Payton to Gordon Dunkfest Compilation

[Xatticus]

Love the hype but that table with turnovers vs assists table is ridiculous... Its not even assists PER turnover they are tracking, this is just assists per game. Pointless stat. Of course the players closest to the cutoff (6 assists) are going to have the least turnovers as well. And conversely, of course the guys who dish out 10+ assists are going to have more turnovers. This just seems like a stat made up to make Elf look good...

Gotta be assists PER turnover or theres no point.

You're absolutely right in that criticism, but Payton's AST/TOV ratio is really good regardless.

[MagicStarwipe]

So... cool video, right guys?

[pepe1991]

And all that translated into....19 Ls in 26 games....If you look at Nets 2016-17 stats you will figure good Lin, Lopez ,Bogdanovic individual numbers , does that mean they are great ? No, Magic are just terrible team so somebody has to put up some stats because game still lasts 48 min and they are NBA players so somebody will get hot from time to time.

Gordon is young but that doesn't change fact that he is still just a role player who can't create any offene for himself.
Payton did have nice post allstar break streak but it still doesn't change a fact that he is medicore defender and non shooting PG in shooting era. Together they kill floor spacing.
That doesn't mean that VUčević and Evan are good. I would trade all but Gordon tbh. Gordon at least plays defense and with right players around him can be solid starter. I'm not sure that any other Magic starter is NBA level starter on playoff team.

Well he asked why they should stay on the team and inferred that they haven't shown much. I'm putting into context what they've shown relative to their age and opportunity, and it has been good. Nothing world beating, but solid. If we're going to criticize them for not carrying the team (despite having lesser roles pre Ibaka) then the same criticism should be thrown at KAT and Wiggins or Porzingis or whoever. The fact of the matter is the whole team is going to have to play for each other if they want to start building a winning culture here.

Actually Wiggins is facing lot of criticism. He is not "traditional" bust but he is underwhelming in first overall pick -type category. He was hyped as new Lebron, but after 2 yeras of NBA he gained grand total of 4 pounds. His rebounding rate is pathetic. Flat out pathetic. When Steph Curry, 6'3 PG has higher rebounding rate than 6'8 uberathletic wing you know he sucks at it.
Unlike Gordon and Payton, both KAT and Zingis only had two seasons to prove themselfs, and they both proved already to be future allstar level players. Actually you can make strong argument that KAT should have been allstar this year, just based on his offensive dominance ( despite suckin on defense ). That kid, being just 21 years old is averaging 25 ppg ,12 rpg for a season.

Blaming him for team Ls would be silly because you saw enough times him actually taking over games. In March they beat : Jazz, Warriors, Wizards, Clippers and Pacers. He averaged over 28ppg in that games ( with 39 points against Wizards ) .

About trades, if Gordon is next year same player as he was this year, i don't see much reason why he shouldn't be moved if right offer pops out before the end of 2017-18 season. Right now he is young and he showed some starting level player-promise. But if he will cost $20M per year after his extension- goodby .

[Gomagic44]

So... cool video, right guys?

I thought we were sourpuss'..

[shadrock]

But that's your opinion, it's not a fact. Just like my opinion of them still having way more to show is an opinion as well. You're betting on the fact that Aaron and Payton will be nothing but role players in the NBA at the ages of 21 and 23. I think they've shown considerable improvement (once Aaron moved to PF) and are on the right track for their ages relative to what I think their ceilings are.

I've never said my opinions were fact. I'm just observing what I see and responding to what you're saying. If you believe that's how I convey responses then you might have doubts in what you're saying.

Yeah, I'm not accusing you of saying your opinions are fact, it just comes off as if their isn't even an option of them becoming more than role players -- it's just how it reads, might not be what you intend.

Love the hype but that table vs assists table is ridiculous... Its not even assists PER turnover they are tracking, this is just assists per game. Pointless stat. Of course the players closest to the cutoff (6 assists) are going to have the least turnovers as well. And conversely, of course the guys who dish out 10+ assists are going to have more turnovers. This just seems like a stat made up to make Elf look good...

Gotta be assists PER turnover or theres no point.

True, but it's just meant to highlight that he is a low turnover player in general which is what you want in a PG. Assist to turnover ratio is a way better way of tracking that sort of thing, but even that is sort of misleading. He was a 5 assist sort of guy when he was sharing it with Fournier and damn near close to 10 when he wasn't.

Using the logic of this table, CJ Watson is even better than Elfrid, because he only has .8 turnovers per game.