T&T: Orlando early offseason in review (HW/bondom34/dbrandon/Smitty731/HowardMass)

[PennytoShaq]

I've never seen Gordon look very slow. Have any video examples of this? He defends 3s incredibly well away from the rim.

[Xatticus]

While The Magic want to make the playoffs, this year is to see who is going to stick around.

Gordon's jump shot is improving and better than many think. I am also not sure Ibaka gets max money but trades involving anyone but maybe Gordon and Hezonja are fair game.

It's going to be interesting to see how things shape up and who emerges and who goes.

I very much agree with this. For all of the changes, this team is only going to go as far as our young talents take us. Ibaka, Vucevic, and Fournier aren't going to take this (or any team) very far up the standings. These are complementary players with severe flaws in their games that will preclude them from ever becoming two-way stars. We keep talking about how we have enhanced the fit of our roster, and how that will pay dividends next year. But from my perspective, you never really have to worry about fit when you have a roster full of players without major weaknesses. Everyone wants to see some validation of Hennigan's competence, but next year is all about seeing development from Gordon, Hezonja, and Payton, regardless of where we end up in the standings.

[Xatticus]

I've never seen Gordon look very slow. Have any video examples of this? He defends 3s incredibly well away from the rim.

No. And I'm not going to go digging through old games to create a montage of it. I saw him get blown by numerous times though. He looked great defending against stationary players like Nowitzki, as he is one of the few players in the NBA with the tools to bother him, but his on-the-ball defense in face-up situations leaves a lot to be desired at present.

[PennytoShaq]

I've never seen Gordon look very slow. Have any video examples of this? He defends 3s incredibly well away from the rim.

No. And I'm not going to go digging through old games to create a montage of it. I saw him get blown by numerous times though. He looked great defending against stationary players like Nowitzki, as he is one of the few players in the NBA with the tools to bother him, but his on-the-ball defense in face-up situations leaves a lot to be desired at present.

Yeah, not seeing that. 100% disagree.

[PennytoShaq]

We keep talking about how we have enhanced the fit of our roster, and how that will pay dividends next year. But from my perspective, you never really have to worry about fit when you have a roster full of players without major weaknesses. .

No team in the NBA has that though. We have to be realistic. But yeah, the team still needs some answers.

[Blue_and_Whte]

All of a sudden OKC fans know Oladipo better than we do!

I guess watching a 5 minute highlight video makes you more knowledgable than someone that's watched him every game for years.

That's fine though.. I expect fans to back up the moves their team makes..

Uh yea... Magic fans. Despite 7 years of data Ibaka is a wizard in the post. Biyombo who might be better coordinated if they replaced his hands with beach balls is "not that bad offensively". You're absolutely right.

[Xatticus]

All of a sudden OKC fans know Oladipo better than we do!

I guess watching a 5 minute highlight video makes you more knowledgable than someone that's watched him every game for years.

That's fine though.. I expect fans to back up the moves their team makes..

Uh yea... Magic fans. Despite 7 years of data Ibaka is a wizard in the post. Biyombo who might be better coordinated if they replaced his hands with beach balls is "not that bad offensively". You're absolutely right.

I agree with you completely about Ibaka, but I really believe Payton and Biyombo can only help each other offensively.

[wise1-2]

I've never seen Gordon look very slow. Have any video examples of this? He defends 3s incredibly well away from the rim.

No. And I'm not going to go digging through old games to create a montage of it. I saw him get blown by numerous times though. He looked great defending against stationary players like Nowitzki, as he is one of the few players in the NBA with the tools to bother him, but his on-the-ball defense in face-up situations leaves a lot to be desired at present.

Gordon just needs experience defending the perimeter. I wish I can pull up footage of when Gordon switched on Isaiah Thomas on one possession this past season. The speed that Gordon showed on that possession was jaw dropping. Isaiah still drew the foul, but Gordon's quickness was obvious and very impressive. If anyone knows what play I'm talking about, let me know.

[MagicStarwipe]

I've seen Gordon get blown by, but more often I've seen him show some of the most insane lateral quickness around.

[tiderulz]

While The Magic want to make the playoffs, this year is to see who is going to stick around.

Gordon's jump shot is improving and better than many think. I am also not sure Ibaka gets max money but trades involving anyone but maybe Gordon and Hezonja are fair game.

It's going to be interesting to see how things shape up and who emerges and who goes.

I very much agree with this. For all of the changes, this team is only going to go as far as our young talents take us. Ibaka, Vucevic, and Fournier aren't going to take this (or any team) very far up the standings. These are complementary players with severe flaws in their games that will preclude them from ever becoming two-way stars. We keep talking about how we have enhanced the fit of our roster, and how that will pay dividends next year. But from my perspective, you never really have to worry about fit when you have a roster full of players without major weaknesses. Everyone wants to see some validation of Hennigan's competence, but next year is all about seeing development from Gordon, Hezonja, and Payton, regardless of where we end up in the standings.

well how many 2-way stars are there out there? Curry is a league MVP, but he isnt a 2-way star. Neither is Durant. just to use 2 as an example. Now they are offensive stars but not 2-way stars

[tiderulz]

All of a sudden OKC fans know Oladipo better than we do!

I guess watching a 5 minute highlight video makes you more knowledgable than someone that's watched him every game for years.

That's fine though.. I expect fans to back up the moves their team makes..

Uh yea... Magic fans. Despite 7 years of data Ibaka is a wizard in the post. Biyombo who might be better coordinated if they replaced his hands with beach balls is "not that bad offensively". You're absolutely right.

i havent heard anyone call Ibaka a wizard in the post. I must have missed a thread. I do think he can be about 15-16 ppg with a bit more involvement than he was getting in OKC the past couple of years as they worked Steven Adams in more. I more want to see his defensive instincts and movement back from the days when he was single-handidly shutting down San Antonio.

[Blue_and_Whte]

All of a sudden OKC fans know Oladipo better than we do!

I guess watching a 5 minute highlight video makes you more knowledgable than someone that's watched him every game for years.

That's fine though.. I expect fans to back up the moves their team makes..

Uh yea... Magic fans. Despite 7 years of data Ibaka is a wizard in the post. Biyombo who might be better coordinated if they replaced his hands with beach balls is "not that bad offensively". You're absolutely right.

I agree with you completely about Ibaka, but I really believe Payton and Biyombo can only help each other offensively.

I don't see two of the worst offensive players on our team helping each other offensively but I hope they do.

i havent heard anyone call Ibaka a wizard in the post. I must have missed a thread. I do think he can be about 15-16 ppg with a bit more involvement than he was getting in OKC the past couple of years as they worked Steven Adams in more. I more want to see his defensive instincts and movement back from the days when he was single-handidly shutting down San Antonio.

You've been around here long enough to know exactly what I mean. We signed/traded for them so now all of their flaws are no longer flaws, just like how Oladipo has suddenly become this horrible player who contributed nothing.

[wise1-2]

So just to keep you updated. Now Oladipo and Payton are a better fit that Payton and Fournier. Also, Payton-Oladipo-Harris-Gordon-Vucevic were a great offensive line up capable no matter how many minutes you give them and who you're playing. Apparently, you don't need spacing in the NBA anymore. Its overrated.
viewtopic.php?p=48986614#p48986614

Also I wanted to post this here:

Wins:
-Oladipo: 14-5-4 TS% 53
-Payton: 11.6-7-4 TS% 51

Loss:
-Oladipo: 17.5-5-4 TS%53
-Payton: 10-3.4-6 TS%45

[SOUL]

T&T is sort of cliquey and get mad if you defend your team, but are woefully ignorant to the fact that they don't watch every single game of our team like most of our fanbase does.

It doesn't mean that they can't actually dissect our team, but some of their regular posters want to sound right more than actually learn about the team they're discussing. That's where I have a problem with threads on there.

Of course, some of our fans could tone it down a bit with homerism. Don't think that's singular to our fans though.

[wise1-2]

T&T is sort of cliquey and get mad if you defend your team, but are woefully ignorant to the fact that they don't watch every single game of our team like most of our fanbase does.

It doesn't mean that they can't actually dissect our team, but some of their regular posters want to sound right more than actually learn about the team they're discussing. That's where I have a problem with threads on there.

Of course, some of our fans could tone it down a bit with homerism. Don't think that's singular to our fans though.

They all gang up and act like they know better than you. It becomes so hard to get through to anyone.
"A person is smart. People are dumb..."- Agent K

[Blue_and_Whte]

T&T is sort of cliquey and get mad if you defend your team, but are woefully ignorant to the fact that they don't watch every single game of our team like most of our fanbase does.

It doesn't mean that they can't actually dissect our team, but some of their regular posters want to sound right more than actually learn about the team they're discussing. That's where I have a problem with threads on there.

Of course, some of our fans could tone it down a bit with homerism. Don't think that's singular to our fans though.

They all gang up and act like they know better than you. It becomes so hard to get through to anyone.
"A person is smart. People are dumb..."- Agent K

While I agree I also feel like its hard to get a grasp on what we're doing and what our season will look like with some many variables in place. Obviously there are those who are extreme on one end or the other but It doesn't surprise me that people are being conservative because we're such a hard team to predict.

[Skin]

T&T is sort of cliquey and get mad if you defend your team, but are woefully ignorant to the fact that they don't watch every single game of our team like most of our fanbase does.

It doesn't mean that they can't actually dissect our team, but some of their regular posters want to sound right more than actually learn about the team they're discussing. That's where I have a problem with threads on there.

Of course, some of our fans could tone it down a bit with homerism. Don't think that's singular to our fans though.

They all gang up and act like they know better than you. It becomes so hard to get through to anyone.
"A person is smart. People are dumb..."- Agent K

While I agree I also feel like its hard to get a grasp on what we're doing and what our season will look like with some many variables in place. Obviously there are those who are extreme on one end or the other but It doesn't surprise me that people are being conservative because we're such a hard team to predict.

I just look at it as they are trying to develop stars out of our young players. So they tried to add players that would compliment them, address some of our weaknesses and put together a team that can take another step forward.

[j-ragg]

Bunch of people who haven't seen Gordon since his pre-draft highlights...

"Gordon is way better as a 4 he can't shoot or handle the ball or make a play. What is Orlando doing?!"