple as it is in 2k. However there's a chance you draft a legit NBA starter out of those late picks you receive from 2017-2018(Draymond; Goebert, and Jimmy Butler were drafted late), and you draft a All Star potential player out of the 2019-2020 drafts(tank years).

[Paradise]

I've never heard King question his own contract status before. I think he knows his fate is sealed.

"Not right now, no," GM Billy King said. "Shoot, I'm in the last year of my deal, too. And that's why I think I said before it's not just Lionel. We're all in this together."

"I'm not sitting in here shirking accountability. ... It stops at me. I'm the GM. You make decisions along the way, and it's my job now to figure it out and turn it around. ... It doesn't happen overnight. We knew when we traded (the first-round) picks and went down this road (for Deron Williams, Kevin Garnett and Paul Pierce) that if it doesn't go well you have to dig yourself out of it, and that's what we're doing now."

[Hello Brooklyn]

King still could have acted like the adult in the room, insisting protections on ALL 1st rd picks sent out. He did not because he did not value them. The GM at the end of the day is supposed to be of sound mind and needs to make moves considering present and future.

Wallace trade? Pick should have never been included. Read up on the deal, Portland was shocked that they were being offered a lottery pick for a player who was glued to their benched. Let that sink in. King got pissed on.

Joe Johnson trade....why was the Nets pick even involved? No one was trading for that contract. NO ONE. The trade could have been a straight salary dump. King got pissed on.

Pierce/KG trade...the Wallace trade compounded the situation added with the Russians pushing for KG to be included. Celtics had to take on extended salary (which they pawned off on Philly) to get the deal done so now swaps and extra picks were included. Maybe King should have had the balls to say 'we need to protect some of these picks'

It wasn't like Boston was losing anything since they were set to rebuild anyway

King is an enabler who devalues assets. The Russians have no idea what they are doing. That's a bad mix.

Being an adult and being the boss are two very different things. Prokorov is a young billionaire with a very big ego who got where he is by taking chances on the level you and I will never know. The guy is good at just about everything he does. He makes John Travolta character in Swordfish look like a chump for gods sake. He wasnt trying to hear the slow and steady approach. He was already spending a ton in luxury tax so what were another couple of draft picks if he thought this move would make us a legit contender. He was all in.

Ive said it before, getting Johnson wasnt about 2015, it was about 2012-13 and 2013-14. Of course we needed to give them a draft pick. People act like he was playing as poorly as he is now. His final year in Atlanta was great. No one might have traded for that contract but no one on Joe's level were available either. Joe was the same age Horford will be this off season yet I see his name floated often as a free agent target. A first round pick is not a lot to pay for Joe's level of production if that is all that was available and money wasnt an issue.

Youre completely underplaying how important the Wallace deal was. It essentially ensured we were not going to be a contender because it closed the door on Dwight. Worst deal I have ever seen.

Even if ownership was pushing King to get KG, the deal was still way too much. Most superstars get traded for less then we did for KG. I think the Atlanta deals and Celtic deals would have been fine if not for the pick swaps. You can give up those picks but throwing in those pick swaps every other year was the worst move by far.

So overall I blame King for

-The Wallace deal

-Including pick swaps in the Atlanta and Boston deals.

And I think those are 2/3 main reasons were in the situation we are in today right now. The third is Deron Williams being a complete bust. And I blame him more than King by far.

[MrDollarBills]

I feel terrible for you guys. I've been there with Billy King since I'm a 6ers fan. I saw him back out on a deal that would have sent Larry Hughes to Toronto for McGrady.

We could of had IVERSON & MCGRADY on the same team in their prime god damnit.

I saw him sign mediocre players to monster contracts which scewed us for the long term, I saw him trade away draft picks and never once trading for meaningful draft picks.

--------

So my question, what exactly can the Nets do going forward to get them out of this situation? Is it simply a waiting game?

Didn't know about the possible deal for McGrady. Failing to do that trade and picking Larry Hughes over the next two guys selected, Dirk and Pierce. That must be frustrating as a fan.

I think there's only two real options:
1. overpay young talent that we hope grows into their contract. Example would be Harrison Barnes. He's young, a great shooter, a good athlete. The Warriors might not be willing to match a huge offer for him. He cannot effectively create his own shots, some have questioned his drive - can he really reach that next level. It would be a gamble hoping he can take that next step.

2. Short-term contracts until we can hit reset in 2019. The model would be some of the contracts the Knicks handed out this summer like the Afflalo deal. We could target Eric Gordon on a 1-2 year deal over market value. Keeps cap flexibility going forward and raises the floor so we're not giving away top picks to the C's.

The only thing though is that damn near every team will have cap space, so getting a Harrison Barnes or short overpays(Gordon; Courtney Lee, Brandon Jennings, etc) will be tough. I highly doubt you guys get quality FA's that can turn ya'll into a 7th or 8th seed, since the East is getting better(Magic; Celtics, and 76ers will compete for the low seeds next year), and also because the Nets only have room for a max slot and maybe a quality role player(assuming the cap goes to 89 mil this summer).

The ugly truth is that the Nets are in a long road and need to own it. The new GM should try to get as many picks as possible(regardless if there late 1st rounders or 2nd rounders) and shift a bulk of the attention to scouting. Obviously it'll be tough to rebuild with no picks of your own, but you guys can become good(or at least have a good future) with a 5 year approach to rebuilding.

How it could work:
- New GM takes over in May 2016
- In June 2016, Brook Lopez traded to Indy for a 2017 lotto protected 1st rounder, 2017 2nd rounder, and 2018 2nd rounder
- After the 2016-2017 season , see if any team is willing to give up a 1st rounder in exchange for taking on their bad contracts.
- Draft BPA for the 2017 and 2018 drafts.
- Tank for the 2019 and 2020 drafts.

Obviously doing these moves isn't as simple as it is in 2k. However there's a chance you draft a legit NBA starter out of those late picks you receive from 2017-2018(Draymond; Goebert, and Jimmy Butler were drafted late), and you draft a All Star potential player out of the 2019-2020 drafts(tank years).

Why would we trade Brook for a lottery protected first? That defeats the purpose of even trading for the picks. 2nd rd picks are easy to acquire, we'd need actual lottery picks to rebuild.

Meanwhile, the team bleeds financially with multiple 13 win seasons as no one will want to watch the Nets play as the Knicks thrill the city with Melo and Porzingas

The Nets will have to tread water or make trades between now and 2019 before a legit rebuild strategy can be employed.

[MrDollarBills]

I've never heard King question his own contract status before. I think he knows his fate is sealed.

"Not right now, no," GM Billy King said. "Shoot, I'm in the last year of my deal, too. And that's why I think I said before it's not just Lionel. We're all in this together."

"I'm not sitting in here shirking accountability. ... It stops at me. I'm the GM. You make decisions along the way, and it's my job now to figure it out and turn it around. ... It doesn't happen overnight. We knew when we traded (the first-round) picks and went down this road (for Deron Williams, Kevin Garnett and Paul Pierce) that if it doesn't go well you have to dig yourself out of it, and that's what we're doing now."

He should start cleaning out his office. He and Hollins are cooked but good luck finding anyone worth a damn who will want to try to fix or coach this dumpster fire and I think league people will be wary about how basketball dumb the Russian ownership group is. The fact that they signed off on so many bad deals wouldn't instill confidence in any potential candidate that they are working with people who know what they are doing. And coaching wise, experienced guys may see the revolving door and say no thanks.

Our best bet is a young executive/young coach combo being brought in, a pair of guys that believe in both analytics/eyeball test instead of just "names"

Or bringing in Calipari and giving him 100% control of basketball operations.

[Net Sentence]

King still could have acted like the adult in the room, insisting protections on ALL 1st rd picks sent out. He did not because he did not value them. The GM at the end of the day is supposed to be of sound mind and needs to make moves considering present and future.

Wallace trade? Pick should have never been included. Read up on the deal, Portland was shocked that they were being offered a lottery pick for a player who was glued to their benched. Let that sink in. King got pissed on.

Joe Johnson trade....why was the Nets pick even involved? No one was trading for that contract. NO ONE. The trade could have been a straight salary dump. King got pissed on.

Pierce/KG trade...the Wallace trade compounded the situation added with the Russians pushing for KG to be included. Celtics had to take on extended salary (which they pawned off on Philly) to get the deal done so now swaps and extra picks were included. Maybe King should have had the balls to say 'we need to protect some of these picks'

It wasn't like Boston was losing anything since they were set to rebuild anyway

King is an enabler who devalues assets. The Russians have no idea what they are doing. That's a bad mix.

Being an adult and being the boss are two very different things. Prokorov is a young billionaire with a very big ego who got where he is by taking chances on the level you and I will never know. The guy is good at just about everything he does. He makes John Travolta character in Swordfish look like a chump for gods sake. He wasnt trying to hear the slow and steady approach. He was already spending a ton in luxury tax so what were another couple of draft picks if he thought this move would make us a legit contender. He was all in.

Ive said it before, getting Johnson wasnt about 2015, it was about 2012-13 and 2013-14. Of course we needed to give them a draft pick. People act like he was playing as poorly as he is now. His final year in Atlanta was great. No one might have traded for that contract but no one on Joe's level were available either. Joe was the same age Horford will be this off season yet I see his name floated often as a free agent target. A first round pick is not a lot to pay for Joe's level of production if that is all that was available and money wasnt an issue.

Youre completely underplaying how important the Wallace deal was. It essentially ensured we were not going to be a contender because it closed the door on Dwight. Worst deal I have ever seen.

Even if ownership was pushing King to get KG, the deal was still way too much. Most superstars get traded for less then we did for KG. I think the Atlanta deals and Celtic deals would have been fine if not for the pick swaps. You can give up those picks but throwing in those pick swaps every other year was the worst move by far.

So overall I blame King for

-The Wallace deal

-Including pick swaps in the Atlanta and Boston deals.

And I think those are 2/3 main reasons were in the situation we are in today right now. The third is Deron Williams being a complete bust. And I blame him more than King by far.

Is this how you rationalize things?

For one, Dwight is the reason Dwight isnt here. He Closed the door and the window God opened. King did everything in his power to bring Dwight to the Nets. So please dont recreate history to fit your narative.

The Wallace deal was bad but it was just one move. It's importance is overstated by just about every anti-King Nets fan. Repeat after me, "THE NETS WERE NOT GOING TO DRAFT DAMIAN LILLARD." Take off your revisionist goggles. People like to ignore the fact the Nets werent drafting Lillard or Drumond if we kept that pick since those positions were already filled. Please dont try saying we traded the chance to take Davis either because of the predetermined outcome you came up with that the Nets would have finished with the exact record to win the draft lottery. King was right about that draft not being very good when you consider the Nets needs. Every draft is going to have a certain number of players who turn out to be good but 2012 has a much higher bust % then any of the most recent drafts.

Just because you make good deals in your fantasy league doesnt qualify you to say that you could have made better deals than King did. I would love to hear your pitch when you are talking other GMs into take on 4 and 5 non NBA level talents for your best player. You act as if you would have just named your price. Just because no other team was willing to trade for Joe's contract doesnt mean Atlanta had to trade him. The other option was to simply decline any offer we made that they werent willing to accept.

There is something called opportunity cost you should research. It's an investment term. Every roster spot in the NBA has tremendous value. We sent them Jordan Farmar (Out of the NBA), Johan Petro (Out of the NBA), Jordan Williams (Out of the NBA), Deshawn Stevenson (Out of the NBA) and Anthony Morrow. King wasnt even willing to include Marshon Brooks in the trade because at the time he was still considered a good prospect. We tied up a 3rd of their available roster spots while at the same time opening those spots up for us to then sign players. All for the cost of Houston'a lottery protected draft pick and a couple of potential 1st round draft swaps that are likely not going to be exercised since you just tied up 5 dead spots on the Hawks roster. It took an exceptional job by Danny Ferry to bring the Hawks to a level of respectability. You can look back now with the advantage of hindsight but Korver and Milsap signed in Atlanta because they werent highly thought of. The only decent NBA player the Hawks had at the time of the trade was Horford.

DWill is squarely to blame for Kings failures on the Nets. Show me your posts where you said DWill sucked when we traded for him or resigned him. Because if you didnt say it then then you cant say I told you so now. DWill was unquestionably a top 10 player and Im not firing King because he went after and got us him.

[Net Sentence]

Didn't know about the possible deal for McGrady. Failing to do that trade and picking Larry Hughes over the next two guys selected, Dirk and Pierce. That must be frustrating as a fan.

I think there's only two real options:
1. overpay young talent that we hope grows into their contract. Example would be Harrison Barnes. He's young, a great shooter, a good athlete. The Warriors might not be willing to match a huge offer for him. He cannot effectively create his own shots, some have questioned his drive - can he really reach that next level. It would be a gamble hoping he can take that next step.

2. Short-term contracts until we can hit reset in 2019. The model would be some of the contracts the Knicks handed out this summer like the Afflalo deal. We could target Eric Gordon on a 1-2 year deal over market value. Keeps cap flexibility going forward and raises the floor so we're not giving away top picks to the C's.

The only thing though is that damn near every team will have cap space, so getting a Harrison Barnes or short overpays(Gordon; Courtney Lee, Brandon Jennings, etc) will be tough. I highly doubt you guys get quality FA's that can turn ya'll into a 7th or 8th seed, since the East is getting better(Magic; Celtics, and 76ers will compete for the low seeds next year), and also because the Nets only have room for a max slot and maybe a quality role player(assuming the cap goes to 89 mil this summer).

The ugly truth is that the Nets are in a long road and need to own it. The new GM should try to get as many picks as possible(regardless if there late 1st rounders or 2nd rounders) and shift a bulk of the attention to scouting. Obviously it'll be tough to rebuild with no picks of your own, but you guys can become good(or at least have a good future) with a 5 year approach to rebuilding.

How it could work:
- New GM takes over in May 2016
- In June 2016, Brook Lopez traded to Indy for a 2017 lotto protected 1st rounder, 2017 2nd rounder, and 2018 2nd rounder
- After the 2016-2017 season , see if any team is willing to give up a 1st rounder in exchange for taking on their bad contracts.
- Draft BPA for the 2017 and 2018 drafts.
- Tank for the 2019 and 2020 drafts.

Obviously doing these moves isn't as simple as it is in 2k. However there's a chance you draft a legit NBA starter out of those late picks you receive from 2017-2018(Draymond; Goebert, and Jimmy Butler were drafted late), and you draft a All Star potential player out of the 2019-2020 drafts(tank years).

Why would we trade Brook for a lottery protected first? That defeats the purpose of even trading for the picks. 2nd rd picks are easy to acquire, we'd need actual lottery picks to rebuild.

Meanwhile, the team bleeds financially with multiple 13 win seasons as no one will want to watch the Nets play as the Knicks thrill the city with Melo and Porzingas

The Nets will have to tread water or make trades between now and 2019 before a legit rebuild strategy can be employed.

Melo is playing on Joe Johnson's level of bad. 21.4 points a game looks nice on first glance but then you see that he is shooting 37.1% FG and 32.4% 3pt

[Prokorov]

The only thing though is that damn near every team will have cap space, so getting a Harrison Barnes or short overpays(Gordon; Courtney Lee, Brandon Jennings, etc) will be tough. I highly doubt you guys get quality FA's that can turn ya'll into a 7th or 8th seed, since the East is getting better(Magic; Celtics, and 76ers will compete for the low seeds next year), and also because the Nets only have room for a max slot and maybe a quality role player(assuming the cap goes to 89 mil this summer).

The ugly truth is that the Nets are in a long road and need to own it. The new GM should try to get as many picks as possible(regardless if there late 1st rounders or 2nd rounders) and shift a bulk of the attention to scouting. Obviously it'll be tough to rebuild with no picks of your own, but you guys can become good(or at least have a good future) with a 5 year approach to rebuilding.

How it could work:
- New GM takes over in May 2016
- In June 2016, Brook Lopez traded to Indy for a 2017 lotto protected 1st rounder, 2017 2nd rounder, and 2018 2nd rounder
- After the 2016-2017 season , see if any team is willing to give up a 1st rounder in exchange for taking on their bad contracts.
- Draft BPA for the 2017 and 2018 drafts.
- Tank for the 2019 and 2020 drafts.

Obviously doing these moves isn't as simple as it is in 2k. However there's a chance you draft a legit NBA starter out of those late picks you receive from 2017-2018(Draymond; Goebert, and Jimmy Butler were drafted late), and you draft a All Star potential player out of the 2019-2020 drafts(tank years).

Why would we trade Brook for a lottery protected first? That defeats the purpose of even trading for the picks. 2nd rd picks are easy to acquire, we'd need actual lottery picks to rebuild.

Meanwhile, the team bleeds financially with multiple 13 win seasons as no one will want to watch the Nets play as the Knicks thrill the city with Melo and Porzingas

The Nets will have to tread water or make trades between now and 2019 before a legit rebuild strategy can be employed.

Melo is playing on Joe Johnson's level of bad. 21.4 points a game looks nice on first glance but then you see that he is shooting 37.1% FG and 32.4% 3pt

49 TS% from antohony. thats horrible

[Net Sentence]

Why would we trade Brook for a lottery protected first? That defeats the purpose of even trading for the picks. 2nd rd picks are easy to acquire, we'd need actual lottery picks to rebuild.

Meanwhile, the team bleeds financially with multiple 13 win seasons as no one will want to watch the Nets play as the Knicks thrill the city with Melo and Porzingas

The Nets will have to tread water or make trades between now and 2019 before a legit rebuild strategy can be employed.

Melo is playing on Joe Johnson's level of bad. 21.4 points a game looks nice on first glance but then you see that he is shooting 37.1% FG and 32.4% 3pt

49 TS% from antohony. thats horrible

Anthony is going to be the worst contract in the NBA in the very near future. Knicks are 3-4 so people need to pump the breaks on how great they are. It's early in the season and at this time last year, all people were talking about was how good the Kings were because they got out to a good start.

[Kaiser30]

Even if ownership was pushing King to get KG, the deal was still way too much. Most superstars get traded for less then we did for KG. I think the Atlanta deals and Celtic deals would have been fine if not for the pick swaps. You can give up those picks but throwing in those pick swaps every other year was the worst move by far.

So overall I blame King for

-The Wallace deal

-Including pick swaps in the Atlanta and Boston deals.

And I think those are 2/3 main reasons were in the situation we are in today right now. The third is Deron Williams being a complete bust. And I blame him more than King by far.

That is also my problem with King. Even though you can blame Prokhorov for his statements and aggressiveness to win a championship in the near future, King was the one who negotiated the deals, presented them to him and must have even promoted them about how they will help the franchise instead of pointing out how they negatively affect the future outlook FOR YEARS.

Giving up a lottery pick for Gerald Wallace just in order to give him way too much money for way to many years in the following offseason. Then sacrificing another draft pick because he himself gave Wallace a toxic contract unlike Kris Humphries whose extension later turned into a valuable expiring contract which was ideal for salary matching purposes and future cap space.

And I do get that the earlier picks in the Boston deal could not been protected due to the Stepien Rule, but why did he give up another pick swap in 2017 and one more unprotected pick in 2018? The Nets are now in a miserable condition and the first opportunity to get a franchise player outside of having incredible luck in free agency is the draft 3 and a half years from now. A competent GM would have at least thought about a plan B, e. g. tanking for one year in 2016-2017 if we don't get any quality free agents. King has had no clue of how valuable first round draft picks currently are and happily handed them out to other GMs below market value.

The Nets need a fresh start next summer with a new GM, because free agents and their agents won't take King seriously in any meetings, so let's pray King doesn't get an extension and the fact that he hasn't signed one yet is an encouraging sign.

[King_Supreme]

@MrDollarBills
Unless the Nets are title contenders, the city won't care about you guys, plus the team is going to be bad anyway. Hell the Nets have been in Brooklyn for four seasons, and have been relevant for two of them(2012-2013 was because the start of a stadium, and 2013-4014 was because of the KG/PP trade). Trying to sell New Yorkers fake hope off Brandon Jennings and fodder will do little to affect ticket sales.

Trading Brook will allow you to recoup some cheap young talent. Second rounders aren't that easy to acquire anymore, especially since you don't have many tradeable players. Before you say late 1sts/2nd rounders don't have value, Jimmy Butler; Gobert, Draymond, KJ McDaniels, Festus Ezili, and Khris Middleton were all picked late in the 1st round/2nd round over the past 3-4 drafts.

I'm not saying you get an All-Star out of late picks, but if you get a starter/sixth man out of one of those picks, than you can consider the late picks you get from 2017-2018 a success. Brook is a skilled player,but he's not going to lead to an abundance of wins, might as well ship him for the highest bidder this summer. Given the cap increase, at least three teams would be legitimately interested in Brook(NOP; Pacers, Knicks), maybe even 5. If by 2020, the Nets have a legit starter(late picks) and a high upside young talent(tanking for the 2019-2020 drafts) both on rookie contracts, then things will be looking up especially if they have ample cap space.

[MrDollarBills]

@MrDollarBills
Unless the Nets are title contenders, the city won't care about you guys, plus the team is going to be bad anyway. Hell the Nets have been in Brooklyn for four seasons, and have been relevant for two of them(2012-2013 was because the start of a stadium, and 2013-4014 was because of the KG/PP trade). Trying to sell New Yorkers fake hope off Brandon Jennings and fodder will do little to affect ticket sales.

Trading Brook will allow you to recoup some cheap young talent. Second rounders aren't that easy to acquire anymore, especially since you don't have many tradeable players. Before you say late 1sts/2nd rounders don't have value, Jimmy Butler; Gobert, Draymond, KJ McDaniels, Festus Ezili, and Khris Middleton were all picked late in the 1st round/2nd round over the past 3-4 drafts.

I'm not saying you get an All-Star out of late picks, but if you get a starter/sixth man out of one of those picks, than you can consider the late picks you get from 2017-2018 a success. Brook is a skilled player,but he's not going to lead to an abundance of wins, might as well ship him for the highest bidder this summer. Given the cap increase, at least three teams would be legitimately interested in Brook(NOP; Pacers, Knicks), maybe even 5. If by 2020, the Nets have a legit starter(late picks) and a high upside young talent(tanking for the 2019-2020 drafts) both on rookie contracts, then things will be looking up especially if they have ample cap space.

I'm not disagreeing with most of what you are saying but you lost me with trading for lottery protected picks. Yes you can find late round value in the 1st but it is far few in between and not ideal for rebuilding.

[MrDollarBills]

Why would we trade Brook for a lottery protected first? That defeats the purpose of even trading for the picks. 2nd rd picks are easy to acquire, we'd need actual lottery picks to rebuild.

Meanwhile, the team bleeds financially with multiple 13 win seasons as no one will want to watch the Nets play as the Knicks thrill the city with Melo and Porzingas

The Nets will have to tread water or make trades between now and 2019 before a legit rebuild strategy can be employed.

Melo is playing on Joe Johnson's level of bad. 21.4 points a game looks nice on first glance but then you see that he is shooting 37.1% FG and 32.4% 3pt

49 TS% from antohony. thats horrible

If Joe Johnson averaged 21.4ppg the Nets would be at the worst be 3-4 or 4-3 and panic wouldn't be setting in. It's kind of dishonest to even put the two players in the same conversation because at least Melo for his poor efficiency is a factor out there, Johnson is beyond horrible and isn't even starter level anymore.

[Prokorov]

@MrDollarBills
Unless the Nets are title contenders, the city won't care about you guys, plus the team is going to be bad anyway. Hell the Nets have been in Brooklyn for four seasons, and have been relevant for two of them(2012-2013 was because the start of a stadium, and 2013-4014 was because of the KG/PP trade). Trying to sell New Yorkers fake hope off Brandon Jennings and fodder will do little to affect ticket sales.

it would be beyond idiotic to trade lopez for a late first/early second. and while brandon jennings might not effect sales, that doesnt mean someone else wont. someone like rubio, or someone exciting with a big off court personality would certainly help capture brooklyn fans.

Trading Brook will allow you to recoup some cheap young talent. Second rounders aren't that easy to acquire anymore, especially since you don't have many tradeable players. Before you say late 1sts/2nd rounders don't have value, Jimmy Butler; Gobert, Draymond, KJ McDaniels, Festus Ezili, and Khris Middleton were all picked late in the 1st round/2nd round over the past 3-4 drafts.

second rounders are super east to get. we have gotten multiple of them 3 years in row on draft day.

your list of players is laugable. those guys are like 1/75 to 1/100 type players. its extremely rare to get someone like that. ESPECIALLY in the second round. you usually end up with guys like markel brown or Cory jefferson.

I'm not saying you get an All-Star out of late picks, but if you get a starter/sixth man out of one of those picks, than you can consider the late picks you get from 2017-2018 a success. Brook is a skilled player,but he's not going to lead to an abundance of wins, might as well ship him for the highest bidder this summer. Given the cap increase, at least three teams would be legitimately interested in Brook(NOP; Pacers, Knicks), maybe even 5. If by 2020, the Nets have a legit starter(late picks) and a high upside young talent(tanking for the 2019-2020 drafts) both on rookie contracts, then things will be looking up especially if they have ample cap space.

late first round picks are pretty useless for a team in our situation. there is a low likelyhood we get anyone with any kind of real impact on the floor and a high likelyhood we get someone who cant even start. if we are going to move lopez, it should be for a young commodity that has shown some potential, like if we were going to move him for reggie jackson last year. thats the kind of move you make for lopez.... not a pick in the 20's or second round. thats something you trade miles plumlee for not brook lopez

[Net Sentence]

Melo is playing on Joe Johnson's level of bad. 21.4 points a game looks nice on first glance but then you see that he is shooting 37.1% FG and 32.4% 3pt

49 TS% from antohony. thats horrible

If Joe Johnson averaged 21.4ppg the Nets would be at the worst be 3-4 or 4-3 and panic wouldn't be setting in. It's kind of dishonest to even put the two players in the same conversation because at least Melo for his poor efficiency is a factor out there, Johnson is beyond horrible and isn't even starter level anymore.

You are kind of missing the point. We arent defending Joe, we are refuting your point about Melo. The grass isnt greener on the other side. Melo needs 19 shots to get 21 points. He is still getting star treatment with the FTAs in order to get his. That isnt going to last long if he keeps playing like sht.

[Prokorov]

Melo is playing on Joe Johnson's level of bad. 21.4 points a game looks nice on first glance but then you see that he is shooting 37.1% FG and 32.4% 3pt

49 TS% from antohony. thats horrible

If Joe Johnson averaged 21.4ppg the Nets would be at the worst be 3-4 or 4-3 and panic wouldn't be setting in. It's kind of dishonest to even put the two players in the same conversation because at least Melo for his poor efficiency is a factor out there, Johnson is beyond horrible and isn't even starter level anymore.

i dont think we'd be 3-4. i think we'd be 0-7 or 1-6.

melo has been bad. and joe scoring more inefficient points wouldnt help. especially in the chuck fashion melo has gotten them in

[MrDollarBills]

I'll take 21 points from Melo with a bad % added with Lopez's 20 instead of Joe's inefficient 10 which is even more inefficient and frankly useless. Melo also gets about 7 FTAs compared to Joe's measly two.

No way in hell we'd be 0-7 with Carmelo and Lopez. That's ridiculous and I don't care who the PG is. Hell if Joe was at the level he was 2 seasons ago we'd damn sure wouldn't be this bad either.