Welcome to Orlando #12 PG Elfrid Payton

[p0peye]

How many championships did they contribute to since 2000? Is that six out of the last 15? And, quite a few others were just Derek Fisher and Mario Chalmers. Not many superstar PG's with Ships during that time.

5/15 actually, but I would say it's 3/10 since handchecking was completely banned in 2004, IIRC. No, I'd say none of them was a real dominant superstar.

Jason Kidd was always my personal favorite in that span and I think that one thing is almost certain: Elf will be very fun to watch and we will have that privilege for a long time.

Edit: 4/10 since 2004 (3xSpurs + Celtics).

[Scottg247]

Lmao at rondo being a "leader". Where were you when he drove out the veteran superstars on his team with his bad attitude?

This almost isn't worth commenting on. He didn't drive anyone out of anywhere. Ainge moved players due to age and rebuild efforts...... Garnett and Pierce didn't want to leave.

Youre kidding yourself if you think rondo and garnett and co. Were totally cool the whole time they were there.

No team in the NBA is totally cool with each other all the time. hard nosed hard workers fight and argue all the time. You know how many people Kevin Garnett has rubbed the wrong way? Same with Pierce. Is what it is. Maybe OKC needs to do a little more of it......

[BadMofoPimp]

This almost isn't worth commenting on. He didn't drive anyone out of anywhere. Ainge moved players due to age and rebuild efforts...... Garnett and Pierce didn't want to leave.

Youre kidding yourself if you think rondo and garnett and co. Were totally cool the whole time they were there.

No team in the NBA is totally cool with each other all the time. hard nosed hard workers fight and argue all the time. You know how many people Kevin Garnett has rubbed the wrong way? Same with Pierce. Is what it is. Maybe OKC needs to do a little more of it......

I don't know if Shaq and Kobe ever got along. Jordan and Rodman?

The only teams I can think of that all got along were the Pistons, Mavericks and Spurs teams. Heat seemed to get along swell also.

[majortom71]

I am not sure why so many people are high on Westbrook, but just in case you forgot!

Spoiler:

[tiderulz]

I am not sure why so many people are high on Westbrook, but just in case you forgot!

Spoiler:

yeah, he isnt good at all and is stopped all the time by defenders..in case you forgot

[Scottg247]

I am not sure why so many people are high on Westbrook, but just in case you forgot!

Spoiler:

yeah, he isnt good at all and is stopped all the time by defenders..in case you forgot

Too bad none of them are for championships......

[tiderulz]

I am not sure why so many people are high on Westbrook, but just in case you forgot!

Spoiler:

yeah, he isnt good at all and is stopped all the time by defenders..in case you forgot

Too bad none of them are for championships......

meaning what? he isnt a good player? then feel bad for CP3, Patrick Ewing, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, etc, etc.

[BadMofoPimp]

Westbrook would make a great SG. As a PG, he is very good.

[RYgoBOOM]

Westbrook would make a great SG. As a PG, he is very good.

I second this.

Throw Vasquez on that team or Rubio and move Westbrook to SG and they are instantly better.

My .02

[MellowRose]

Do people intentionally ignore the fact that Rondo played with THREE FUTURE HOF'ers and with a Perkins who was a solid post defender making that championship Celtics team a veteran one? Not to mention, unlike OKC, they were not faced up against another superteam, such as the Heat.

RW, KD, and Ibaka are all very young players, with plenty of time to win multiple championships. I don't understand why people are bringing up the argument of Rondo already having a ring while RW has not so far. It is a pretty nonsensical argument.

If I was to pin the blame one one individual in the OKC organization, it would be Scott Brooks. He has done a terrible job, IMO. Constant ISO plays, with ZERO ball movement, despite the star power they have, is an indication of a lack of Brook's X and O's skills. Have Thibs, Pop, Carlisle, etc... leading this current OKC team, andthey would have had 2 championships so far.

[BadMofoPimp]

I think people confuse Westbrook trying to play Hero ball with Scott Brooks calling ISO plays.

[tiderulz]

I think people confuse Westbrook trying to play Hero ball with Scott Brooks calling ISO plays.

not that Westbrook doesnt play hero ball sometimes. But i think people confuse 'Hero ball" with Westbrook having to bail out OKC because they dont have plays called and OKC has to get a shot off when he is passed the ball with 5 seconds left in the shot clock and everyone standing around or KD dribbling the air out of the ball and not able to get past his man.

[BadMofoPimp]

I think people confuse Westbrook trying to play Hero ball with Scott Brooks calling ISO plays.

not that Westbrook doesnt play hero ball sometimes. But i think people confuse 'Hero ball" with Westbrook having to bail out OKC because they dont have plays called and OKC has to get a shot off when he is passed the ball with 5 seconds left in the shot clock and everyone standing around or KD dribbling the air out of the ball and not able to get past his man.

I agree. Westbrook is a gifted scorer. If only he was 2 inches taller, he would be one of the best SG's in the game.

[MellowRose]

I think people confuse Westbrook trying to play Hero ball with Scott Brooks calling ISO plays.

At times, perhaps. But there are long stretches in the middle of the game, where OKC just resorts to ISO ball and zero ball movement.

Again, put this current OKC team under an elite coach, and this team will murder any team it's up against. Can you imagine RW being controlled by Thibs? I would pay to watch every single OKC game if Thibs somehow got to OKC, although I'd pay even more for Thibs to come to Orlando!!!

[MellowRose]

I think people confuse Westbrook trying to play Hero ball with Scott Brooks calling ISO plays.

not that Westbrook doesnt play hero ball sometimes. But i think people confuse 'Hero ball" with Westbrook having to bail out OKC because they dont have plays called and OKC has to get a shot off when he is passed the ball with 5 seconds left in the shot clock and everyone standing around or KD dribbling the air out of the ball and not able to get past his man.

100% agee. People tend to just label that as "hero ball" since RW has that type of stigma already. But, then again, if we didn't have that cockiness, he wouldn't be the player he is today.

[majortom71]

I am not sure why so many people are high on Westbrook, but just in case you forgot!

Spoiler:

yeah, he isnt good at all and is stopped all the time by defenders..in case you forgot

Yea keep telling yourself that.

He certainly is a scoring threat when he has a hot hand as any volume scorer can be, however he is not imo a high IQ player that will make the difference in major playoff games.
Look at Tony Parker and how he runs the show. He does not need to drop 40 to carry his team, but knows how to effectively break down the defense and exploit the weak side to keep that SA offense efficient.
And sure you can point a finger at Scott Brooks but at the end of the day the floor general makes it happen on the court.

[GANGSTERDOG]

I think people confuse Westbrook trying to play Hero ball with Scott Brooks calling ISO plays.

not that Westbrook doesnt play hero ball sometimes. But i think people confuse 'Hero ball" with Westbrook having to bail out OKC because they dont have plays called and OKC has to get a shot off when he is passed the ball with 5 seconds left in the shot clock and everyone standing around or KD dribbling the air out of the ball and not able to get past his man.

I agree. Westbrook is a gifted scorer. If only he was 2 inches taller, he would be one of the best SG's in the game.

I think we drafted that guy last year with Our First round pick. Forgot his name already

[Scottg247]

yeah, he isnt good at all and is stopped all the time by defenders..in case you forgot

Too bad none of them are for championships......

meaning what? he isnt a good player? then feel bad for CP3, Patrick Ewing, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, etc, etc.

If you did your homework and read this post I have said multiple times he is a GREAT player. I also said he isn't going to lead a team to a championship. Nobody denies his talent. Anyone can post random utube clips of a player making a good play. I can throw pics of Turk making amazing plays too. Or anyone else for that matter. But Westbrook is a chucker and will never lead a team to a championship unless the right coach gets a hold of him.

[tiderulz]

I am not sure why so many people are high on Westbrook, but just in case you forgot!

Spoiler:

yeah, he isnt good at all and is stopped all the time by defenders..in case you forgot

Yea keep telling yourself that.

He certainly is a scoring threat when he has a hot hand as any volume scorer can be, however he is not imo a high IQ player that will make the difference in major playoff games.
Look at Tony Parker and how he runs the show. He does not need to drop 40 to carry his team, but knows how to effectively break down the defense and exploit the weak side to keep that SA offense efficient.
And sure you can point a finger at Scott Brooks but at the end of the day the floor general makes it happen on the court.

i agree. Maybe if OKC had players that were running offensive play sets instead of standing around, Westbrook could play more like Parker. And he made a different in major playoff games just a few months ago. He was the reason they won quite a few games, both offensively and defensively. SA also has players that know their role and fill it and great passing bigs. That makes a PG's job a lot easier.

[tiderulz]

Too bad none of them are for championships......

meaning what? he isnt a good player? then feel bad for CP3, Patrick Ewing, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, etc, etc.

If you did your homework and read this post I have said multiple times he is a GREAT player. I also said he isn't going to lead a team to a championship. Nobody denies his talent. Anyone can post random utube clips of a player making a good play. I can throw pics of Turk making amazing plays too. Or anyone else for that matter. But Westbrook is a chucker and will never lead a team to a championship unless the right coach gets a hold of him.

yes, anyone can post random youtube clips of a good play, just like anyone can post clips of a player making a bad play. And that was all that i did. I didnt say he was this superstar that would lead anyone to the promised land. He makes some incredible boneheaded decisions. But my post was in response to Majortom wondering why people were high on WB, basically doing what you say no one "denies his talent". that is all, nothing about him being or not being a chucker.