Max Out All-Star Jimmy Butler

[Jeffrey]

I see the comments about just making a max offer to get the Bulls to match. The only issue with that is what happens if JB doesnt sign that offer sheet?

Perhaps he may want to stay in Chicago long term, and recognizes the importance of getting paid and being competitive.

Usually guys in the $13-16m range push for max deals ... Even Marc Gasol who will "never leave Memphis" signed a max offer sheet with Houston irc.

It's just hard to see Chicago not matching though. I bet they would keep him over paying Noah next summer. Right now he's basically their only reliable non-big.

Give him the poison pill contract or is that too late?

[ORANGEandBLUE]

Butler is better than Lance and not crazy but I don't believe Jimmy is this good, though I like him a lot.

He doesn't even have to be this good to be worth $17m.

[Jeffrey]

Butler is better than Lance and not crazy but I don't believe Jimmy is this good, though I like him a lot.

He doesn't even have to be this good to be worth $17m.

You're right. Butler is going to get a max contract somewhere or close to it. He just needs 1 GM to give it to him. He is still a below average 3 point shooter which is something I like for a 2 guard.

It's either him or Wesley Mathews. Both will net 12+ million dollars easily when they hit free agency.

[Jeff Van Gully]

i thought butler was crazy for passing on the 40 million... now everyone who doubted him looks like a moron. i just hope this isn't for the contract.

based on what we're seeing this year, he's the type of player every team should want. team butler. i'd def put that max offer on the table just to see if chicago would match it. if not, we've done worse with money.

jimmy should definitely be in the conversation. see if we can jeremy lin poison pill him away.

[Workforce250]

Think about Jackson's possible chess move:
Max out Butler for the Bulls and sign Noah next year to be the ultimate big man post passer needed for the Triangle.

Hmmmm sounds like a Jackson move from the playbook. We don't even have the players for a sign and trade. It'll be all about the Benjamins and we'll have plenty.

[Scalabrine]

It's amazing how much he's improved. Definitely getting maxed out and Chicago FO definitely regrets not extending him before the year.

They tried. He turned down 4 years 40 million.

He knew he was gonna prove he was worth the max. Chicago won't let him go even as cheap as they are.

Jimmy is proof NY is toxic. Their rookie years Jimmy and Shump were even. Jimmy decided to dedicate himself to basketball while Shump decided to live like the star he wasn't.

thats what proves it?

Iman Shumpert!?

Maybe its just that Shump thought he made it and Jimmy was still thirsty.

[nykballa2k4]

The Bulls would rather pay the luxury tax than lose Butler. And to the Knicks of all teams.

may as well force their hand. Same to Spurs Kawhi Leonard.

[ingvald]

To answer my own question. I think Noah is, in the New York Market. I would Max him out the following year 2016.
Dare to say we'd be ready to roll.

Noah's next contract is an interesting/dicey situation. He's unquestionably the team's leader, heart, and soul. But a 30 year old center with knee/foot problems and a game based on hustle, energy and effort looking for a max deal makes me skittish. I'm not sure what the Bulls should do and honestly, he could turn into a classic FA overpay. Don't get me wrong- I love Noah and think you guys would too. A lot depends on the Bulls' ability to find a younger replacement in the next year or two. They've got the Kings' pick (top 10 protected), Cavs' swap 1st, and Taj as a tradable asset. In a best case scenario, they package assets to move into the top 10, get a guy like Cauley-Stein, let him come off the bench for a year, and Noah walks after next season.

To clarify the Bulls cap again- they've got $63M committed next season and I think the luxury tax will be around $81M, leaving $18M to sign Butler. Plus Taj's $8.5M may be gone as well. I don't think they'll need to go over the tax or simply dump salary to re-sign Butler.

[Workforce250]

To answer my own question. I think Noah is, in the New York Market. I would Max him out the following year 2016.
Dare to say we'd be ready to roll.

Noah's next contract is an interesting/dicey situation. He's unquestionably the team's leader, heart, and soul. But a 30 year old center with knee/foot problems and a game based on hustle, energy and effort looking for a max deal makes me skittish. I'm not sure what the Bulls should do and honestly, he could turn into a classic FA overpay. Don't get me wrong- I love Noah and think you guys would too. A lot depends on the Bulls' ability to find a younger replacement in the next year or two. They've got the Kings' pick (top 10 protected), Cavs' swap 1st, and Taj as a tradable asset. In a best case scenario, they package assets to move into the top 10, get a guy like Cauley-Stein, let him come off the bench for a year, and Noah walks after next season.

To clarify the Bulls cap again- they've got $63M committed next season and I think the luxury tax will be around $81M, leaving $18M to sign Butler. Plus Taj's $8.5M may be gone as well. I don't think they'll need to go over the tax or simply dump salary to re-sign Butler.

Hey Bull's fan, thanks for the input.
If the Knicks force the Bulls to match a max deal, there is a very strong possibility that they would let Noah walk the following year. However, the triple-double threat that Noah brings is not easy to replace. So the Bulls have a tough choice in 2016.

To be honest, the Bulls have been knocking on the door for years now and can't seem to reach the next level for many reasons. A Ray Allen can help this year and next, however 2016 will get tougher without Noah.

[ingvald]

Hey Bull's fan, thanks for the input.
If the Knicks force the Bulls to match a max deal, there is a very strong possibility that they would let Noah walk the following year. However, the triple-double threat that Noah brings is not easy to replace. So the Bulls have a tough choice in 2016.

To be honest, the Bulls have been knocking on the door for years now and can't seem to reach the next level for many reasons. A Ray Allen can help this year and next, however 2016 will get tougher without Noah.

Its always been about health. If they can stay healthy and add another shooter/wing (not sold on Allen) that'd put them over the top.

I'm a firm believer in building a team thru the draft. Not just with the NBA- look at how the Bulls, Blackhawks, Cubs, and Sox have been built compared to the effin' Bears. You want Kane/Toews, Butler/Rose, or Cutler/Marshall? You always overpay for impact FAs and I've personally never seen a great return on the money spent.

But yeah, they'll have to replace Noah sooner rather than later. Hopefully Rose, Butler, McDermott, and Mirotic are long-term answers but who knows at this point.

[E-Balla]

They tried. He turned down 4 years 40 million.

He knew he was gonna prove he was worth the max. Chicago won't let him go even as cheap as they are.

Jimmy is proof NY is toxic. Their rookie years Jimmy and Shump were even. Jimmy decided to dedicate himself to basketball while Shump decided to live like the star he wasn't.

thats what proves it?

Iman Shumpert!?

Maybe its just that Shump thought he made it and Jimmy was still thirsty.

Why does everyone we sign seem to get lazy? Something tells me it's the team not just the players (I'd give it a 50/50 split).

[Scalabrine]

He knew he was gonna prove he was worth the max. Chicago won't let him go even as cheap as they are.

Jimmy is proof NY is toxic. Their rookie years Jimmy and Shump were even. Jimmy decided to dedicate himself to basketball while Shump decided to live like the star he wasn't.

thats what proves it?

Iman Shumpert!?

Maybe its just that Shump thought he made it and Jimmy was still thirsty.

Why does everyone we sign seem to get lazy? Something tells me it's the team not just the players (I'd give it a 50/50 split).

Give me another example.

Amare wasnt lazy, he was just injured, still worked his butt off and didnt just go "into chill mode".
David Lee was a super hard worker.
Raymond Felton was known as a lazy POS before we signed him.
Jason Smith is having one of his best years of his career and hes been healthy.
Jeremy Lin, Steve Novak, Landry Fields, Shawne Williams all had career years with us and then got multi year deals to play elsewhere.
Quentin Richardson had severe lower back problems that forced him out of the league.
Eddy Curry, Bargnani and Jerome James were that way before they were Knicks they just collected checks.

Who on earth are you talking about?

[E-Balla]

thats what proves it?

Iman Shumpert!?

Maybe its just that Shump thought he made it and Jimmy was still thirsty.

Why does everyone we sign seem to get lazy? Something tells me it's the team not just the players (I'd give it a 50/50 split).

Give me another example.

Amare wasnt lazy, he was just injured, still worked his butt off and didnt just go "into chill mode".
David Lee was a super hard worker.
Raymond Felton was known as a lazy POS before we signed him.
Jason Smith is having one of his best years of his career and hes been healthy.
Jeremy Lin, Steve Novak, Landry Fields, Shawne Williams all had career years with us and then got multi year deals to play elsewhere.
Quentin Richardson had severe lower back problems that forced him out of the league.
Eddy Curry, Bargnani and Jerome James were that way before they were Knicks they just collected checks.

Who on earth are you talking about?

Jerome James was not like that he came into training camp out of shape but before that was working his way from the Euroleague and the Globetrotters. Eddy Curry got even lazier in NY than he was in Chicago. JR Smith was allowed to run buckshot on the team. Tyson Chandler got lazy. Landry Fields did too that second year and Timmy looks to be on his way to joining Landry and Shump is guys that overplayed their skills in year 2 and ended up never really improving.

[DaGawd]

Could you imagine that perimeter defense if we found a way to get both Butler and Leonard? Won't happen I know but it's damn nice to think about

[Scalabrine]

Why does everyone we sign seem to get lazy? Something tells me it's the team not just the players (I'd give it a 50/50 split).

Give me another example.

Amare wasnt lazy, he was just injured, still worked his butt off and didnt just go "into chill mode".
David Lee was a super hard worker.
Raymond Felton was known as a lazy POS before we signed him.
Jason Smith is having one of his best years of his career and hes been healthy.
Jeremy Lin, Steve Novak, Landry Fields, Shawne Williams all had career years with us and then got multi year deals to play elsewhere.
Quentin Richardson had severe lower back problems that forced him out of the league.
Eddy Curry, Bargnani and Jerome James were that way before they were Knicks they just collected checks.

Who on earth are you talking about?

Jerome James was not like that he came into training camp out of shape but before that was working his way from the Euroleague and the Globetrotters. Eddy Curry got even lazier in NY than he was in Chicago. JR Smith was allowed to run buckshot on the team. Tyson Chandler got lazy. Landry Fields did too that second year and Timmy looks to be on his way to joining Landry and Shump is guys that overplayed their skills in year 2 and ended up never really improving.

I think its safe to assume you didnt follow Jerome James prior to the Knicks. Youre really trying to say a 7'1 big man was on the Globetrotters and Euroleague but couldnt make it in the NBA and it had nothing to do with him being out of shape. Google his name he was a baloon on the Kings, Sonics (trash bag pic), and in the euro leagues.

Fields didnt get lazy, he was just never great and his jump shot went to **** after that wrist injury, he was a 2nd round pick anyway. Chandler getting lazy is way overblown.

JR Smith and Eddy Curry were known for the terrible work ethic and as bad teammates, New York didnt do that to them. You paint it on New York but really its Knicks managements fault for signing players with risky mannerisms. Even then, you have maybe 2-3 guys out of the hundred or so Knicks that have been here in the past decade.

[E86]

Jimmy Butler strikes me as a guy who won't do well outside the system he's in, like Lance. Like those late first round or second round pick players that spark really quick and fizzle out... Ben Wallace, Redd, Arenas and Lewis type of player.

Those guys all had great NBA careers as 2nd rounders.

I agree, but all were given huge contracts they never lived up to.

[dc]

Give him the poison pill contract or is that too late?

The poison pill doesn't apply to players like Butler who have their Bird rights with their home team.

Only applies to "Early Bird" restricted FAs like Lin and Asik who played 2 years or less in the league and don't have Full Bird rights. See the Gilbert Arenas Rule in the salary cap FAQ for what the poison pill really is.

Bottom line is it will NEVER have anything to do with a 1st round pick who plays out all 4 years on a rookie deal.

[Meat]

Could you imagine that perimeter defense if we found a way to get both Butler and Leonard? Won't happen I know but it's damn nice to think about

i think we can if we dump calderon, their maxes should both be about 16mil right?

[Damas]

Funny how Butler progressed to an all star player while Shumpert regressed to a pathetic fringe 6th man. One dedicated to his craft every day, while the other became a lazy slob who was messing with women and buying expensive shoes.

[Fat Kat]

Butler is better than Lance and not crazy but I don't believe Jimmy is this good, though I like him a lot.

He doesn't even have to be this good to be worth $17m.

You're right. Butler is going to get a max contract somewhere or close to it. He just needs 1 GM to give it to him. He is still a below average 3 point shooter which is something I like for a 2 guard.

It's either him or Wesley Mathews. Both will net 12+ million dollars easily when they hit free agency.

We can also throw some money at Affalo and see if it's matched.