Top 15 players in the world?

Ted Lasso · Post #381 » by **Ted Lasso** » Sat Oct 4, 2014 9:06 am

I'm surprised Harry Kane hasn't been named here.

DD12 · Post #382 » by **DD12** » Mon Oct 6, 2014 1:43 pm

There should be a different tier right now. Its like; C. Ronaldo and others. Dude has been superb!

ardee · Post #383 » by **ardee** » Mon Oct 6, 2014 9:25 pm

DD12 wrote:There should be a different tier right now. Its like; C. Ronaldo and others. Dude has been superb!

Yeah, how anyone still thinks Messi has a case boggles the mind.

Ronaldo is having the most dominant stretch of any player in history right now. If he plays at the level he has the last 4 years for another 2 I think we could be looking at a top 5 career of all time.

No_20 · Post #384 » by **No_20** » Mon Oct 6, 2014 9:27 pm

You wont a find a athlete in better shape than Ronaldo. He could be dominant for another 4-5 years.

Ted Lasso · Post #385 » by **Ted Lasso** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 2:24 am

ardee wrote:Yeah, how anyone still thinks Messi has a case boggles the mind.

Ronaldo is having the most dominant stretch of any player in history right now. If he plays at the level he has the last 4 years for another 2 I think we could be looking at a top 5 career of all time.

In 11/12, Messi scored 64 goals and added 29 assists in 48 league and CL matches. Ronaldo has never produced superior numbers.

In fact, if you add his brilliant start to this season onto his numbers from last season (thereby identifying his best stretch ever), you get 63 goals and 22 assists in 49 league and CL matches.

http://www.transfermarkt.com/cristiano- ... ieler/8198

Man of Steel · Post #386 » by **Man of Steel** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 2:08 pm

Ted Lasso wrote:
ardee wrote:Yeah, how anyone still thinks Messi has a case boggles the mind.

Ronaldo is having the most dominant stretch of any player in history right now. If he plays at the level he has the last 4 years for another 2 I think we could be looking at a top 5 career of all time.

In 11/12, Messi scored 64 goals and added 29 assists in 48 league and CL matches. Ronaldo has never produced superior numbers.

In fact, if you add his brilliant start to this season onto his numbers from last season (thereby identifying his best stretch ever), you get 63 goals and 22 assists in 49 league and CL matches.

http://www.transfermarkt.com/cristiano- ... ieler/8198

that's 11/12 :roll:

also happens to be the season Messi won nothing but the Copa Del Rey, while Ronaldo won a record breaking La Liga (in terms of goal-scoring and points records) with Madrid. Right now Ronaldo's form is ridiculous. I'm not a betting man but I'd put money on him winning the Ballon D'Or if he keeps this pace up, regardless of what anyone else does.

Ted Lasso · Post #387 » by **Ted Lasso** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 3:08 pm

Man of Steel wrote:that's 11/12

Ronaldo is having the most dominant stretch of any player in history right now.

Is the 11/12 season not considered part of history? How can Ronaldo be having the most dominant stretch in history if another player has had an objectively demonstrably superior stretch in the same era?

Man of Steel wrote:also happens to be the season Messi won nothing but the Copa Del Rey, while Ronaldo won a record breaking La Liga (in terms of goal-scoring and points records) with Madrid.

Ahhh so it's a subjective argument about achievements which depend on tens of other people now. Thank God for that last gap Sergio Ramos header then. Otherwise Ronaldo would be looking at the same trophy cabinet in his dominant stretch. Must be nice for the argument for your personal status in your profession to be directly influenced and kept alive by another individual.

I wrote that just to point out how ridiculous this game is. I don't care one bit about whose team won what. I offered a very simple and objective refutation of a specific claim.

DD12 · Post #388 » by **DD12** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 6:57 pm

Career wise, Ronaldo is better than Messi.

Messi is a product of the system. Not proven. Never played without Iniesta, Xavi and tiki taka. Never went to another league to prove the world what he is about.

Ronaldo is an individual player. He did well at Manu. He came Real Madrid when Barcelona was at their BEST. He took the risk unlike Messi. They stopped Barcelona, beat them many times, got championships with beating them with Ronaldo.

Ronaldo is and has been the best player on earth.

TheAdmiral · Post #389 » by **TheAdmiral** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 8:09 pm

DD12 wrote:Career wise, Ronaldo is better than Messi.

Messi is a product of the system. Not proven. Never played without Iniesta, Xavi and tiki taka. Never went to another league to prove the world what he is about.

Ronaldo is an individual player. He did well at Manu. He came Real Madrid when Barcelona was at their BEST. He took the risk unlike Messi. They stopped Barcelona, beat them many times, got championships with beating them with Ronaldo.

Ronaldo is and has been the best player on earth.

Being the focal point of an offense will always be helpful, no matter who it is. Although I disagree with the notion that he's a system player, Messi has clearly benefited from playing in a very dominant system that was fine-tuned/tailor-made for him quite a few years ago. That's one of the reasons why most players who took on his role in his absence (Neymar excluded) didn't come close to doing what Messi used to do/does.

He's a great player, no doubt, and he'll go down as one of the best ever, but people tend to overrate him when comparing him to CR7 to the point it gets ridiculous, because they don't get as annoyed with him and his attitude as they do with Ronaldo. Then again, that's sports for ya, people always let their personal feelings get in the way.

DD12 · Post #390 » by **DD12** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 9:00 pm

Messi the king,

I am not sure if you know anything about football.

This is Real Madrid's XI when Cristiano Ronaldo arrived;

Casillas-Arbeloa-Ramos-Pepe-Marcelo-Diarra-Xabi-Ronaldo-Van der Vaart-Kaka-Benzema

Barcelona: Valdes-Dani Alves-Puyol-Pique-Abidal-Yaya Toure-Xavi-Iniesta-Henry-Messi-Ibrahimovic

What do you mean he didn't downgrade? What is this then? There is an uber downgrade if you compare it against Barcelona.

Even though they had this **** team, Ronaldo scored 33 goals in 35 games and kept them only 3 pts away from "prime Barcelona".

Next year, under Mourinho they had even worse squad than 09. Ronaldo scored 53 goals in 55 games.

In this era, Barcelona beat Real Madrid many times because RM was really bad, squad wasn't enough to compete against "prime Barcelona." In 2011, players came in, some adjusted the Spanish football and Real Madrid started winning against Real and they won the Spanish League.

So don't come to me with idiotic statement that Messi beat Ronaldo in his era more because RM sucked first 3 years even though they had Ronaldo.

What do you mean there was no risk???? It is prime Barcelona against him. What else could have been there? I am not even mentioning RM's awful squad.

If there was no Messi, someone else would be there. Just like Ronaldinho. He went to different club and he sucked. Same would happen to Messi and he knows it. That's why he goes nowhere because he knows he sucks without having that tiki taka system.

Man of Steel · Post #391 » by **Man of Steel** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 9:55 pm

idk why people are discussing previous seasons, I was under the impression this is about current rankings :dontknow:

And if we aren't factoring in team efforts then even before that Sergio Ramos header, Ronaldo was sitting on 16 goals in a single Champion's League campaign, a record tally that he added to in extra time.

Bernman · Post #392 » by **Bernman** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 11:02 pm

As a former attacker, this is a defense free zone:

(no order)

Ronaldo
Messi
Ibra
Bale
James
Suarez
Reus
Robben
Neymar
Costa
Iniesta
Toure
Aguero
Muller
Hazard

Hard to leave off Schurrle, but he's the guy I'll sacrifice because he's not far removed from coming off the bench. IMO he's been criminally underrated by his managers. He makes s**t happen once he steps onto the field.

Boognish · Post #393 » by **Boognish** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 11:12 pm

Keep Schurrle the **** out of this thread

Man of Steel · Post #394 » by **Man of Steel** » Tue Oct 7, 2014 11:22 pm

Get what he means about making things happen but putting him near top 15? :nonono:

I'd probably put Modric in for one of those players as well, he's starting to pick up form again

Bernman · Post #395 » by **Bernman** » Wed Oct 8, 2014 12:48 am

I think a similar opinion was held about Robben when he was around the same age and at Chelsea. Then he still had his periods coming off the bench at Bayern. So few would think about him as one of the best players in the world. But whenever he got extended stints at starter, he proved it. One of the straws that stirs his team's drink. I think of Schurrle as tantamount to a young Robben in that way. For whatever reason some managers get down on them as players for periods. Just an outside the box honorable mention. I didn't actually include him on production, even though I think he has top 15 ability and efficiency among more attack-oriented players.

Foye · Post #396 » by **Foye** » Wed Oct 8, 2014 7:16 am

Bernman wrote:I think a similar opinion was held about Robben when he was around the same age and at Chelsea. Then he still had his periods coming off the bench at Bayern. So few would think about him as one of the best players in the world. But whenever he got extended stints at starter, he proved it. One of the straws that stirs his team's drink. I think of Schurrle as tantamount to a young Robben in that way. For whatever reason some managers get down on them as players for periods. Just an outside the box honorable mention. I didn't actually include him on production, even though I think he has top 15 ability and efficiency among more attack-oriented players.

Robben coming off the bench at Bayern was because of injuries not because he couldn't find a way into the starting lineup, though.

Regarding Schürrle. I thought he would be a future world class player when he came out of our youth. However, he really hasn't improved much at Bayer Leverkusen. Good player but thats about it.

No_20 · Post #397 » by **No_20** » Wed Oct 15, 2014 2:20 pm

Ronaldo flat track bully on the National Team. I even think he's played more games against teams like Germany and Spain than Messi or Neymar have. And the latter 2 scored against them.

No_20 · Post #398 » by **No_20** » Thu Oct 23, 2014 2:17 pm

After watching Kroos and Hamez destroy Liverpool i feel their place in my Top 15 is justified.

El Turco · Post #399 » by **El Turco** » Thu Oct 23, 2014 2:42 pm

so eduardo vargas must be a top 15 player

J-Mezzy · Post #400 » by **J-Mezzy** » Tue Nov 4, 2014 5:37 pm

I wonder if/when Messi will go back to his incredible level. I kinda miss watching the little genius dominate. He seems to lack passion for the sport when he is out there. He is still great, but he seems to be going through the motions.

I am going mainly of the world cup games and the 1 or 2 games that I have been able to watch.