OT: DiBlasio plans to turn payphones into free wifi hotspots

[PMFJB]

From the article:

There are so many other things you can do for inequality than to give free internet. How about outreach programs to minority groups. How about free job training. How about a number of other things than free internet which will be used to browse some dumb sites and nothing productive. Or is someone going to google their thesis on their phone while standing on the corner of 32nd.

The two elements aren't mutually exclusive. Let's say they show up to a city sponsored job training center or outreach program. Then they can check their email for replies using the free wifi, since unemployed low-income minorities would be the ones most hurt by a digital divide. This wifi program isn't replacing those other things like job outreach programs, but complementing them to create greater synergy.

If they need to check their email they can get a free library card and go use the free computer.

Wasting 200 million so they can check their email among looking at recreational sites is a waste of money.

Seriously do you actually think the majority of internet use will be for self improvement or recreational. Don't kid yourself this is not a poor/rich thing. We all do it.

[spaceballer]

Nothing from government is "free." This is the problem with taxation. The government collects taxes and spends the funds however they want. We have no say.

I oppose taxation however I'd me more inclined to be ok with it if we can also dictate what elective initiatives our tax dollars are spent on.

The initial setup costs will be ascribed as helping to bridge the digital divide, increasing access for poor and minority communities. From a practical economic perspective, increased access for those communities facilitates things like employment and commerce. From a civic perspective, it can increased access to city services and participation in democracy of a more informed public. So it's spending money to serve a public good, an investment in the future.

In abstract, the $200M might look like a big price tag. But we're NYC, America's largest city. It's only a one time charge, and peanuts compared to the city budget. We spend billions each year just on subway station renovations without blinking, for instance (The Fulton Center alone was $1.4 Billion). $200M is just a drop in the bucket of the city's $75 Billion annual budget that was just agreed on in June.

The ongoing operation of the program will be financed by advertising. Who knows, if run properly like most advertising platforms and businesses, it might even bring in money to the city.

That's because the Fulton Center provides transportation to countless of thousands white collar workes who probable provide the majority of taxes paid to the city of new york since their salaries are usually in the six figures.

That is a project worth supporting.

Internet on the corner so some guy can connect with their phone is dumb. Unless you can show me data that those minorities will use the connection for educational sites and NOT recreational sites then your assertion that it will help commerce and employment is false.

It is a waste of money.

Of course the Fulton Center and the subway system are worth supporting. I'm not saying otherwise, but I'm just pointing out that this is just a drop in the bucket compared to those and other expenditures to put costs into perspective.

It's a one time infrastructure and capital improvement cost that's a drop in the bucket of the $75 Billion budget. And ongoing costs will be paid for by advertising.

[PMFJB]

The initial setup costs will be ascribed as helping to bridge the digital divide, increasing access for poor and minority communities. From a practical economic perspective, increased access for those communities facilitates things like employment and commerce. From a civic perspective, it can increased access to city services and participation in democracy of a more informed public. So it's spending money to serve a public good, an investment in the future.

In abstract, the $200M might look like a big price tag. But we're NYC, America's largest city. It's only a one time charge, and peanuts compared to the city budget. We spend billions each year just on subway station renovations without blinking, for instance (The Fulton Center alone was $1.4 Billion). $200M is just a drop in the bucket of the city's $75 Billion annual budget that was just agreed on in June.

The ongoing operation of the program will be financed by advertising. Who knows, if run properly like most advertising platforms and businesses, it might even bring in money to the city.

That's because the Fulton Center provides transportation to countless of thousands white collar workes who probable provide the majority of taxes paid to the city of new york since their salaries are usually in the six figures.

That is a project worth supporting.

Internet on the corner so some guy can connect with their phone is dumb. Unless you can show me data that those minorities will use the connection for educational sites and NOT recreational sites then your assertion that it will help commerce and employment is false.

It is a waste of money.

Of course the Fulton Center and the subway system is worth supporting. I'm not saying otherwise, but I'm just pointing out that this is just a drop in the bucket compared to those and other expenditures to put costs into perspective.

It's a one time infrastructure and capital improvement cost that's a drop in the bucket of the $75 Billion budget. And ongoing costs will be paid for by advertising.

2000 million is not a drop in the bucket. That is like saying well you got a 100k ferrari so this 50k car is nothing.

200 million is a lot of money that can be used for the same agenda but in a much better way. Free internet doesn't do anything other than allow people who couldn't get on facebook now get on facebook free.

They are going to use it for recreational purposes and you and I know it. It is a waste.

[spaceballer]

That's because the Fulton Center provides transportation to countless of thousands white collar workes who probable provide the majority of taxes paid to the city of new york since their salaries are usually in the six figures.

That is a project worth supporting.

Internet on the corner so some guy can connect with their phone is dumb. Unless you can show me data that those minorities will use the connection for educational sites and NOT recreational sites then your assertion that it will help commerce and employment is false.

It is a waste of money.

Of course the Fulton Center and the subway system is worth supporting. I'm not saying otherwise, but I'm just pointing out that this is just a drop in the bucket compared to those and other expenditures to put costs into perspective.

It's a one time infrastructure and capital improvement cost that's a drop in the bucket of the $75 Billion budget. And ongoing costs will be paid for by advertising.

2000 million is not a drop in the bucket. That is like saying well you got a 100k ferrari so this 50k car is nothing.

200 million is a lot of money that can be used for the same agenda but in a much better way. Free internet doesn't do anything other than allow people who couldn't get on facebook now get on facebook free.

They are going to use it for recreational purposes and you and I know it. It is a waste.

A one-time capital infrastructure improvement investment of $200M is certainly a drop in the bucket of a $75B annual budget. It's not even 1% or even half a percent, I would call a one-time, non-recurring cost of 0.26% a drop in the bucket.

Does having some people, or even many people, use it for recreational purposes make other non-recreational uses any less legitimate? Guess what, many people use the subway for recreation to get around the city.

Libraries aren't open 24/7, not to mention the fact that they are location specific and more limiting.

[Jeff Van Gully]

Nothing from government is "free." This is the problem with taxation. The government collects taxes and spends the funds however they want. We have no say.

of course, you have say. government officials work to spend the money on what their voting base thinks they want them to spend it on. the official you voted for may not have won, but you still took part in the process of choosing that representative if you voted. that's really all we can ask.

and there are always referendums and bills up for vote locally. these aren't as sexy as presidential and mid-term elections, but they're usually the votes that affect our daily lives the most, yet get the least turnout.

do our representatives spend the money wisely and appropriately? those are the issues we have to perpetually address. but we can't say we don't have a say. we don't live in a dictatorship run by a warlord.

[lliiknicksiill33]

Nothing from government is "free." This is the problem with taxation. The government collects taxes and spends the funds however they want. We have no say.

of course, you have say. government officials work to spend the money on what their voting base thinks they want them to spend it on. the official you voted for may not have won, but you still took part in the process of choosing that representative if you voted. that's really all we can ask.

and there are always referendums and bills up for vote locally. these aren't as sexy as presidential and mid-term elections, but they're usually the votes that affect our daily lives the most, yet get the least turnout.

do our representatives spend the money wisely and appropriately? those are the issues we have to perpetually address. but we can't say we don't have a say. we don't live in a dictatorship run by a warlord.

Yes you vote on who you think is most afiliated with your thoughts/beliefs however when they get there they still do what THEY want. They still spend our money however THEY want. The problems is the more "free" stuff they give out it's an exchange for votes. Who is against "free" internet? Who is against "free" health care? Who is against 99 weeks of unemployment? Only "savages," "racists," and "extremists." Not people who want their government to be fiscally sound.

Little by little everything adds up. It's why we're what 17-18 trillion in debt.

[HixNixKnicksTix]

cool idea. kinda afraid of government being in control of internet/wifi. but theyre already spying so who cares.

The government in control of the internet? Have you been on the Internet lately? Last time I checked my porn folder, everything was cool and has been for quite awhile.

Would you prefer to be f*cked by private industry. See e.g. net neutrality.

free enterprise rules the internet. (btw as it is... internet aint all that expensive) what i'm saying is that if the government has any say in "hot spots" or any expanse, it will be subject to 24.7 surveillance... legally. they already have those advantages anyway. but now there wouldnt be eric snowden.

[HixNixKnicksTix]

cool idea. kinda afraid of government being in control of internet/wifi. but theyre already spying so who cares.

Also from the article:

Officials also sought to pre-empt the privacy concerns. The city said it would “never share or sell any protected personal information” collected on the network. But companies may use aggregate data, information extracted anonymously from a pool of users, to guide advertising.

patriot act trumps that, my friend

[JSmooth93]

Ya'll are silly as fu** for arguing about something already happening that you can't control.


I think the fault lies in the initial belief that people with power care about you and your opinions.

[Stannis]

More WiFi = more mobile business transactions which are good for the economy. On top of this, people could save on data overages and stop paying hefty fines to these multi-billion dollar cellphone companies. Use that money elsewhere.

Great idea! This guy is thinking ahead!

EDIT: And who said they aren't thinking of the poor and homeless? Now the poor and homeless can enjoy some free internet. This guy is a hero!

[gavran]

This is pretty helpful for those that don't want to use their data plan outside of their homes. Who uses those payphones anymore? Get rid of them.

I saw a guy take a dump in one of them in the middle of the day. I belive it was in Harlem.

[PMFJB]

Of course the Fulton Center and the subway system is worth supporting. I'm not saying otherwise, but I'm just pointing out that this is just a drop in the bucket compared to those and other expenditures to put costs into perspective.

It's a one time infrastructure and capital improvement cost that's a drop in the bucket of the $75 Billion budget. And ongoing costs will be paid for by advertising.

2000 million is not a drop in the bucket. That is like saying well you got a 100k ferrari so this 50k car is nothing.

200 million is a lot of money that can be used for the same agenda but in a much better way. Free internet doesn't do anything other than allow people who couldn't get on facebook now get on facebook free.

They are going to use it for recreational purposes and you and I know it. It is a waste.

A one-time capital infrastructure improvement investment of $200M is certainly a drop in the bucket of a $75B annual budget. It's not even 1% or even half a percent, I would call a one-time, non-recurring cost of 0.26% a drop in the bucket.

Does having some people, or even many people, use it for recreational purposes make other non-recreational uses any less legitimate? Guess what, many people use the subway for recreation to get around the city.

Libraries aren't open 24/7, not to mention the fact that they are location specific and more limiting.

You just compared subways to free internet. Do you realize how dumb that is? People pay to use the subway. It is not free for starters. It is a necessity for everyone since the cost of owning a car in the city is ridiculous when you take into account the parking costs.

You haven't thought this through. You right now are in the "rah rah let's help the poor camp" without actually thinkin if a cost benefit anaylisis.

Just because 200 million is only a percenatge of a percentage point of the city's budget doesn't make its absolute value small or a drop in the bucket.

YOU Also BIRNG Up mobile commerce as a positive. Why would that be a positive.

So let me get this straight. People who don't have enough money to get Internet will now magically have extra cash flow to buy things online. So wait why not use that extra money to begin with to get internet?

You haven't brought up one valid point yet only "it will help poor people". Yet you can't quantify that.

Guess what if you were in business and someone gave you 200 million to invest and you couldn't provide a simple roi analysis on your investment decision you would be put of a job. Which is exactly what you are doing here.

" it will help the poor" is not a roi anaylisis it is a moral belief.
Sorry but if my taxpayer dollars will go to any project I would like to know that it will provide a good return in onvestment. Not just charity for people who may or may not deserve it.

[duetta]

I'm probably one of the last Americans to not own a cellphone. I just don't need it - and don't want to pay for something I don't need. But it would be good to be able to be actually get reception on my tablet in the city (which I could then use Skype with to make a call).

[Slamm Goodbody]

The initiative, known as LinkNYC, will be paid for by advertising revenues from the kiosks’ digital displays.

This also isn't new, other municipalities have done this, just not a place as big as NYC.

[DrKnick]

I use payphone and Go Phone.

[PMFJB]

The initiative, known as LinkNYC, will be paid for by advertising revenues from the kiosks’ digital displays.

This also isn't new, other municipalities have done this, just not a place as big as NYC.

If it's fully paid for by ads the by all means do whatever you want.

[DrKnick]

I'm probably one of the last Americans to not own a cellphone. I just don't need it - and don't want to pay for something I don't need. But it would be good to be able to be actually get reception on my tablet in the city (which I could then use Skype with to make a call).

Just get a Go Phone. Pretty much pay-phone-mobile...

[Handledatruth]

How could anyone complain about this? Free availability to the world's biggest marketplace and source of information? Also an additional way to keep tabs on IPs with ill intent? That's exciting, I'm kinda mad I left...actually no, paying to park in my own apartment sucks. Would take more than free Wifi to bring me back.

[Moose]

He has been a terrible mayor thus far, so I imagine this new idea will also end terribly.

Privacy violations, emergency calls, waste of money...those are a few reasons as to why this should be on the backburner.

And lol at pointing towards inequality for a reason to do this. People must have really lost perspective. I can't believe some just won't be able to play words with friends for a couple of hours. The agony. Streaming a high def video only takes up 400mb of data. You can use your GPS in needed situations.

Maybe keep the payphones for those those who don't have the money to buy a 600 dollar smartphone. We should teach young people how to save their money instead of marketing them to blow their monthly pay on an overrated iPhone.

[Moose]

cool idea. kinda afraid of government being in control of internet/wifi. but theyre already spying so who cares.

The government in control of the internet? Have you been on the Internet lately? Last time I checked my porn folder, everything was cool and has been for quite awhile.

Would you prefer to be f*cked by private industry. See e.g. net neutrality.

I generally like you Wingo, but sometimes your line of thinking...ugh...

The last thing we should want is to ruin a good thing. Keep all governments away from the internet. I don't feel like paying to do a Google search. I rather rely on independent innovators and geniuses to keep the internet awesome. A government, any government, will only ruin it.

If I were visiting this site in China, they can decide ''nope, not today'', and stop me from doing it. So, please, stop with this line of thinking that the government in control of everything is the best way. It is one lf the most dangerous mindsets a person can have.