General 76ers Thread

[TrustTheProcess]

McRae signing a camp deal and not making the team wouldn't be a big deal to me. Tokoto would be more upsetting because he is younger and raw and a more ideal draft and stash guy. But as Hartford says, if I'm him, I'd try to force my way into training camp as well. You can talk to 30 teams vs 1 if you're cut, plus the Sixers are usually pretty generous with guarantees and are probably more likely to keep you for the league min if you do force your way onto the team.

Your track record on this site is incredible... are you a hack? lol teach me your ways.

[joyeuxnoel]

zach lowe and Amin Elhassan on general sixers talk and mostly on sixers plan

starts around 15 minutes i think: http://grantland.com/the-triangle/the-lowe-post-podcast-amin-elhassan-on-dante-exum-and-the-jazz-the-sixers-and-other-intriguing-teams/

-elhassan stated that jazz tanking to get exum was ok since it was just 1 year, not multiple like in philly. that general fans are not against tanking if its just 1 year. gave other examples like GS with barnes, portland with lillard

-elhassan says sixers have bad culture, because culture is set by the players. Sixers have a revolving door. Says culture is built brick
by brick in the beginning so even if the sixers end up being good, the culture will not change (lol). also says that eventually the sixers owners will run out of patience

zach lowe and says that the sixers owners are some of the most patient owners in nba history. talks about how they were sniffing around signing leonard and butler.

-elhassan says plan rests on embiid's injury and dario saric's buyout and how he might stay an extra year to get off the rookie scale. says only thing that doesnt go up with salary cap going up is rookie scale and minimum guys so this could be huge. so dario can either sign at 2014 prices or 2016 prices if he stays 1 more year.

zach lowe says sixers dont really care when saric comes in because they only care about accumulating assets. says how hard it is to get out of treadmill like hornets and bucks

lowe says should give sixers credit for picking a strategy that has highest probability to getting a superstar and contending team.

elhassan says its still a low chance since you still have to hit on your picks and that hinkie's plan has low flexibility and that
it will most likely fail. says being purposely awful is going too far. no culture in philadelphia

lowe says philly is learning how to play hard, how to take care of their bodies, etc from brett brown but then again most of those guys wont be there in 2 years

elhassan says philly has no guy to look up to, no leadership. says every team that is going somewhere has a player whose a leader. sixers dont have that.

zach lowe says philly has some flexibility. a lot of draft picks that they can trade for a disgruntled superstar, but that its rare and that the contracts are short and you'd have to make sure the superstar is a RFA.

elhassan says harden came from a strong culture after going to houston so he brought some culture to houston.

elhassan says sixers 1-2 assets, no established star free agent would go there because other teams can offer the max and have an established culture and good players.

zach lowe says teams that built without tanking: houston, memphis (but it took them a long time), pacers (but they fell apart), hawks (but al horford and marvin willaims were middle picks). says its very hard to build from the middle.

[MRxBLACK]

Elhassan sounds like a moron.

[Sixerscan]

Talking authoritatively about culture without any personal knowledge of the culture and just assuming that is what is going on (Rather than a lack of talent/BBIQ) is pretty much the definition of media driven narrative BS.

Don't get me wrong, it's fine to propose that that might be an issue. But to act like it's absolutely a problem is pretty ridiculous unless you are in that locker room.

[Eyeamok]

Culture is not established by the players it is established from the top down.

Basketball is a business, any successful business that has a good culture, did not hire an employee that brought the culture with them, they were hired because they could fit into the existing culture or the culture they (business owner and management) were/are trying to develop.

For example it is well documented that when Jeff Bezos started Amazon, he had a hand in hiring everyone from a secretary to management personnel. Why because he was looking for certain individuals that would become part of the culture and then pass that culture on to the next person in the team, and so on, leaving him and other higher ups free to do other important things.

That is one of the main ways how culture is formed in teams and business.

[Stanford]

Elhassan sounds like a moron.

He's all over the place. There's no thread running through any of his arguments.

I thought he was tolerable in the Lowe podcast. He had enough time to air out the reactionary stuff and make some concessions. He still did a poor job of explaining wtf he's talking about though.

[joyeuxnoel]

agree that elhassan was all over the place, went on so many different tangents without fully describing each one

his main point was you need a set culture in place to make a contender. and that the front office and management don't set the culture, its ultimately up to the players to do so. and that with the sixers rotating guys in and out every year, that no stable culture is built upon

zach lowe's main point that you can't criticize the bobcats of the world for remaining in mediocrity then bash the sixers for trying something new and that has the highest probability of becoming a contender.

[Sixerscan]

agree that elhassan was all over the place, went on so many different tangents without fully describing each one

his main point was you need a set culture in place to make a contender. and that the front office and management don't set the culture, its ultimately up to the players to do so. and that with the sixers rotating guys in and out every year, that no stable culture is built upon

zach lowe's main point that you can't criticize the bobcats of the world for remaining in mediocrity then bash the sixers for trying something new and that has the highest probability of becoming a contender.

I don't think anyone really disagrees with that. The questions about that though are:

1. How long does putting that culture together really take?
2. How much worse off is Nerlens than he would be if we had a stable culture right now?
3. Is that worth the difference between Okafor/our 2016 pick (Plus guys like Covington that got opportunities here they couldn't get anywhere else in the league) versus whoever we would have taken with later picks if we'd had the stable culture right now?

My answers to those questions would be 1. A year? (Maybe less) 2. He'd be maybe 5% better if he were on a team like the Celtics 3. Absolutely not.

We can debate over the answers to those questions, but without addressing them, it's kind of an incomplete debate.

[76ciology]

I don't get it why people complain on the petty things and not understand how our rebuilding process is quite efficient in getting the volume of assets in such limited time.

Jazz has been a lotto team for more than 5 years. We've only been rebuilding for like 2 seasons only. And truth be told, I think Sixers and the Jazz will make the play-offs at relatively the same time (2017 or 2018 play-offs). I also think that by next year considering our 2016 picks and cap space, we're projected to be at par or have more talent than the Jazz.

With regards to culture. I can't see how we have a losing culture. Losing image, yes. But culture? ALL OUR GUYS have improved. Hell, even Furkan is shooting threes now. And ALL OUR GUYS have been playing hard every game.

[marcush]

Yeh, I understand the hot takes about culture, vets, leadership etc and personally I would like them to bring in a decent vet PG to run he show to a certain extent. But the big thing the Sixers have always got counter this point, is that they always play hard. This is something almost always brought up and yet it doesn't gel with the bad culture theory.

Are they at increased risk of getting a bad culture, due to having no vets? I think yes. But culture is such a minor issue in comparison to the obvious offensive talent deficiency which Hinkie has orchestrated.

[bryanwithawhy]

The idea that the Sixers need vets to show the young players how to be professionals is ridiculous. I am sure Hinkie has gathered tons of information in terms of qualitative stuff like this. He clearly doesn't think it helps. Also, getting a vet to come to the Sixers is adverse selection. The only kind of vets that will want to sign a contract with the Sixers (at this point in their rebuild!) are vets that aren't good anymore or are cancers to their teams. The vet needs to be one of the top players on the team for his words to carry any weight. Also, that vet is coming at a cost -- minutes that could go to a younger player, increased wins w/o future upside and salary cap space that could be used to absorb a bad contract (w/ a draft pick included).

Listen to how Kyle Lowry talks about Hinkie. He clearly understands the human side of basketball. The emotional side of it. He digs into that stuff like none other. I completely trust everything he has done so far. If we don't win a championship within 10 years Hinkie will have had quite a bit of bad luck. Because he is as sharp as it gets in the NBA.

[leorautins]

Yeh, I understand the hot takes about culture, vets, leadership etc and personally I would like them to bring in a decent vet PG to run he show to a certain extent. But the big thing the Sixers have always got counter this point, is that they always play hard. This is something almost always brought up and yet it doesn't gel with the bad culture theory.

Are they at increased risk of getting a bad culture, due to having no vets? I think yes. But culture is such a minor issue in comparison to the obvious offensive talent deficiency which Hinkie has orchestrated.

I agree that any editorial around the team having a bad culture is ill-informed at best. I don't know that "they work hard" is the best defense against the notion however. It's hard to quantify and rank hard work. I'd assume every team works hard - can we definitively say the sixers are better than average in this regard? Also - the motivation for working hard may not be culture-based, but rather a player trying to take advantage of his minutes to find gainful employment here or elsewhere.

[marcush]

Yeh, I understand the hot takes about culture, vets, leadership etc and personally I would like them to bring in a decent vet PG to run he show to a certain extent. But the big thing the Sixers have always got counter this point, is that they always play hard. This is something almost always brought up and yet it doesn't gel with the bad culture theory.

Are they at increased risk of getting a bad culture, due to having no vets? I think yes. But culture is such a minor issue in comparison to the obvious offensive talent deficiency which Hinkie has orchestrated.

I agree that any editorial around the team having a bad culture is ill-informed at best. I don't know that "they work hard" is the best defense against the notion however. It's hard to quantify and rank hard work. I'd assume every team works hard - can we definitively say the sixers are better than average in this regard? Also - the motivation for working hard may not be culture-based, but rather a player trying to take advantage of his minutes to find gainful employment here or elsewhere.

I said they "play hard" not "work hard" and a way to quantify that would be the improved defensive efficiency last year.

[No-Man]

Why have you guys not re-sign Smith yet? without him the development of both Noel and Okafor will be threatened, Wroten and Canaan are just not smart guys, plus Wroten is coming from a really severe injury.

Smith-Stauskas-Covington-Noel-Okafor should be the starting line-up.

[MRxBLACK]

Why have you guys not re-sign Smith yet? without him the development of both Noel and Okafor will be threatened, Wroten and Canaan are just not smart guys, plus Wroten is coming from a really severe injury.

Smith-Stauskas-Covington-Noel-Okafor should be the starting line-up.

I agree with you that I would like to see him back. I guess Brown and Hinkie don't think it's a necessity to bring him back. I also agree that Wroten isn't a smart player, but if he could be a more willing passer when he penetrates the defense Noel and Oak will get easy looks. Canaan is a 5'11" shooter, has no driving or passing ability. Jackson might be fun to watch at PG if he regains his great explosiveness, he's a willing passer and good shooter.

[marcush]

Why have you guys not re-sign Smith yet? without him the development of both Noel and Okafor will be threatened, Wroten and Canaan are just not smart guys, plus Wroten is coming from a really severe injury.

Smith-Stauskas-Covington-Noel-Okafor should be the starting line-up.

Yep, they need to bring him or someone of that NBA level ilk in for development sake of our bigs. Our PG stocks are that bleak that I am really pinning my hopes on bringing Ish back.

[No-Man]

What I'd do is bring Ish back, move Wroten to back-up SG and let Canaan, Jackson and Wilbekin fight in camp for two spots.

[Phila Tough]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcyH-xlPnF8[/youtube]

Wroten is severely underrated around here. He is only one year older than some of the upcoming sophomores for this season and for some reason we fail to give him to benefit of doubt. We all agree that player development is huge with the 76ers, yet we disregard Wroten so much as if he's exempt from it. Nik shouldn't be the penciled in starter for the 2 spot, I think Wroten without a doubt deserves some consideration. Especially if he displays an improved long range shot.

Ish
Wroten
Cov
Noel
Jah

[Sixerscan]

I think you mean underrated? It's pretty tough to get excited about Wroten developing considering that he's coming off a pretty serious injury. Best case this year is probably him getting back to where he was before he got hurt. As far as the jump shot goes I'll believe it when I see it.

Until Ish signs a contract I think we can assume that he won't be on the team this year. I do think that Stauskas is potentially a perfect fit in the back court with Wroten (because he can shoot and handle the ball a little bit).

[Phila Tough]

I think you mean underrated? It's pretty tough to get excited about Wroten developing considering that he's coming off a pretty serious injury. Best case this year is probably him getting back to where he was before he got hurt. As far as the jump shot goes I'll believe it when I see it.

Until Ish signs a contract I think we can assume that he won't be on the team this year. I do think that Stauskas is potentially a perfect fit in the back court with Wroten (because he can shoot and handle the ball a little bit).

Fixed.