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Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17

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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1241 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Apr 18, 2017 9:32 pm

NYKAL wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:George Karl (still a famous dbag) on Melo:

"Coaching him meant working around his defense and compensating for his attitude."

No WAY! I mean, we've never seen any of those aspects of Melo during his time as a Knickl :noway:


George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.


Other than going over the top on personal stuff about Melo, Martin etc, the comments seem fairly accurate. He certainly wore thin on all his players but the guy kept having an NBA coaching job for a zillion years before he stopped coaching. Must be because he's a terrible coach who doesn't know what he's talking about.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1242 » by NYKAL » Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:06 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:George Karl (still a famous dbag) on Melo:

"Coaching him meant working around his defense and compensating for his attitude."

No WAY! I mean, we've never seen any of those aspects of Melo during his time as a Knickl :noway:


George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.


Other than going over the top on personal stuff about Melo, Martin etc, the comments seem fairly accurate. He certainly wore thin on all his players but the guy kept having an NBA coaching job for a zillion years before he stopped coaching. Must be because he's a terrible coach who doesn't know what he's talking about.



Ray Allen and others disagree with you. Also, Dude was king of thr regular season but, his teams always crash and burned in the post season.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1243 » by knicksh20b » Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:27 pm

lol at the people saying Phil is "rebuilding."

Guess Isiah Thomas was rebuilding too, over and over again, with useless veteran players.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1244 » by thebuzzardman » Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:49 pm

NYKAL wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.


Other than going over the top on personal stuff about Melo, Martin etc, the comments seem fairly accurate. He certainly wore thin on all his players but the guy kept having an NBA coaching job for a zillion years before he stopped coaching. Must be because he's a terrible coach who doesn't know what he's talking about.



Ray Allen and others disagree with you. Also, Dude was king of thr regular season but, his teams always crash and burned in the post season.


I'm not a fan of George Karl. I always thought he was arrogant and later on, I thought overrated, because of his playoff record. But a guy can be a decent, if not great coach and an a*hole, but still have some valid things to say based on years of experience. Also, whatever you think of Karl, D'Antoni, now Hornacek/Phil, these sort of comments about Melo seem to follow him around. I could discount one of them, but at 3, it's sort of starting to add up. And yes, the Knick never put the right sort of team around Melo and that's on them, but Melo has not a lot of compromise in his approach to the game. Not none, but not a lot.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1245 » by K-DOT » Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:42 pm

knicksh20b wrote:lol at the people saying Phil is "rebuilding."

Guess Isiah Thomas was rebuilding too, over and over again, with useless veteran players.

Kristaps
Willy
Baker
Randle
NDour
Plumlee
7th pick
2 2nds

Makes 9 players next year under 25
Only Melo, Lee, and Noah are going to be over 30 and are under contract next year
Wow, so old
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1246 » by moocow007 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:58 pm

K-DOT wrote:
knicksh20b wrote:lol at the people saying Phil is "rebuilding."

Guess Isiah Thomas was rebuilding too, over and over again, with useless veteran players.

Kristaps
Willy
Baker
Randle
NDour
Plumlee
7th pick
2 2nds

Makes 9 players next year under 25
Only Melo, Lee, and Noah are going to be over 30 and are under contract next year
Wow, so old


Let's be real honest here. IF Jackson had a choice he'd dump Baker, Randle, NDour and Plumlee (4 guys that may not be part of the regular rotation or even the roster of a lot of teams) in a second. 2nd round picks? If he valued 2nd round picks he'd have kept the Knicks own. As it is the Knicks don't have their own 2nd round pick until 2022. These "2nd round picks" also are basically all he's gotten from trades. And now he's gone and alienated his bread and butter in a rebuild. Jackson may rebuild, but he hasn't thus far in the 3 years he's been here. He's tried to retool and win on the fly and he's failed miserably at it. Will he finally see the light? Maybe. But he's shown no indication that he will not even by what he said the offseason plans were (look to sign defensively strong veterans).
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1247 » by K-DOT » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:05 pm

moocow007 wrote:
K-DOT wrote:
knicksh20b wrote:lol at the people saying Phil is "rebuilding."

Guess Isiah Thomas was rebuilding too, over and over again, with useless veteran players.

Kristaps
Willy
Baker
Randle
NDour
Plumlee
7th pick
2 2nds

Makes 9 players next year under 25
Only Melo, Lee, and Noah are going to be over 30 and are under contract next year
Wow, so old


Let's be real honest here. IF Jackson had a choice he'd dump Baker, Randle, NDour and Plumlee (4 guys that may not be part of the regular rotation or even the roster of a lot of teams) in a second. 2nd round picks? If he valued 2nd round picks he'd have kept the Knicks own. As it is the Knicks don't have their own 2nd round pick until 2022. These "2nd round picks" also are basically all he's gotten from trades. And now he's gone and alienated his bread and butter in a rebuild. Jackson may rebuild, but he hasn't thus far in the 3 years he's been here. He's tried to retool and win on the fly and he's failed miserably at it. Will he finally see the light? Maybe. But he's shown no indication that he will not even by what he said the offseason plans were (look to sign defensively strong veterans).

Well, yeah.
The argument that only KP, Willy, and Baker are any good out of our young players is valid, I was just responding to the notion that we're a team filled with just old veterans
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1248 » by knicksh20b » Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:11 pm

K-DOT wrote:
knicksh20b wrote:lol at the people saying Phil is "rebuilding."

Guess Isiah Thomas was rebuilding too, over and over again, with useless veteran players.

Kristaps
Willy
Baker
Randle
NDour
Plumlee
7th pick
2 2nds

Makes 9 players next year under 25
Only Melo, Lee, and Noah are going to be over 30 and are under contract next year
Wow, so old


Who said anything about age? I was talking about rebuilding.

Kristaps= born out of a failed playoff attempt, and some good scouting. Will give props to Phil for the scouting.
Willy=good trade. Props there.
7th pick=born out of a failed playoff attempt. Let's hope for good scouting. This 7th pick basically shows how bad that playoff effort was. If he was really rebuilding, we'd probably have a better pick.
Baker, Randle, NDour, Plumlee=good shots. Role players.

Melo, Lee, Noah, Rose, Jennings = all shots at a playoff team. Phil's plan was never to rebuild, and if it was, he did a half-ass attempt at it, and he should be fired for that stupid attempt. Phil's plan was to get to the playoffs, and that was a half-assed attempt too (and he should get fired). The man never tried to rebuild. He was forced into this lottery position, by his own incompetency.

Again, I repeat. Phil was not rebuilding. He tried to build a playoff team again, and he failed. He tried to build a triangle team, and he failed. So stop giving him credit for "rebuilding." You can give him credit for the age of this team, but he was forced in this position because he did such a bad job at winning. By your definition, Rob Hennigan did a better job of rebuilding.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1249 » by NYKAL » Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:14 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:
Other than going over the top on personal stuff about Melo, Martin etc, the comments seem fairly accurate. He certainly wore thin on all his players but the guy kept having an NBA coaching job for a zillion years before he stopped coaching. Must be because he's a terrible coach who doesn't know what he's talking about.



Ray Allen and others disagree with you. Also, Dude was king of thr regular season but, his teams always crash and burned in the post season.


I'm not a fan of George Karl. I always thought he was arrogant and later on, I thought overrated, because of his playoff record. But a guy can be a decent, if not great coach and an a*hole, but still have some valid things to say based on years of experience. Also, whatever you think of Karl, D'Antoni, now Hornacek/Phil, these sort of comments about Melo seem to follow him around. I could discount one of them, but at 3, it's sort of starting to add up. And yes, the Knick never put the right sort of team around Melo and that's on them, but Melo has not a lot of compromise in his approach to the game. Not none, but not a lot.



did you hear the crap he put out about Melo and K-mart not having Dads in their lives...dude is constantly stepping out of his f-ing place. He's lucky no one ever put hands on him. Lets not get into how he used to air players out in the media instead of speaking to them like MEN.
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Re: RE: Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1250 » by seren » Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:10 pm

NYKAL wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:George Karl (still a famous dbag) on Melo:

"Coaching him meant working around his defense and compensating for his attitude."

No WAY! I mean, we've never seen any of those aspects of Melo during his time as a Knickl :noway:


George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.

May be true about his personality but is what he said wrong? Hasn't Melo shown that you have to work around his lack of D?

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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1251 » by Yankeeknickfan » Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:16 pm

K-DOT wrote:
knicksh20b wrote:lol at the people saying Phil is "rebuilding."

Guess Isiah Thomas was rebuilding too, over and over again, with useless veteran players.

Kristaps
Willy
Baker
Randle
NDour
Plumlee
7th pick
2 2nds

Makes 9 players next year under 25
Only Melo, Lee, and Noah are going to be over 30 and are under contract next year
Wow, so old
Ndour, plumlee, and Randle suck


KP was born from a failed playoff attempt. Give the scouting credit

Willy was a good trade

Baker is a good role player


7th pick was another failed playoff season.
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Re: RE: Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1252 » by Yankeeknickfan » Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:16 pm

seren wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:George Karl (still a famous dbag) on Melo:

"Coaching him meant working around his defense and compensating for his attitude."

No WAY! I mean, we've never seen any of those aspects of Melo during his time as a Knickl :noway:


George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.

May be true about his personality but is what he said wrong? Hasn't Melo shown that you have to work around his lack of D?

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Mike Woodson didn't have any problems with Melo
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Re: RE: Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1253 » by thebuzzardman » Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:27 pm

Yankeeknickfan wrote:
seren wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.

May be true about his personality but is what he said wrong? Hasn't Melo shown that you have to work around his lack of D?

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app
Mike Woodson didn't have any problems with Melo


Mike Woodson was a sh*tty coach
Mike Woodson had an ISO offense that let Carmelo shoot all day long.

match made in heaven
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1254 » by seren » Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:40 pm

Yankeeknickfan wrote:
seren wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.

May be true about his personality but is what he said wrong? Hasn't Melo shown that you have to work around his lack of D?

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Mike Woodson didn't have any problems with Melo

Woodson 12/13 season is actually a good indicator to what I just said. Under Woodson, we built a squad that worked around Melo's defensive deficiencies. We got a whole lot of defensive minded veterans, moved Melo to power forward so that he didn't have to deal with mobile small forwards, played a whole lot of switching so that he didn't have to follow his guy (which by the way Woodson got a lot of crap for). It ended up not being enough once we faced Indiana as we couldn't deal with their size.

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Re: RE: Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1255 » by moocow007 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:08 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
Yankeeknickfan wrote:
seren wrote:May be true about his personality but is what he said wrong? Hasn't Melo shown that you have to work around his lack of D?

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app
Mike Woodson didn't have any problems with Melo


Mike Woodson was a sh*tty coach
Mike Woodson had an ISO offense that let Carmelo shoot all day long.

match made in heaven


Woodson also has been the most successful coach, the best winning record and the only coach that has managed to get this team into the playoffs. At the end of the day the Knicks front office has failed to put a team out there (Anthony or not). There are not many players playing in the NBA that you can replace Anthony with and be expected to win anything with the players the Knicks front office (not just Jackson) has managed to put on the roster. Lebron James, maybe James Harden when D'Antoni was here. Who else? At the end of the day it's about building a team running a system where everything fit. The only time they managed to come close to doing that was in 2012 under Woodson when the Knicks were actually being talked about as a legit team to knock off Miami before they hit one of the hottest streaks in recent memory that the Pacers were on.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1256 » by blueNorange » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:10 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
NYKAL wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:George Karl (still a famous dbag) on Melo:

"Coaching him meant working around his defense and compensating for his attitude."

No WAY! I mean, we've never seen any of those aspects of Melo during his time as a Knickl :noway:


George Karl lost all credibility regarding players long before he Coached the Nuggets. His former players seem to loath him. Even went as far as saying he preferred to coach only roll players, that he couldn't deal with Star personalities. If that's the case, dude should be coaching for some College or HS.


Other than going over the top on personal stuff about Melo, Martin etc, the comments seem fairly accurate. He certainly wore thin on all his players but the guy kept having an NBA coaching job for a zillion years before he stopped coaching. Must be because he's a terrible coach who doesn't know what he's talking about.

lmaoo people don't want to admit it because karl is a garbage person, but everything he's ever said about melo is 100% accurate.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1257 » by moocow007 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:11 pm

seren wrote:
Yankeeknickfan wrote:
seren wrote:May be true about his personality but is what he said wrong? Hasn't Melo shown that you have to work around his lack of D?

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app
Mike Woodson didn't have any problems with Melo

Woodson 12/13 season is actually a good indicator to what I just said. Under Woodson, we built a squad that worked around Melo's defensive deficiencies. We got a whole lot of defensive minded veterans, moved Melo to power forward so that he didn't have to deal with mobile small forwards, played a whole lot of switching so that he didn't have to follow his guy (which by the way Woodson got a lot of crap for). It ended up not being enough once we faced Indiana as we couldn't deal with their size.

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Indiana was on one of the most impressive hot streaks I have ever seen heading into the playoffs. The Knicks definitely were being talked about as a team that can do some serious damage. And that was with JR Smith being the Robin to Anthony's Batman. Why? Because the team fit Anthony and the system that Woodson was running. And Anthony was top 3 in the MVP voting wasn't he because of it. And Woodson was in the running for COY.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1258 » by god shammgod » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:11 pm

who cares if melo is a good person or not or difficult or whatever. what does any of that matter going forward ?
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1259 » by moocow007 » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:13 pm

god shammgod wrote:who cares if melo is a good person or not or difficult or whatever. what does any of that matter going forward ?


Honestly, what does that even really matter before? A lot of top teams had bad people...at the top of the roster. There were some serious **** in Boston during their Dynasty, in Detroit, in Chicago... I'm talking about full blown absolute awful human beings.
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Re: Phil will talk today at 2:30 - WRITEUP - pg 17 

Post#1260 » by god shammgod » Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:16 pm

moocow007 wrote:
god shammgod wrote:who cares if melo is a good person or not or difficult or whatever. what does any of that matter going forward ?


Honestly, what does that even really matter before? A lot of top teams had bad people...at the top of the roster. There were some serious **** in Boston during their Dynasty, in Detroit, in Chicago... I'm talking about full blown absolute awful human beings.


you're right. it's meaningless.
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