So far, what grade would you give Phil Jackson for this Free Agency?

Blue Ninja · Post #141 » by **Blue Ninja** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 12:08 am

EdgeOf wrote:
Blue Ninja wrote:
EdgeOf wrote:. You think Derrick Williams is an asset so

Could be =/= is.

Ok we will see.....

15 PPg right?

He could in the right role. Could =/= will.

EdgeOf · Post #142 » by **EdgeOf** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 1:09 am

Blue Ninja wrote:
EdgeOf wrote:
Blue Ninja wrote:
Could be =/= is.

Ok we will see.....

15 PPg right?

He could in the right role. Could =/= will.

We are having the same conversation in 2 different threads.

Let me put it bluntly: I DON'T SHARE YOUR OPTIMISM

The more minutes for this kid the more his flaws (which are bountiful) are exposed.

He's going to be that lawn chair on defense that costs us eight straight points and then follows it up with a lob dunk on offense and all the lesser intelligent posters on here are going to clap their hands together and talk about what a dunk it was.....

I don't know how much more evidence you need that he is a terrible player, usually on this board we trust in what other teams who have had the player and what they say about them, along with metrics, but not this time. This time we have some loon raving about Rick Adelman running a triangle for 2 years and how this makes Williams suck less when his own coach from LAST YEAR told him a Coke machine could get more rebounds. Yes it is different systems but it was also an older and more mature player who didn't come within 3 feet of a rebound the entire 26 minutes he played in that game.

The triangle isn't going to save suck, if it did we would have been playoff bound last year.

Blue Ninja · Post #143 » by **Blue Ninja** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 1:18 am

EdgeOf wrote:We are having the same conversation in 2 different threads.

Let me put it bluntly: I DON'T SHARE YOUR OPTIMISM

The more minutes for this kid the more his flaws (which are bountiful) are exposed.

He's going to be that lawn chair on defense that costs us eight straight points and then follows it up with a lob dunk on offense and all the lesser intelligent posters on here are going to clap their hands together and talk about what a dunk it was.....

I don't know how much more evidence you need that he is a terrible player, usually on this board we trust in what other teams who have had the player and what they say about them, along with metrics, but not this time. This time we have some loon raving about Rick Adelman running a triangle for 2 years and how this makes Williams sucks less when his own coach from LAST YEAR told him a Coke machine could get more rebounds. Yes it different systems but it was an older more mature player who didn't come within 3 feet of a rebound the entire 26 minutes he played in that game.

The triangle isn't going to save suck, if it did we would have been playoff bound last year.

I get it and if you see my scouting report on games I've watched on him: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=1397315&start=360#p44208326 (and I will watch more), I share the same concerns as you on his game. It's not blind optimism I'm going on. I've watched a few games of him and there is hope for his defense yet. Rebounding wise, you have to have a nose for, but he can improve his boxing out. He'll never be a great rebounder I agree, but can he not be a decent scorer in this system? I mean he is tailor made for it with his cutting ability, athleticism, and if he can shoot it from the midrange and corner on open looks then he looks to be a great fit. Maybe he can find a good role here and improve on the things that he can. If not, it's just a 2 year contract at a decent rate.

This website has full games: http://nbahd.com/tag/nba-full-replay/ Just watch him for a few games and tell me what you think. I suggest watching late in the season when he was playing more and under a new coach. Played better in an open system. Now I'm gonna go out and get drunk and watch the fireworks. lol. Happy 4th of July!

Oscirus · Post #144 » by **Oscirus** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 1:25 am

B struck out on all of the major acquisitions (including that bungled Aldridge meeting) but still managed to improvise once plans a and b failed.

Mush Man · Post #145 » by **Mush Man** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 1:29 am

Somewhere between B and A-

In general I am loving these moves. This is the type of team that is going to make Melo look like a beast!

When all of a sudden there is a smart, 2-way team all around him, it's going to free him up to excel within the system and still have enough energy to takeover when it's required (instead of having to take over every second he is on the floor).

I bet even his defense will seem way better just because he won't be on the floor with 2-3 other shotty defenders. All of a sudden the story line is going to be "Melo really is stepping up on both ends of the floor" - mark my words

Crystal Ball - A strong finish leeds to 48 wins and the 3-4 seed - behind Miami and Cleveland - a game or two ahead of either Washington, Atlanta or both. Toronto and Chicago are going to crater but still make the playoffs and Milwaukee, Brooklyn, Boston and Charlotte will all be fighting for the 8h seed with Milwaukee pulling it out.

AmazingJason · Post #146 » by **AmazingJason** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 1:43 am

A-

- Drafted a future superstar in Porzingis
- Stole Grant, a future 10-year starter in the triangle, for a scrub whose only skill is inefficient chucking
- Drafted a young Marc Gasol
- Signed a 2nd scorer with a value deal (Afflalo)
- Signed a playoff starter-caliber C to a decent deal (Lopez)
- Signed a perfect triangle big to the deal of a century (O'Quinn)

-D-Will sucks, but I can see him being decent in the triangle with his ability to cut, finish, and hit corner 3-balls.

Mush Man · Post #147 » by **Mush Man** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 1:54 am

Oscirus wrote:managed to improvise once plans a and b failed.

applying triangle principles to the GM game

Clyde_Style · Post #148 » by **Clyde_Style** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 1:54 am

If you expected Phil to land a top free agent, he failed. Since that was never ever going to happen since nobody established and top shelf and in their prime would ever come to this team in its current state, Phil did OK.

The only trade I'm aware of where Phil came out on top since being GM was the Jerian Grant deal. That was great. Got rid of a dud who should have been traded a year ago and should now be worthless and maybe got a future starting PG with a reputed brain.

The rest is just unknown. Porzingis could be made of chalk and an ambulance case or could pack on muscle and be a total stud. All that means is the Melo signing was stupid, but it was always dumb and now Phil is actually expressing his true belief system a day late and a dollar short.

And the continued public triangle statements don't fully jive with some of the free agent signings like Williams, so it is all just a mash-up like it has been since Phil came on board.

Kind of hard to grade a mostly incompetent GM who has been most raped by other GMs and been winging it. He did sign Melo who is the opposite of building a triangle roster, so Phil has behind the 8-Ball and sending mixed messages from the very beginning. Kind of hard to clean up his already substantial mess in one off-season, but considering the circumstances it was OK and not bad and may be excellent if Melo begs to be traded in 12 months and Porzingis is a monster who sprouts muscles and clubs opposing teams to death ahead of schedule. WTF knows

eathb_au · Post #149 » by **eathb_au** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 2:00 am

Kind hard to grade when Phil made moves that were geared towards rebuilding except that he doesn't have a draft pick.

RHODEY · Post #150 » by **RHODEY** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 2:35 am

I think Phils doing a lot better than the Lakers front office at this point, I wonder if BSPN will acknowledge this.

riter · Post #151 » by **riter** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 3:02 am

As far as I can tell, the knicks currently have only 2 legit starters on their roster.
Robin Lopez and Carmelo Anthony.

AmazingJason · Post #152 » by **AmazingJason** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 3:58 am

No lie, the entire time the couple of peeps on this board were hyping up O'Quinn prior to FA, I thought he was white

KNIXFAN_83 · Post #153 » by **KNIXFAN_83** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 4:03 am

Based on 17 win season I give him A

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Nostrand Ave · Post #154 » by **Nostrand Ave** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 4:09 am

riter wrote:As far as I can tell, the knicks currently have only 2 legit starters on their roster.
Robin Lopez and Carmelo Anthony.

THIS.

But somehow we will double our wins this season. :lol:

spikeslovechild · Post #155 » by **spikeslovechild** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 4:16 am

C-

This team was not a couple of role players away it needed star talent someone who could play with Melo. LMA was that guy and Phil couldn't even get him to interview with us.

Robin Lopez is a decent player but he's no batman. Heck he's not even a robin (pun intended) on a good team. He's alfred. Paying him 54 million is an overpay but it's one you can live with if it helped you recruit another big name player. Not as the centerpiece of your offseason and certainly not for team who won 17 games the year before.

Williams and Afflalo are gambles we shouldn't have been taking. Williams game is entirely predicated on offense unfortunately he gets most of his points close to the basket and his jumpshot comes and goes. Not sure he is a fit for the triangle. Arron Afflalo I've been hearing alot of love for and I'm not sure I understand why. He was awful last year with a VORP of .1. Maybe he regains what he showed in Orlando but if not then Phil got taken.

Quinn isn't a guy who will move the needle one way or another. If the signing was coupled with a talented big name you'd be giving Phil an A. Unfortunately, Robin isn't that guy neither is Afflalo.

Carl_Karlson · Post #156 » by **Carl_Karlson** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 4:20 am

Shyt, he knows what he's doing...

goldenbrandon · Post #157 » by **goldenbrandon** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 6:16 am

Solid. Not great not bad. Didn't care for Affalo or Williams. We missed big time on Monroe. Lopez was a great backup plan. O Quinn could be the steal. Fisher cost us 2 spots in the draft.

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NCHeels2008 · Post #158 » by **NCHeels2008** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 6:24 am

B-

I think if Lopez is getting that much you go after the next level down and hope you can coach them up (KK, Ed Davis) If it doesn't work out you can throw crazy money at Whiteside next year.
I love the Afflalo deal, I think he was asked to carry too much of an offensive load in Orlando and was clearly hurt in Portland. This would've been an A+ signing if you could've gotten year 2 as a TO instead of a PO. Personally, I would rather have signed him to 2/20 with the option on the team end. Imagine if last year I told you Carroll would go for nearly twice the money as AA. I think you really got a steal here.
K O'Q a worthy flyer and you didn't overpay
Derrick Williams probably won't do much in the league and the 2nd year being a player option makes the deal even more lame, but it's not a huge deal in the grand scheme of things.

DrCoach · Post #159 » by **DrCoach** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 6:48 am

Solid B

I'll upgrade it to A because he has to hear all this juvenile whining from armchair experts

Marty McFly · Post #160 » by **Marty McFly** » Sun Jul 5, 2015 6:58 am

Oscirus wrote:B struck out on all of the major acquisitions (including that bungled Aldridge meeting) but still managed to improvise once plans a and b failed.

what aldrigde meeting? lamarcus canceled when he heard he'd be asked to play the 5 here. secondly, he's got kids in texas. it was probably always going to be the spurs.

who's plan b? monroe? rumor has it the knicks didn't offer monroe a contract. so he probably wasn't a serious option anyway.