Melo should be motivated by seeing LeBron/Durant finals?

[Manitoba]

I attacked your points that you used to form a bull conjecture, then ended saying that because of those points, Carmelo needs to improve his teamwork.

I notice you didn't back up your statement. Hence the following translation of your words: the truth hurts you so much that you'll do anything to avoid confronting it head on, so you sling some mud instead, just like a politician.

Why do you call my reasoning a "bull conjecture"? To make it easy for you, I'll repeat it:

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

[melo mvp 15]

I attacked your points that you used to form a bull conjecture, then ended saying that because of those points, Carmelo needs to improve his teamwork.

I notice you didn't back up your statement. Hence the following translation of your words: the truth hurts you so much that you'll do anything to avoid confronting it head on, so you sling some mud instead, just like a politician.

Why do you call my reasoning a "bull conjecture"? To make it easy for you, I'll repeat it:

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

Kobe never really won with hero ball, he won playing the triangle and on stacked teams. When he played hero ball the Lakers missed the playoffs once. He actually needed Phil Jackson back just to get back into the playoffs. And even with Phil and without Shaq, Pau or an older Bynum, Kobe got eliminated in the first round twice. It wasn't until he got gifted Pau that he could get start competing in the playoffs.

Carmelo has never had teams as talented as Kobe's and he's never had arguably the best coach in NBA history to guide him (or at least top 3-5).

[kNicksGmen]

melo should be motivated.... by the simple fact that his teammates are nowhere near as good as lebron and durant's... therefore melo needs to be a superhero for the team to even win a series, let alone make a deep playoff run.

[DblPseudo]

Melo & Stat should be motivated by what Phil said about them not being able to mesh well together.

[Manitoba]

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

Kobe never really won with hero ball, he won playing the triangle and on stacked teams. When he played hero ball the Lakers missed the playoffs once. He actually needed Phil Jackson back just to get back into the playoffs. And even with Phil and without Shaq, Pau or an older Bynum, Kobe got eliminated in the first round twice. It wasn't until he got gifted Pau that he could get start competing in the playoffs.

That's fine with me. If what you say is right, that even someone as supremely talented as Kobe could not succeed with hero ball, then Melo definitely can't do that. So his teamwork really needs improving.

[Pharmcat]

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

melo had winning team in DEN, its just that there were better teams compared to his....he lost to teams like SAS, LAL, just LOADED teams....the other year his coach was out due to health issues....I think there was one year he could be criticized for not advancing

what happened when lebrons team played the SAS? they got CLOWNED
what happened when dwights team played the LAL? LAL just toyed with them

this past decade, the west was really really strong.

[xclearscreen]

why is it that:
every year melo's teams aren't as loaded as the teams he loses to?
every nba coach he has played for in the past criticizes his heart, effort, and determination?
every thread turns out to be a melo bashing thread?
every fat chick jpg becomes a joke about melo's overweight problem?

[melo mvp 15]

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Chauncey was good that year, but that's definitely not the only reason (or even the main reason) that Denver actually had success in the playoffs.

That was the only year that Denver was the actually the favorite to win a series. They finally did good enough in the regular season to get home court and play some worse teams. They faced New Orleans and Dallas. They beat New Orleans because for the first time in most of Melo's stint in Denver, everyone was healthy and Karl made a great game plan to trap Chris Paul whenever he got the ball. They easily beat them (they won one game by 58 points!). Chauncey came up huge in the first game, but it was more about the team defense being good enough to contain Paul (it also helped that Peja, Tyson and West were all hobbled).

They beat Dallas in the next series because Carmelo out played Dirk and Kenyon Martin played some of the best individual defense on a player I've ever seen.

Are you gonna ignore that Carmelo averaged over 27 ppg during that 2009 playoff run? Yet it was somehow all Chauncey? Don't get me wrong, CB was great and I think put up like 20 and 7... but it was more Melo playing great, Chauncey finally giving Melo a reputable sidekick (yes he had Iverson, but he was inefficient, a ball hog and they played much better teams), the team's defense being incredible, the team playing with an "us against the world," everyone being healthy, homecourt in the first 2 rounds (and thus being favored in the first 2 rounds) and everything else. I'm obviously not saying it was just Melo that got them to the WCF and really were a hard out vs the Lakers, I'm saying that he was the main reason along with many other things in Denver's favor.

[drtran117]

I notice you didn't back up your statement. Hence the following translation of your words: the truth hurts you so much that you'll do anything to avoid confronting it head on, so you sling some mud instead, just like a politician.

Why do you call my reasoning a "bull conjecture"? To make it easy for you, I'll repeat it:

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

Since you need me to spell it out for you:

1. The Western Conference teams Carmelo's Nuggets teams faced were deeper and didn't rely on just perimeter play. Garnett+Cassell+Sprewell, Duncan+Ginobili+Parker, Brand+Kaman+Maggette+Cassell, Gasol+Bryant+Odom, and Boozer+Deron Williams+Okur are better than Carmelo+Iverson+Camby or Carmelo+Billups+Nene. Carmelo hasn't had nearly as much post presence in his teams as the Western Conference teams he lost to had, and that hurts a lot more in the playoffs.

2. Carmelo has never played with a healthy Knicks team in the playoffs. This is pretty self-explanatory. STAT and Billups were hurt during the 2011 playoffs, and Lin, Shumpert, Davis, and STAT were hurt during the 2012 playoffs.

3. Carmelo doesn't need hero ball to be good. He seemed to play fine with Lin, and this is without the familiarity with each other that a formal training camp and practices would bring. If you have Toney **** Douglas as your starting Point Guard, you're obviously going to have a bad time.

[xclearscreen]

running out of excuses.....

[jeremylin17]

wow melo fanboys really believe that melo is on the same level as durant. LOL You guys are fcuking delusional.

Durant is a big man who plays like a perimeter player. Those are the types of players that wins in this league. Dirk, bird, magic are all big men that plays like perimeter players whereas melo is the opposite. Hes a perimeter player playing like a big man. Tell me how many undersized big men that wins in this league. None and the closest is barkley. But still, he has the stats of a big man. .57 FG% and 10+ rpg while melo has the stats of a perimeter player. Thats why durant already surpassed him career wise in just the age of 23.

This game is game of runs or momentums and having a ball stopper kills the momentum of the team. And he cant run coz hes a fatass which also kills momentum. And 2nd he clogs the paint with his post up BS. Instead of having a floor spacer, we instead have a big man masquerading as a perimeter player. Thats why our whole offense sucks with him in the lineup. Coz amare and lin cant score with him clogging in the paint. The trend now is to have a stretch 4 so a team can have too much spacing but instead we have a 3 who wants to clog the paint. Compared to 1 player clogging the paint for most championship teams,we instead have 3 players clogging the paint.

Thats the reason why we lost 8 out of 10 with him because hes a cancer. While winning 8 out of 9 without him. And if he didnt sacrificed touches during the start of woodson, that team would still suck. Its really not dantonis fault that he has a cancerous player. He won 8 out of 9 without that cancer.

But instead we would rather trade another big man who plays like a perimeter player in amare. Coz he doesnt play in the post. LMAO melo fanboys really have laughable logic. REally? Youd rather want an undersize pf over an oversize sg even though facts suggest that undersize bigs hasnt won in this league. Whereas amare has just been a tyson chandler away from winning a chip or multiple chips. And worse is that melo only have gotten out of the first round when he had his worse season. Just goes to show that he really isnt the sole reason for that teams success but because he had good teammates. Please what we got here is a player with style with no substance.

[jeremylin17]

And people really would credit melo for making the playoffs when this team is 6 or 7 games above .500 until melo wanted to be traded to the knicks

[Knicks_Fan2]

wow melo fanboys really believe that melo is on the same level as durant. LOL You guys are fcuking delusional.

Durant is a big man who plays like a perimeter player. Those are the types of players that wins in this league. Dirk, bird, magic are all big men that plays like perimeter players whereas melo is the opposite. Hes a perimeter player playing like a big man. Tell me how many undersized big men that wins in this league. None and the closest is barkley. But still, he has the stats of a big man. .57 FG% and 10+ rpg while melo has the stats of a perimeter player. Thats why durant already surpassed him career wise in just the age of 23.

This game is game of runs or momentums and having a ball stopper kills the momentum of the team. And he cant run coz hes a fatass which also kills momentum. And 2nd he clogs the paint with his post up BS. Instead of having a floor spacer, we instead have a big man masquerading as a perimeter player. Thats why our whole offense sucks with him in the lineup. Coz amare and lin cant score with him clogging in the paint. The trend now is to have a stretch 4 so a team can have too much spacing but instead we have a 3 who wants to clog the paint. Compared to 1 player clogging the paint for most championship teams,we instead have 3 players clogging the paint.

Thats the reason why we lost 8 out of 10 with him because hes a cancer. While winning 8 out of 9 without him. And if he didnt sacrificed touches during the start of woodson, that team would still suck. Its really not dantonis fault that he has a cancerous player. He won 8 out of 9 without that cancer.

But instead we would rather trade another big man who plays like a perimeter player in amare. Coz he doesnt play in the post. LMAO melo fanboys really have laughable logic. REally? Youd rather want an undersize pf over an oversize sg even though facts suggest that undersize bigs hasnt won in this league. Whereas amare has just been a tyson chandler away from winning a chip or multiple chips. And worse is that melo only have gotten out of the first round when he had his worse season. Just goes to show that he really isnt the sole reason for that teams success but because he had good teammates. Please what we got here is a player with style with no substance.

Was waiting for the first reference to melo being some cause for amare and lins struggles and stopped reading. Thanks for fitting into your stereotype--never change.

[jeremylin17]

I notice you didn't back up your statement. Hence the following translation of your words: the truth hurts you so much that you'll do anything to avoid confronting it head on, so you sling some mud instead, just like a politician.

Why do you call my reasoning a "bull conjecture"? To make it easy for you, I'll repeat it:

The fact is, Carmelo has won a playoff series in only one year out of nine. Why is it so hard to build a winning team around him?

My guess is that he's not elite but hogs the ball like someone who is. Melo keeps the ball so long that even when his teammates get the hot potato eventually, they have little time to do much with it. So their skills degrade significantly over the season. When the playoffs start, and good teams make Melo's life tough, he has nobody to fall back on, as his teammates are by then thoroughly rusty. So he loses the series.

(The only exception was in 2008-09, when Chauncey Billups was ornery enough to demand his share of the ball, and he could not be denied as his reputation was stronger than Melo's. Guess what, the team started winning in the playoffs. What a coincidence!)

Kobe was talented enough to win with hero ball, but Melo is not.

So my advice would be: "Carmelo, you are not Kobe and never will be, so if you want to win a championship, improve your teamwork."

Since you need me to spell it out for you:

1. The Western Conference teams Carmelo's Nuggets teams faced were deeper and didn't rely on just perimeter play. Garnett+Cassell+Sprewell, Duncan+Ginobili+Parker, Brand+Kaman+Maggette+Cassell, Gasol+Bryant+Odom, and Boozer+Deron Williams+Okur are better than Carmelo+Iverson+Camby or Carmelo+Billups+Nene. Carmelo hasn't had nearly as much post presence in his teams as the Western Conference teams he lost to had, and that hurts a lot more in the playoffs.

2. Carmelo has never played with a healthy Knicks team in the playoffs. This is pretty self-explanatory. STAT and Billups were hurt during the 2011 playoffs, and Lin, Shumpert, Davis, and STAT were hurt during the 2012 playoffs.

3. Carmelo doesn't need hero ball to be good. He seemed to play fine with Lin, and this is without the familiarity with each other that a formal training camp and practices would bring. If you have Toney **** Douglas as your starting Point Guard, you're obviously going to have a bad time.

Then why the fcuk chandler, amare and other players dont need training camp with lin. Please training camp is overrated. If you fit, you dont need training camp to fit.

[jeremylin17]

wow melo fanboys really believe that melo is on the same level as durant. LOL You guys are fcuking delusional.

Durant is a big man who plays like a perimeter player. Those are the types of players that wins in this league. Dirk, bird, magic are all big men that plays like perimeter players whereas melo is the opposite. Hes a perimeter player playing like a big man. Tell me how many undersized big men that wins in this league. None and the closest is barkley. But still, he has the stats of a big man. .57 FG% and 10+ rpg while melo has the stats of a perimeter player. Thats why durant already surpassed him career wise in just the age of 23.

This game is game of runs or momentums and having a ball stopper kills the momentum of the team. And he cant run coz hes a fatass which also kills momentum. And 2nd he clogs the paint with his post up BS. Instead of having a floor spacer, we instead have a big man masquerading as a perimeter player. Thats why our whole offense sucks with him in the lineup. Coz amare and lin cant score with him clogging in the paint. The trend now is to have a stretch 4 so a team can have too much spacing but instead we have a 3 who wants to clog the paint. Compared to 1 player clogging the paint for most championship teams,we instead have 3 players clogging the paint.

Thats the reason why we lost 8 out of 10 with him because hes a cancer. While winning 8 out of 9 without him. And if he didnt sacrificed touches during the start of woodson, that team would still suck. Its really not dantonis fault that he has a cancerous player. He won 8 out of 9 without that cancer.

But instead we would rather trade another big man who plays like a perimeter player in amare. Coz he doesnt play in the post. LMAO melo fanboys really have laughable logic. REally? Youd rather want an undersize pf over an oversize sg even though facts suggest that undersize bigs hasnt won in this league. Whereas amare has just been a tyson chandler away from winning a chip or multiple chips. And worse is that melo only have gotten out of the first round when he had his worse season. Just goes to show that he really isnt the sole reason for that teams success but because he had good teammates. Please what we got here is a player with style with no substance.

Was waiting for the first reference to melo being some cause for amare and lins struggles and stopped reading. Thanks for fitting into your stereotype--never change.

Why? isnt it obvious?