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Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread

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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4941 » by R-DAWG » Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:37 am

ozwizard8 wrote:i just cant see bulls giving 3-4 for 1st rounders+j.butler for melo.
melo wants to win. so he knows he better go at the end of the season and make a fresh start.
also these draft picks are valuable. bulls can trade them for good players with low salary when melo signs with them in off season.

bulls looks like good option for melo with their assets. without butler and those draft picks i'm not sure about bulls.
also d.rose condition is compelling. after STAT the new injury prone star next to melo.
they have great coach thibs but in their system losing boozer-deng like scorers doesnt affect team much so i'm not sure if melo can get title there.

****

for us rebuilding is necessity.
i would send chandler to phx for picks right away.
maybe try for barg+fillers+cash+2nd round for o.asik.
hire new coach like HOLLINS for saving these 2 year before rebuildingwith melo.


The Bulls can't just sign Melo in the offseason. They will need to trade Taj Gibson, who is worth more to them on the court than anything they get for him, assuming they can send him to a team with cap space or a TPE. Plus, by trading for Melo they keep their mid level exception. Gibson and a mid level player are worth 2 draft picks and a young player (Mirotic or Butler) for a contending team. Plus they move Boozer's contract which for a team that is concerned about finances, is worth a 1st rd pick.

Look at it this way:
Taj Gibson = 1 1st rd pick
Mid Level Exception = 1st rd pick
Clearing Boozers contract to make the trade work = first round pick

In this case, the incremental cost of trading for Carmelo Anthony is either Mirotic or Butler.

Anything less than this were better off keeping Melo and hoping that we get lucky and land another star, but most likely remain a mid level playoff team. But it gets us through 2016, when we can do a proper rebuild.

I'm all for rebuilding but it's not wise to start the process when you don't have a pick in 2 out of the next 3 drafts. A 32 year old Melo will draw interest on the trade market to a team that see's him as the final piece to a championship puzzle.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4942 » by R-DAWG » Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:33 am

How about this:

NYK: Pau Gasol, Washington's 2014 1st rd pick (top 12 protected)
PHX: Tyson Chandler
LAL: Emeka Okafor, Indiana's 2014 1st rd pick.

So there have been rumors out there about the Suns not wanting to give up assets without having Gasol locked up for next year, but have little interest in giving him a long term deal. Enter Tyson Chandler. He's a few years younger and locked up for 1 year. They don't have to make a long term commitment but they ensure they have him next year.

The Lakers end up with the perfect package for Gasol, dropping below the tax, insurance paying the contract, and a 1st rd pick.

New York picks up a 2014 1st rd pick that should be in the same range theirs will be and in the process swap Chandler for Gasol. Shakes things up for this year while picking up an asset.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4943 » by R-DAWG » Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:10 am

And one more, builds on the Gasol proposal.

NYK: Kyle Lowry, Mo Speights 2 Golden State 2nd rd picks
CLE: Iman Shumpert
TOR: Dion Waiters, Metta World Peace, Cold Aldrich
GS: Raymond Felton

The Cavs switch things up by bringing in Shumpert to replace Waiters. Shump needs a change of scenery and his game will fit in very well with Irving (man, they messed up not taking Oladpio).

Toronto gets a young player with 2 years left on his rookie deal who has shown potential as a scoring threat off the bench. Sure, they could opt for Shumpert but he has only 1 year left on his rookie deal and is very similar to Terrence Ross, so Waiters is the better fit. Plus they acomplish their goal of not taking back salary.

Golden State gets a backup point guard. This has been a problem for them without Jarret Jack and Jordan Crawford has struggled. Plus, they are more than happy to lose Speights, the cost of 2 2nd round picks is well worth it.

New York picks up Kyle Lowry who is a major upgrade from Raymond Felton. Speights is a serviceable big man and will be able to be moved at next years trade dealing when his contract is a year shorter. But we sell very low on Shumpert and Felton if this is only a one year rental.


But maybe we need to look at this differently. Maybe Lowry and Gasol could be part of the next core around Carmelo. Lowry is entering his prime but doesn't have a proven track record. Gasol has a proven track record and although not the same player he's only 33 years old. He's putting up 17/10/3 assists/1.5 blocks per games this season and would change the dynamic of this team. We also pick up a first round pick and 2 second round picks and enter the offseason with $35 million in expiring contracts. Maybe the move isn't to waste next season for a chance that we strike gold in 2015.

Gasol/Tyler/Speights
Martin/Stoudemire/Bargnani
Anthony/Smith
Hardaway/Murry
Lowry/Prigioni/Udrich

It's interesting because it's a nice base to go along with the flexibility of the expiring contracts in the offseason. The team would need to bring in a defensive anchor (Larry Sanders could be a nice buy low candidate), a flex 4 to play with Melo (I think Thad Young would be great, Jeff Green ok, but i'd settle for Gerald Wallace if I got a first round pick for taking on his contract, same with Josh Smith) and depth in the backcourt. But there's something here and there's room to add to it. Heck, offseason possibilities could be Bargnani's expiring deal for Josh Smith and a 1st round pick. Amare's expiring could be used to bring in a backcourt guy like Aaron Afflalo along with Baby Davis

Gasol/Tyler
Smith/Davis
Anthony/Smith
Afflalo/Hardaway
Lowry/Prigioni

I think this team can match Miami and Indiana. Everyone besides Melo can defend. Smith and Lowry are plus plus defenders and Afflalo is close to that level. Gasol brings a different dimension with his inside outside game in addition to leadership and experience winning with a player similar to Melo in style. Afflalo and Lowry add consistency to the backcourt. While Josh Smith's shooting is a concern, he does a lot more than Tyson Chandler offensively and Gasol can space the floor from the 5 spot. With the right coach this team has the potential of being an elite defensive team with an elite scorer along with solid offensive role players. Can it win a championship, I'm not sure. But at the start of the 2010-2011 season no one thought Dallas would be in the conversation.



Just a thought.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4944 » by Newyorknick94 » Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:50 am

We neeeeed to get Reggie Jackson!
Legends BAT
G - Penny Hardaway/Mike Bibby
G - Gilbert Arenas / Monta Ellis
F - Julius Erving/John Starks
F - Chris bosh/Danny Granger
C - Dikembe Mutombo
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4945 » by TheProfessor » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:17 am

R-DAWG wrote:And one more, builds on the Gasol proposal.

NYK: Kyle Lowry, 2 Golden State 2nd rd picks
CLE: Iman Shumpert
TOR: Dion Waiters, Metta World Peace, Cold Aldrich
GS: Raymond Felton

The Cavs switch things up by bringing in Shumpert to replace Waiters. Shump needs a change of scenery and his game will fit in very well with Irving (man, they messed up not taking Oladpio).

Toronto gets a young player with 2 years left on his rookie deal who has shown potential as a scoring threat off the bench. Sure, they could opt for Shumpert but he has only 1 year left on his rookie deal and is very similar to Terrence Ross, so Waiters is the better fit. Plus they acomplish their goal of not taking back salary.

Golden State gets a backup point guard. This has been a problem for them without Jarret Jack and Jordan Crawford has struggled. Plus, they are more than happy to lose Speights, the cost of 2 2nd round picks is well worth it.

New York picks up Kyle Lowry who is a major upgrade from Raymond Felton. Speights is a serviceable big man and will be able to be moved at next years trade dealing when his contract is a year shorter. But we sell very low on Shumpert and Felton if this is only a one year rental.


But maybe we need to look at this differently. Maybe Lowry and Gasol could be part of the next core around Carmelo. Lowry is entering his prime but doesn't have a proven track record. Gasol has a proven track record and although not the same player he's only 33 years old. He's putting up 17/10/3 assists/1.5 blocks per games this season and would change the dynamic of this team. We also pick up a first round pick and 2 second round picks and enter the offseason with $35 million in expiring contracts. Maybe the move isn't to waste next season for a chance that we strike gold in 2015.

Gasol/Tyler/Speights
Martin/Stoudemire/Bargnani
Anthony/Smith
Hardaway/Murry
Lowry/Prigioni/Udrich

It's interesting because it's a nice base to go along with the flexibility of the expiring contracts in the offseason. The team would need to bring in a defensive anchor (Larry Sanders could be a nice buy low candidate), a flex 4 to play with Melo (I think Thad Young would be great, Jeff Green ok, but i'd settle for Gerald Wallace if I got a first round pick for taking on his contract, same with Josh Smith) and depth in the backcourt. But there's something here and there's room to add to it. Heck, offseason possibilities could be Bargnani's expiring deal for Josh Smith and a 1st round pick. Amare's expiring could be used to bring in a backcourt guy like Aaron Afflalo along with Baby Davis

Gasol/Tyler
Smith/Davis
Anthony/Smith
Afflalo/Hardaway
Lowry/Prigioni

I think this team can match Miami and Indiana. Everyone besides Melo can defend. Smith and Lowry are plus plus defenders and Afflalo is close to that level. Gasol brings a different dimension with his inside outside game in addition to leadership and experience winning with a player similar to Melo in style. Afflalo and Lowry add consistency to the backcourt. While Josh Smith's shooting is a concern, he does a lot more than Tyson Chandler offensively and Gasol can space the floor from the 5 spot. With the right coach this team has the potential of being an elite defensive team with an elite scorer along with solid offensive role players. Can it win a championship, I'm not sure. But at the start of the 2010-2011 season no one thought Dallas would be in the conversation.



Just a thought.

Shump aint worth that much, but toronto says yes if you can fleece all the other teams.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4946 » by Greenie » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:19 am

spikeslovechild wrote:Toronto Raptors Trade Breakdown

Incoming Players
J.R. Smith, 28 year old , 6-6, 220 lb SG, 13.0 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 3.0 apg in 32.3 minutes
Raymond Felton, 29 year old , 6-1, 205 lb PG, 10.5 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 5.7 apg in 32.2 minutes
Beno Udrih, 31 year old , 6-3, 210 lb G, 5.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.5 apg in 19.0 minutes
Kenneth Faried, 24 year old , 6-8, 228 lb F, 10.5 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 24.8 minutes

Outgoing Players
Landry Fields, 25 year old , 6-7, 215 lb F, 2.4 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 0.8 apg in 11.9 minutes
Kyle Lowry, 27 year old , 6-0, 205 lb PG, 16.7 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 7.5 apg in 36.3 minutes
Greivis Vasquez, 27 year old , 6-6, 211 lb G, 7.8 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 4.4 apg in 21.7 minutes

New York Knicks Trade Breakdown

Incoming Players
Landry Fields, 25 year old , 6-7, 215 lb F, 2.4 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 0.8 apg in 11.9 minutes
Kyle Lowry 27 year old , 6-0, 205 lb PG , 16.7 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 7.5 apg in 36.3 minutes
Greivis Vasquez 27 year old , 6-6, 211 lb G, 7.8 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 4.4 apg in 21.7 minutes

Outgoing Players
J.R. Smith, 28 year old , 6-6, 220 lb SG, 13.0 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 3.0 apg in 32.3 minutes
Raymond Felton, 29 year old , 6-1, 205 lb PG, 10.5 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 5.7 apg in 32.2 minutes
Iman Shumpert, 23 year old , 6-5, 220 lb G, 7.0 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.8 apg in 27.2 minutes
Beno Udrih, 31 year old , 6-3, 210 lb G, 5.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.5 apg in 19.0 minutes

Denver Nuggets Trade Breakdown

Incoming Players
Iman Shumpert, 23 year old , 6-5, 220 lb G, 7.0 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 1.8 apg in 27.2 minutes

Outgoing Players
Kenneth Faried, 24 year old , 6-8, 228 lb F, 10.5 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 0.9 apg in 24.8 minutes


Why would those other two teams do that?
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4947 » by Greenie » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:23 am

JR for Draymond Green
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4948 » by Nyk4lyfe » Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:14 am

I'm a huge proponent of the 2015 plan but if we REALLY wanted to blow that up we could do get Lowry and Deng if they give an agreement to extend their contract.

Felton + MWP + 2018 1st (hopefully with some protections!) for Lowry

Shump and Udrih to Nuggets. Faried, Bargnani and cash to Cavs. Deng and fillers to Knicks.


Starters:
PG: Kyle Lowry
SG: Tim Hardaway Jr.
SF: Luol Deng
PF: Carmelo Anthony
C: Tyson Chandler

Bench:
PG: Pablo Prigioni
SG: Toure Murray
SF: JR Smith
PF: Amare Stoudamire or Jeremy Tyler depending on whose healthy
C: Kenyon Martin

once again, im not sure if I would do it cause of 2015 plans and the potential to get someone like Love, Gasol or Rondo but its something to consider
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4949 » by DowNY » Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:37 pm

Get me Kyrie Irving.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4950 » by R-DAWG » Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:21 pm

TheProfessor wrote:
R-DAWG wrote:And one more, builds on the Gasol proposal.

NYK: Kyle Lowry, 2 Golden State 2nd rd picks
CLE: Iman Shumpert
TOR: Dion Waiters, Metta World Peace, Cold Aldrich
GS: Raymond Felton

The Cavs switch things up by bringing in Shumpert to replace Waiters. Shump needs a change of scenery and his game will fit in very well with Irving (man, they messed up not taking Oladpio).

Toronto gets a young player with 2 years left on his rookie deal who has shown potential as a scoring threat off the bench. Sure, they could opt for Shumpert but he has only 1 year left on his rookie deal and is very similar to Terrence Ross, so Waiters is the better fit. Plus they acomplish their goal of not taking back salary.

Golden State gets a backup point guard. This has been a problem for them without Jarret Jack and Jordan Crawford has struggled. Plus, they are more than happy to lose Speights, the cost of 2 2nd round picks is well worth it.

New York picks up Kyle Lowry who is a major upgrade from Raymond Felton. Speights is a serviceable big man and will be able to be moved at next years trade dealing when his contract is a year shorter. But we sell very low on Shumpert and Felton if this is only a one year rental.


But maybe we need to look at this differently. Maybe Lowry and Gasol could be part of the next core around Carmelo. Lowry is entering his prime but doesn't have a proven track record. Gasol has a proven track record and although not the same player he's only 33 years old. He's putting up 17/10/3 assists/1.5 blocks per games this season and would change the dynamic of this team. We also pick up a first round pick and 2 second round picks and enter the offseason with $35 million in expiring contracts. Maybe the move isn't to waste next season for a chance that we strike gold in 2015.

Gasol/Tyler/Speights
Martin/Stoudemire/Bargnani
Anthony/Smith
Hardaway/Murry
Lowry/Prigioni/Udrich

It's interesting because it's a nice base to go along with the flexibility of the expiring contracts in the offseason. The team would need to bring in a defensive anchor (Larry Sanders could be a nice buy low candidate), a flex 4 to play with Melo (I think Thad Young would be great, Jeff Green ok, but i'd settle for Gerald Wallace if I got a first round pick for taking on his contract, same with Josh Smith) and depth in the backcourt. But there's something here and there's room to add to it. Heck, offseason possibilities could be Bargnani's expiring deal for Josh Smith and a 1st round pick. Amare's expiring could be used to bring in a backcourt guy like Aaron Afflalo along with Baby Davis

Gasol/Tyler
Smith/Davis
Anthony/Smith
Afflalo/Hardaway
Lowry/Prigioni

I think this team can match Miami and Indiana. Everyone besides Melo can defend. Smith and Lowry are plus plus defenders and Afflalo is close to that level. Gasol brings a different dimension with his inside outside game in addition to leadership and experience winning with a player similar to Melo in style. Afflalo and Lowry add consistency to the backcourt. While Josh Smith's shooting is a concern, he does a lot more than Tyson Chandler offensively and Gasol can space the floor from the 5 spot. With the right coach this team has the potential of being an elite defensive team with an elite scorer along with solid offensive role players. Can it win a championship, I'm not sure. But at the start of the 2010-2011 season no one thought Dallas would be in the conversation.



Just a thought.

Shump aint worth that much, but toronto says yes if you can fleece all the other teams.


*** Mo Speights was supposed to be included in that deal going from GS to NY. They clear that contract opening up room to trade for Brandon Bass (they are hard caped as a result of the Iggy trade). Another option is Golden State flipping Felton to Cleveland for Jarret Jack. Felton's contract is about $2m less per year than Jarrett Jack's. However, they would need to dump Jordan Crawford's $2.2m salary for a trade exception to stay below the apron. Very doable.

Shump for Dion Waiters is a very fair trade. Two struggling guards in need of a change of scenary.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4951 » by NyAvenger » Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:28 pm

I know I asked for a trade earlier but I'm not sure now. A lot of these speculated trades look bad. Shump for fairied the Lowry trade. I really don't think this management can make a competent trade. I'd rather stay pat.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4952 » by ozwizard8 » Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:18 pm

Ris_44 wrote:Would Cleveland take this?

NY trades Chandler, Shumpert, Felton
CLE trades Varajao, Jack, Waiters

We get a better point guard to start, a Center who's similar and exchange young Shooting guard who even though disgruntled has plenty of talent.

They get a veteran leader and starting c, a cheaper back up point guard and a more level headed SG who has plenty of potential to exchange for their headache...

1 week earler this trade was legit.
now, i'm not sure Cavs will accept it.

if they lose some games it might work for us.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4953 » by MKCATL » Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:53 pm

3 way trade

Knicks out: Chandler, Shump, Murrey, 2018 first
Suns out: Okafor, 2014 first
Tor out: Lowry, Fields, Salmons

Knicks In: Lowry, Fields, Salmons, 2014 first
Suns In: Chandler
Tor In: Shumpert, Okafor, Murrey, 2018 first

Toronto saves around 14 million.
Knicks keep 2015 plan alive.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=muxujng
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4954 » by BowlRips » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:30 pm

MKCATL wrote:3 way trade

Knicks out: Chandler, Shump, Murrey, 2018 first
Suns out: Okafor, 2014 first
Tor out: Lowry, Fields, Salmons

Knicks In: Lowry, Fields, Salmons, 2014 first
Suns In: Chandler
Tor In: Shumpert, Murrey, 2018 first

Toronto saves around 14 million.
Knicks keep 2015 plan alive.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=muxujng



I think you could probably keep Shumpert out of the deal and give them Felton. Especially if you take on Fields.
then send the 2014 first you get from PHX and andrea bargnani for Asik..
and flip shumpert for Faried.

It'd actually make sense.

Scenario I see is if you can make all these small deals and acquire some new pieces to surround Melo while keeping the 2015 plan alive then I dont see why not. First step is cashing in Chandler for a 1st rounder so we can get that trade chip

Asik
Faried
Melo
Tim Hardaway
Lowry

is a real solid lineup. and young
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4955 » by CroMo3196 » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:41 pm

The problem is the knicks do not have a 1st rd pick for the next couple of years and do not have a lot of cap space to sign good players. There was a rumored trade between the Knicks and the thunder which I really would want to happen. Knicks give: Chandler, Shump, Felton Thunder give: Westbrook, Perkins. The knicks are struggling at a lot of this this year which is rebounding and transition offense and defense. Westbrook is one of the best transition players in the NBA and plays pretty good defense. Perkins will help with defense and rebounding which the knicks can not do tight now. Chandler is a monster on defense but is a liability on offense. Once the amare deal is over they can sign westbrook to a long term deal. It is a idea but I do not think it will happen.
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4956 » by jwise44 » Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:43 pm

BowlRips wrote:
MKCATL wrote:3 way trade

Knicks out: Chandler, Shump, Murrey, 2018 first
Suns out: Okafor, 2014 first
Tor out: Lowry, Fields, Salmons

Knicks In: Lowry, Fields, Salmons, 2014 first
Suns In: Chandler
Tor In: Shumpert, Murrey, 2018 first

Toronto saves around 14 million.
Knicks keep 2015 plan alive.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=muxujng



I think you could probably keep Shumpert out of the deal and give them Felton. Especially if you take on Fields.
then send the 2014 first you get from PHX and andrea bargnani for Asik..
and flip shumpert for Faried.

It'd actually make sense.

Scenario I see is if you can make all these small deals and acquire some new pieces to surround Melo while keeping the 2015 plan alive then I dont see why not. First step is cashing in Chandler for a 1st rounder so we can get that trade chip

Asik
Faried
Melo
Tim Hardaway
Lowry

is a real solid lineup. and young

The first this year finally makes andrea attractive to us, but with Andrea out probably for the year and most likely it being the pacers pick involved we say no

An unhappy Asik is worth more to us in the playoffs than a non existent over paid bargs at the backup 5
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Re: Knicks-Related Trade "THOUGHTS" Thread 

Post#4957 » by magnumt » Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:17 pm

BAF 1.0 - Wizards: Year 2
PG: Kemba Walker (32) / Rivers (16) / Felton
SG: Evan Fournier (28) / Evans (20) / Dotson
SF: Gordon Hayward (36)/ Delly (12) / Dudley
PF: Kevin Love (36) / Frye (12) / Ellenson
C: Pau Gasol (32) / Noah (16) / Felicio


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