The Sixerfan1976 Off-Season Thread (Update: Page 61)

[sixerswillrule]

Look.. with all due respect nobody here works for the Sixer front office. For example was the Dalembert trade everything you expected in return??? I don't think anybody here including myself has ever predicted a perfect trade scenario that has actually happened. With that said I hope like hell the filler mentioned is not Jared Jeffries but rather someone else we can use.

Based on SF constantly saying over the past few months that we're not looking to trade Iguodala, yeah I would except them to want a significant amount of value along with Ariza.

How much is Iguodala going to be missed if Ariza was to come here, shoot well from outside, average a respectable 13-14 ppg as a starter or off the bench, and defend equally as well as Iguodala can? I"m not going to start an entirely new topic of who the better defender is but Ariza is not too shabby of a defender at all.

I'll repeat what I said earlier:

Iguodala can do everything that Ariza does but so much more. You could argue that we have no need for all of those extra things that Iguodala can provide (I don't agree), but no way would that mean that we should trade him for the far inferior player without getting the necessary incentive in return. Which to me would be Jordan Hill and a 1st.

[Slacktard]

Mid 1980's, remember how we all adored former 76ers mascot Big Shot....sigh

Man Big Shot looked like a reject from Fraggle Rock that did crack, but I'd take him 100000x over Hip Hop. I'd give a standing ovation if all of a sudden Big Shot came out on the floor and knocked the crap out of that bunny

[The76thDegree]

I wouldnt be adverse to taking on Jefferies - Hes a big body who can come off the bench and provide some defense - plus his contract is expiring

Hill,Ariza, Jefferies for Iggy, Willie

http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.ph ... id=5615020

[PhenomThad31]

Hill and Speights/Hawes doesn't work way to soft.

I do like they Hayes, Ariza for Iguodala deal though. Ariza is a much better fit on our roster he is a glue guy that is just fine being the 3rd or even 4th fiddle, I don't think Iguodala will be able to concede being the number 1 option on the team to a rookie.

[agiaco]

Hill and Speights/Hawes doesn't work way to soft.

I do like they Hayes, Ariza for Iguodala deal though. Ariza is a much better fit on our roster he is a glue guy that is just fine being the 3rd or even 4th fiddle, I don't think Iguodala will be able to concede being the number 1 option on the team to a rookie.

I don't see how losing talent in a trade is better for our roster. Iguodala is a good fit here and he can adapt to being a 2nd or third option. People are devaluing him so much it's crazy. I know he's not a superstar, but he's a rare breed of player that brings almost everything to the table.

[The76thDegree]

Hill and Speights/Hawes doesn't work way to soft.

I do like they Hayes, Ariza for Iguodala deal though. Ariza is a much better fit on our roster he is a glue guy that is just fine being the 3rd or even 4th fiddle, I don't think Iguodala will be able to concede being the number 1 option on the team to a rookie.

I don't see how losing talent in a trade is better for our roster. Iguodala is a good fit here and he can adapt to being a 2nd or third option. People are devaluing him so much it's crazy. I know he's not a superstar, but he's a rare breed of player that brings almost everything to the table.

We would be losing defined talent yes for the possibility of greater talent - and I wouldnt consider Iggy a "rare breed" sorry

[KrazySixersD]

ariza and hayes for iguodala is HORRIBLE for us... hayes played 20 min a game... if he was such a good defender he would have got way more play than that... come on guys... chuck hayes??

[PhenomThad31]

Hill and Speights/Hawes doesn't work way to soft.

I do like they Hayes, Ariza for Iguodala deal though. Ariza is a much better fit on our roster he is a glue guy that is just fine being the 3rd or even 4th fiddle, I don't think Iguodala will be able to concede being the number 1 option on the team to a rookie.

I don't see how losing talent in a trade is better for our roster. Iguodala is a good fit here and he can adapt to being a 2nd or third option. People are devaluing him so much it's crazy. I know he's not a superstar, but he's a rare breed of player that brings almost everything to the table.

On paper it without a doubt doesn't help our roster but Ariza is much better fit on the court. Over the last 2 years Ariza took on average 3 shots less per game than Iguodala, that is more looks for Turner and Jrue and more room for them to develop. IMO Iguodala's value will have a big drop off being bumped to option 2a on offense and his contract will never be as easy to move as it is now in the offseason, Ariza has an extremely reasonable contract. Look at the contracts that Outlaw and Reddick just got, Ariza is a much better player and making roughly the same change.

[Foshan]

I don't see us moving Iggy. If we did, I would think it would have to be for value/prospects, not in some sort of dump.

I'd do

Iggy / Green
4
Ariza / Jeffries / Hill / 1st / Rights to Lull

And then I'd try to ship Ariza to a 3rd team for value of some sort coming back to us (maybe Por for Rudy/1st/filler)

Hill is a long shot prospect, so far a total lottery bust.
Hou 1st isn't going to be worth much, even with a NY swap with Amare they are in the playoffs.
Lull who knows if he translates.

I don't think thats too much to ask for in an Iggy deal, if it is, we're much better off keeping him.

[ZarcMumoff]

Like I said before...

Iguodala and Green

for

Ariza, Jeffries, Taylor, and a 1st Round Pick/Hill

[Sandalf42]

Hill and Speights/Hawes doesn't work way to soft.

I do like they Hayes, Ariza for Iguodala deal though. Ariza is a much better fit on our roster he is a glue guy that is just fine being the 3rd or even 4th fiddle, I don't think Iguodala will be able to concede being the number 1 option on the team to a rookie.

I don't see how losing talent in a trade is better for our roster. Iguodala is a good fit here and he can adapt to being a 2nd or third option. People are devaluing him so much it's crazy. I know he's not a superstar, but he's a rare breed of player that brings almost everything to the table.

We would be losing defined talent yes for the possibility of greater talent - and I wouldnt consider Iggy a "rare breed" sorry

Yea, because lots of players have his combination of athleticism, scoring ability, and defense .

Ariza would be great to have on the team. He's a great glue guy that every championship team needs. But he's not worth Iggy. Iggy is just... better. It's that simple. And Chuck Hayes?? Everyone on this board seems to think he has value as a defender, but really, he's a scrub. I guess I'd like to have him to round out the bench, but I'm not trading Iggy for him.

When you have a team like the Sixers, I think it's important you should always be looking into "more talent" instead of "better fit". The NBA is all about having the most talent now, and trading Iggy for 2 or 3 players that are clearly worse than him is not the way to go.

[Bring Back 1983]

Aren't the Rockets under the salary cap? A good chunk of the discussion here seems to be premised on the idea that we need to have a near-equal exchange of salaries, which I don't think is the case. That allows for some creativity if there is a need for a third team to get involved. I just wish we would stop being offered other SFs for Iguodala since our goal is to get size to begin with (unless that SF adds a nice perimeter dimension and can play defense).

And not that it means anything, but columnist Bob Cooney said in his online chat today that chances were "better than average" that Iggy gets traded.

[radrmd216]

I have been talking about a Sixers-Houston trade for a couple weeks now. I like Patterson, but Hill is still a decent prospect. I was thinking Ariza, Hill, and a 1st or maybe Patterson and a 2nd. It was reported before that Morey liked Iggy.

When I was talking about this trade before some people said Ariza's numbers make it seem like it game got better, but his game actually regressed. I think Ariza can fit, but I don't know if we get the efficient Lakers Ariza.

TK, I was thinking Iggy's value would peak this year and go down for the duration of his contract, but other players haven't gotten worse deals and the CBA might not be that bad. Do you think even with the best case scenario CBA Iggy's value still peaks this summer?

[The Guilty Party]

I don't see how losing talent in a trade is better for our roster. Iguodala is a good fit here and he can adapt to being a 2nd or third option. People are devaluing him so much it's crazy. I know he's not a superstar, but he's a rare breed of player that brings almost everything to the table.

Agreed. I think that what's happening is fans are so anxious to change this roster and add new talent that they want to move Iguodala just to get some new pieces in here. I sometimes get caught up in that but in the big picture of things, I believe Iguodala will have more value as we get closer to his prime and his contract becomes even more attractive in terms of years left.

Right now, we have a lot of pieces to a puzzle but only one or two corner pieces. I think Iguodala can get us another corner piece down the road and so I'd rather wait than just move him now so that we can obtain some more new pieces that might not be a long-term fit.

**Also, in reference to the CBA... we really don't know what is going to happen. A couple of months ago, it looked like the cap for this year was going to drop by about eight million and that salaries were eventually going to new to come down hence making Iguodala's deal look really bad. Now, the cap didn't even drop as it held at $58MIL and a lot of contracts were handed out that make Iguodala look like a bargain. If the new CBA calls for a drop to salaries then I'm sure Iguodala will still have decent value because an overwhelming majority of players are still going to be carrying contracts over from the deal that's currently in place. Point being, I don't anticipate Iguodala's market value to dry up unless he has a bad year.

[cheolee]

I am a HOU fan and can offer you a perspective from our side:

IMHO Ariza is about 80% of what Iggy offers in terms of skill and talent at 1/2 the price.
He is young, athletic, a much better long range shooter (when his feet are set), is a + defender, and plays well off the ball. He also has some upside left to his game which is not to be counted on, but an additional perk.
If these are the qualities that you are looking for in return for Iggy, then I think that it would be a good starting point.

If you do like him and want to move forward, we all know that Ariza is not as good as Iggy. So, the disparity in trade value can be bridged by several options.

Houston's assets that they are willing to give up imo are: (listed based on value top to bottom)

1. NY or HOU pick.
2. J. Hill (#8 pick, long, athletic, mobile 4)
3. J. Taylor (think a more explosive and younger Willie)
4. Jeffries (~7mil expiring contract, versatile defender)


Let me know if you have any comments or questions. I am certainly not the voice of HOU but I can probably give you better insight to what goes on in our camp.

You might get a combo of 1-2 out of the 4 assets they are willing to part with but nothing more.

[tk76]

TK, I was thinking Iggy's value would peak this year and go down for the duration of his contract, but other players haven't gotten worse deals and the CBA might not be that bad. Do you think even with the best case scenario CBA Iggy's value still peaks this summer?

Tough question. I think there a lot more trading partners right now. And trading him now makes his average yearly salary seem better. But maybe at the deadline a contender might be more motivated to add him as the final piece than they would be right now. But IMO contenders don't tend to give you much back in deadline deals (other than expirings), while right now there are a number of squads with cap space and young talent that might make a deal.

I still would push for Aminu + DeAndre Jordan.

I think Jrue(20)/Turner(22)/Thad(22)/Aminu(19)/Jordan(22) makes for an intriguing athletic line-up down the road. And Lou/Speights/Hawes would fill in nicely as complementary pieces that allow Collins to go big, small, fast or slow based on match-ups.

Not saying that projects as a contender in the future- just a nice mix of complementary young pieces to use as a foundation and then go up from there.

[agiaco]

3. J. Taylor (think a more explosive and younger Willie)

this is everything I ever wanted

[bdownbear]

TK, I was thinking Iggy's value would peak this year and go down for the duration of his contract, but other players haven't gotten worse deals and the CBA might not be that bad. Do you think even with the best case scenario CBA Iggy's value still peaks this summer?

Tough question. I think there a lot more trading partners right now. And trading him now makes his average yearly salary seem better. But maybe at the deadline a contender might be more motivated to add him as the final piece than they would be right now. But IMO contenders don't tend to give you much back in deadline deals (other than expirings), while right now there are a number of squads with cap space and young talent that might make a deal.

I still would push for Aminu + DeAndre Jordan.

I think Jrue(20)/Turner(22)/Thad(22)/Aminu(19)/Jordan(22) makes for an intriguing athletic line-up down the road. And Lou/Speights/Hawes would fill in nicely as complementary pieces that allow Collins to go big, small, fast or slow based on match-ups.

Not saying that projects as a contender in the future- just a nice mix of complementary young pieces to use as a foundation and then go up from there.

I would love that rotation. Some how Meeks got to be squeezed in too.

[tk76]

It actually reminds me a lot of Atlanta's lineup (or at least it could develop into something like it.) You have both good athletes and good defenders. You have a PG with size who can shoot and a great SG. I really am intrigued to see if Thad and Aminu could develop as a versatile tandem. they could switch freely and are both elite on the break.

Jrue - Bibby
Turner - JJ
Thad - Marvin Willians
Aminu - Josh Smith
Jordan - Horford (both athletic defenders)

Lou - Crawford (scorers without defense or a conscience)
But Speights/Hawes/Meeks are better than Atl's remaining reserves.

[Arsenal]

I'd seriously consider Ariza, Jefferies, and their pick, along with the rights to switch picks with NYK for Iguodala and filler (e.g. Green or Smith). We get a guy who does much of what Iguodala does at a much lower price, more cap space next offseason, and a chance for another lottery pick depending on how NYK does next season.