Melo should be motivated by seeing LeBron/Durant finals?

[Deeeez Knicks]

Its just crazy that so many people are focused on Melo and questioning him. He's really one of the few players I'm worried about for next year.

Season hinges on a lot of players around him.

[Thugger HBC]

Its just crazy that so many people are focused on Melo and questioning him. He's really one of the few players I'm worried about for next year.

Season hinges on a lot of players around him.

It has to do with the fact that they are totally brainwashed by the media spin.

They allow the media to dictate who is great, and who isn't.


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[basketboule]

exactly

[god shammgod]

let me say one thing. there's no model to follow unless you consider luck a model. boston gets the 1st pick instead of san antonio, and the spurs model goes to sh*t. and if portland got the 2nd pick in that draft they probably end up with durant and okc is stuck with the forever injured oden. where's their f*cking model then ? stop the nonsense.

[NY_Kn1cks]

let me say one thing. there's no model to follow unless you consider luck a model. boston gets the 1st pick instead of san antonio, and the spurs model goes to sh*t. and if portland got the 2nd pick in that draft they probably end up with durant and okc is stuck with the forever injured oden. where's their f*cking model then ? stop the nonsense.

Honestly it just boils down to poster/s being bitter that Gallo was traded in the Melo deal. And then these posters defend D'Antoni and his system because Dantoni didn't want to trade Gallo in the Melo deal.


It's really as simple as that.

[knicks1973]

First it means that you're not a "franchise player"... which is not to be confused with a "max money" player or "superstar". It means that you can't carry a team of non-All Stars or perhaps even near-All Stars to the promised land. And before you start talking Heat this and Heat that, the jury is still out on these guys and it may end up being a case of subtraction by addition, ie. top heavy talent that has trouble meshing properly and a weak bench.

OKC has an All NBA 1st teamer in Durant and an All-NBA second teamer in Wesbrook. Miami LBJ 1st and Wade 3rd.

Knicks have two 3rd teamers, Melo and Tyson.

There are really only 5 teams that have a serious shot at winning in any given year and each will likely have a top five player on it. In relatively recent history you had Shaq and Duncan, and more recently you had Bryant for a couple of seasons, Dirk last year, Lebron this year and last year, Durant this year. Durant looks for real to me... he is starting to distinguish himself as a top 2 player, a guy who is getting better every season, and better at adapting to others and meshing. This he does better than Wade and James, IMO.

Because we have only two 3rd teamers our potential for winning a title is going to be weaker and we need to have very strong players 3-7 to compensate, including a couple of starters that, popularity contests aside, play All-Star caliber basketball, or something near that level. I guess you could say Dallas did that but as others have noted they did it with a grossly swollen salary.

I got you. By your definition there are totally ZERO franchise players in the NBA.

Well not quite... first off there are too many teams... so that real talent can't actually be brought together unless something unusual takes place-- like teams or players colluding... or getting lucky in the draft... or finding great and obscure picks deep in the draft. The last of these actually requires a great scouting staff, case in point Manu and Tony for the Spurs. Other than that obvious front office skill you have teams like the Mavs over budget or GMs and players gaming the system. Secondly... the dominant big man with a great low post game or post game period is virtually extinct. I mention this because both Shaq and Duncan are really the last exemplars we have had. Nobody still playing has anything close to their games, although Hibbert is progressing and Marc Gasol is pretty darn good.

And these unfortunate developments are traceable to too many teams and not enough real talent and having to overpay for lesser talent. That and Stern changing so many rules to favor perimeter players.

[kNicksGmen]

bahaha @ niccas in here throwing around per stats. yall dudes is too much.

[thecircle]

Melo is Def Below Durant. You guys are delusional. Durant got this intensity that Melo has never showed.

[TheGarden]

Melo in Denver unlike Kobe and LeBron in Cleveland never had management go get this guy, that guy every off season

Also Dwight had the perfect team assembled around him the year they went to the Finals

At the end of the day if we allow Melo to be a scorer, rebounder and defender and if Melo gets into an every possession matters mind set I think we get a 29-10-3 50-40-80 guy.

It's a little Melo a little of the coach and system. If all 3 are on the same page well see great results which is why I love the Melo, Woodson combination

[Manitoba]

Never mind Lebron and Dwight carrying their teams single-handedly to the finals; these guys are a level above Melo.

Consider that Al Horford and Jermaine O'Neal have each won more playoff series than Melo has. Are they better than he is? Not at all. So to echo TKF's question earlier in the thread, why is it so hard to build a winning team around Melo?

So we aren't even going to mention that Melo played in the West, where, one year, a 50 win season was good enough for the 8th seed, and Lebron, Dwight, Horford and Jermaine Oneal all played in the East, where you don't even need to be above .500 to make the playoffs?

Baron Davis also has more series wins than Melo -- and Baron won his in the West. Do you have any more excuses?

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

EDIT: minor readability changes.

[drtran117]

Baron Davis also has more series wins than Melo -- and Baron won his in the West. Do you have any more excuses?

Baron only won 1 series in the West, and it was only one series. The rest were all in Charlotte, which...is in the East. Unlike Baron, Carmelo actually made it to the Western Conference Finals.

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

Having Chauncey Billups and Nene as your second and third-best players is not a recipe for success. Who's the rebounding threat on that team? Don't say Kenyon Martin, or I'm going to laugh at you. The onus is on the Nuggets' front office.

[Manitoba]

Great, drtran117, you attacked a side issue and totally avoided addressing my main argument.

[Woodsanity]

Never mind Lebron and Dwight carrying their teams single-handedly to the finals; these guys are a level above Melo.

Consider that Al Horford and Jermaine O'Neal have each won more playoff series than Melo has. Are they better than he is? Not at all. So to echo TKF's question earlier in the thread, why is it so hard to build a winning team around Melo?

So we aren't even going to mention that Melo played in the West, where, one year, a 50 win season was good enough for the 8th seed, and Lebron, Dwight, Horford and Jermaine Oneal all played in the East, where you don't even need to be above .500 to make the playoffs?

Baron Davis also has more series wins than Melo -- and Baron won his in the West. Do you have any more excuses?

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

EDIT: minor readability changes.

Makes absolutely no sense. I never realized Melo played with Shaq. I also never realized Melo had the best frontcourt in the league.

[drtran117]

Great, drtran117, you attacked a side issue and totally avoided addressing my main argument.

I attacked your points that you used to form a bull conjecture, then ended saying that because of those points, Carmelo needs to improve his teamwork.

[Thugger HBC]

Baron Davis also has more series wins than Melo -- and Baron won his in the West. Do you have any more excuses?

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

EDIT: minor readability changes.

The same could be said of Garnett.

Swap Chauncey for Sam Cassell.

What were Garnett reasons for being a perennial loser?

Btw, you're dead wrong about Baron.

The Hornets were an Eastern Conference team at that time.

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